Please help me to read this English sentence:

[Columbine]

Originally Posted by YuriTokoro

Hi.
Could someone correct my English?


"Gaijin"

Wikipedia says that Gaijin (外人[ɡaidʑiɴ]) is a Japanese word meaning "non-Japanese", or "alien".
I have heard foreign people hate being called “gaijin”. Is that right?
I went on a trip in Japan with an American friend a few years ago. When we took a taxi, I was talking to the driver in Japanese and I said the word “gaijin” in the conversation.
My friend wasn’t able to understand Japanese. She had started studying Japanese, but she didn’t even know how to say “mother” or “father”.
However, she seemed to catch the word “gaijin”, and got upset.
Most Japanese people believe that “gaijin” means “people from foreign countries” without any further meaning. We can say “gaikokujin（外国人）” and “gaikoku kara irasshatta kata（外国からいらっしゃった方”, but the first one sounds too formal and the second one is too long to say.
Since I didn’t know my friend didn’t like to be called “gaijin”, that I was shocked to know she was angry.
I believe the definitions in Wiki are a bit wrong. The Japanese people don’t mean anything negative by the word.
I’d like to know why and how the word has become associated with a bad meaning or impression.
If you know any reasons, let me know, please.
And, what should I say instead of gaijin???

Thank you.

Hi Yuri
This is a really interesting topic.

If you have any questions about the changes i've made, please ask me.

ユリさんの質問に関しては、ちょっと複雑と思います。 外国人は日本について学び始めると、必ず『日本人は外 国の事をよく分からない』や　『日本人に取って、外国 人が宇宙人みたいん』の意見を聞いています。それはや っぱり正しくないですが、何か普通になりました。もち ろん、その意見は大学で、日本人の友達で、直していま すが、日本の社会をよく分からないの人の中で、そのよ うな意見に信じている人はいっぱいんです。それにも、 日本の社会に着いて勉強し始めるの人でも、他の外人か ら変な意見と聞いています。「日本人があなたの事を『 外人』と呼ぶ、悪口だ。人種差別的な響きがある.」だ� �ら、日本人は「外人」を付けると、外国人達、「実は� �日本人さんは私の事がすきじゃないの？ばかにするの� �」と心配します。多分、この考え違いの理由は:

1)英語で、人を国籍で呼ぶのは人種差別的な響きがあり� ��す。たとえば『ジャップ』『パッキ (パキスタン人）』
２）ある子どもは外国人を見ると「あ、外人！外人だ！ 」道の中に呼ぶので、日本人の大人も「外人」を付ける 、何か子どもぽいです。みて、みて、僕のペット外人の 感じがあります。
３）有名な人は「外人」は悪事と言います。たとえば、 デビト。
4)自分の国にいるでも、日本語に取ってまだ『外人』で� ��。そして、それが好きじゃないんです。

and various other reasons.

For me, I don't mind being called 'gaijin' by someone I don't know, unless it's people openly pointing and bawling it, or kids making a fuss, then I might tell them (in japanese) that they're being rude. I don't mind if a friend uses it now and then as a joke, or ironically, but I don't like it when people use it all the time. Even if ~you~ don't think it's got a bad meaning, the foreign community generally does, so if I let everyone call me 'gaijin' all the time, I'll have to deal with my foreign friends asking me why I allow it, don't I find it demeaning, don't I realize it's a bad thing, and so on.
Also it lumps us all together, like it doesn't matter who or where we come from, the thing is we're Not-Japanese. I've also had conversations like "gaijin cause a lot of crime in Japan; these days loads of drug dealers and prostitutes are gaijin.... Oh, Hi Columbine! Everyone, this is my friend Columbine, she's gaijin." I think you can see why sometimes it's really frustrating! Also if you're white, a lot of Japanese people seem to think 'gaijin' means 'american', so it can be annoying for Europeans to be introduced as 'gaijin' and then get asked about America.
So for me, if you have to refer to me by something other than my name, please use my actual nationality, イギリス人、or I'd rather be called 外国人 than がいじん、even if it's more formal. The formality actually means that both the japanese people using it and all the foreigners KNOW for sure there's no bad meaning.

[JamboP26]

It IS an interesting topic. Despite being the actual translation of 'foreigner', I think a lot of bad press has turned it negative. If somebody shouts 'Gaijin', shout back 'Nihonjin', and see what happens. hahahahaha. I've never had the fortune of meeting a Japanese person in person (I'm hoping uni will change that. lol) but I'm sure with there great humour, it will cause a laugh or to, not directed at you, of course. lol

[Koir]

Columbine, it's spelled "associated", not "assossiated".

*wince*

[Columbine]

Originally Posted by Koir

Columbine, it's spelled "associated", not "assossiated".

*wince*

Oops, my mistake. I typo'd. It happens.

Now, are you wincing because you expect me to get cross, or wincing at the spelling? Perhaps i'm reading into it too much, but given both our good track records, I kind of expect more of you than to be rude to me. :P

[Koir]

Originally Posted by Columbine

Oops, my mistake. I typo'd. It happens.

Now, are you wincing because you expect me to get cross, or wincing at the spelling? Perhaps i'm reading into it too much, but given both our good track records, I kind of expect more of you than to be rude to me. :P

Heck no. It's just the reaction from seeing a misspelled word in red text. I just *had* to write a correction before it tied my brain in too many knots :P

[Columbine]

Originally Posted by Koir

Heck no. It's just the reaction from seeing a misspelled word in red text. I just *had* to write a correction before it tied my brain in too many knots :P

*laughs* honestly, I'm embarrassed I didn't even notice! I guess the red mistake squiggle blended right into the red font.

[YuriTokoro]

Originally Posted by ColinHowell

To expand Koir's explanation, "e.g." is of Latin origin, but it has become a standard part of educated English usage. As Koir said, it means "for example", and it is followed by one or more examples of the thing being discussed. By the way, it is properly written as "e.g.", with periods after the letters, though it seems some people omit the periods these days.

It stands for Latin "exempli gratia", but almost no one who uses it knows that. (I certainly didn't--I looked it up.)

Hi, ColinHowell.
Thank you for helping.
If everyone writes it “e.g.”, I would have noticed that must stand for something, or a dictionary I use had the word, but I didn’t know you write that without periods. The dictionary didn’t have “eg”.

Unfortunately, it's fairly common for English speakers to get "e.g." confused with "i.e.", which has a different meaning. "i.e." means "that is" and stands for Latin "id est". (Again, few users remember the original Latin.) "i.e." is usually used before a further clarification or elaboration of what is being discussed, rather than a listing of specific examples.

This is helpful information.
And I will remember that you sometimes write these words without periods.

Originally Posted by ColinHowell

You should probably remove the "[ɡaidʑiɴ]" bit. That's just the pronunciation as written in the International Phonetic Alphabet (IPA). It's pretty normal for English Wikipedia pages to include IPA pronunciations for foreign words or names, but outside of Wikipedia it will probably look like confusing gibberish to most readers.

OK. I’ll do that. Thank you for your advice.

Well, that question seems to be a political minefield, which is one reason the article is practically drowning in citations. If you look at the article's Discussion page, you'll find the writers apparently had a hell of a time agreeing on what to say--the discussion has nine archive sections! This is the sort of article that can become a real battlefield.

I didn’t know it is such touchy.

Personally, I think the word may have had some bad connotations among foreigners in the past, but that may be changing; these days a lot of visitors to Japan or foreign residents in Japan seem happy to use it for themselves.

Do you mean that people who have never come to Japan still hate to be said “gaijin”, even if I don’t say it to address the people?

[YuriTokoro]

Originally Posted by dogsbody70

according to our Harraps English Usage---E.G. is the abbreviation of------

exempli gratia (For Example). It should not be confused with i.e.(id est) (that is).

" We May have a choice of transport, e.g. bus, train or taxi."

"The key to the country's progress is the development of an infrastructure,

i.e. A network of good roads and railways."

Hi, dogsbody!
Thank you for your good examples.

[YuriTokoro]

Originally Posted by Columbine

Hi Yuri
This is a really interesting topic.

If you have any questions about the changes i've made, please ask me.

Hi, Columbine.
Thank you.
大丈夫です、ありがとう!

May I use your comments in my blog?

ユリさんの質問に関しては、ちょっと複雑と思います。

I didn’t know the issue was controversial or complicated.
この問題が物議を醸しているとも複雑だとも知りません でした。
Thank you for answering.
答えてくださってありがとうございます。

外国人は日本について学び始めると、必ず『日本人は外 国の事をよく分からない』や　『日本人に取って、外国 人が宇宙人みたいん』の意見を聞いています。それはや っぱり正しくないですが、何か普通になりました。

Yes, the comments are right. Most Japanese people don’t know or understand foreign countries well. Let me say this, though, many people in foreign countries don’t understand Japan.
その通りです。ほとんどの日本人は外国のことを知らな いし、理解していません。でも言わせていただければ、 外国にいる外国人の方たちは、日本を理解していません 。

もちろん、その意見は大学で、日本人の友達で、直して いますが、日本の社会をよく分からないの人の中で、そ のような意見に信じている人はいっぱいんです。

Those comments about Japanese people are correct, I’d say.
Most Japanese people have never met people from foreign countries. When those people first meet a person from a foreign country, the Japanese people would be so impressed and overreact.
私としては、そういうコメントは正しいと思います。
外国人の方に会ったことがない日本人はたくさんいます 。そういう人たち初めて外国の方にお会いしたら、もの すごく驚いて過剰反応するでしょう。
And I think you would say you don’t understand why those Japanese people are surprised meeting foreigners.
でも多分あなたは、どうして日本人が外国人と会ったか らといって驚くのか、わからないでしょうね。
Have you imagined that you have never met people who are not your race?
人種の違う人と会ったことがなかったらと、想像してみ たことはありますか？

それにも、日本の社会に着いて勉強し始めるの人でも、 他の外人から変な意見と聞いています。「日本人があな たの事を『外人』と呼ぶ、悪口だ。人種差別的な響きが ある.」だから、日本人は「外人」を付けると、外国人� �、「実は、日本人さんは私の事がすきじゃないの？ば� �にするの？」と心配します。

I see. I didn’t know the word was such infamous. I got it.
そうだったんですか。そんなに評判の悪い言葉だとは知 りませんでした。

多分、この考え違いの理由は:

1)英語で、人を国籍で呼ぶのは人種差別的な響きがあり� ��す。たとえば『ジャップ』『パッキ (パキスタン人）』

I know that “Jap” is a derogatory term, but how about “Japanese”?
If I call you English, is that a discrimination?

２）ある子どもは外国人を見ると「あ、外人！外人だ！ 」道の中に呼ぶので、日本人の大人も「外人」を付ける 、何か子どもぽいです。みて、みて、僕のペット外人の 感じがあります。

If there are many people from Western countries in Japan, those children wouldn’t say like that.
もし西洋の方が大勢日本にいたしたら、そういう子供た ちもそんなことは言わないと思いますよ。
However, when you are called gaijin loudly on the street, you would hate it. I understand it.
でも、道で大声で外人と呼ばれたら、嫌ですよね。わか ります。

３）有名な人は「外人」は悪事と言います。たとえば、 デビト。

Columbine, sorry; I don’t see what this sentence means.
Who is デビト?

4)自分の国にいるでも、日本語に取ってまだ『外人』で� ��。そして、それが好きじゃないんです。

I know that! I have heard it many times.
I’d like to write a bit about this issue later.

and various other reasons.

For me, I don't mind being called 'gaijin' by someone I don't know, unless it's people openly pointing and bawling it, or kids making a fuss, then I might tell them (in japanese) that they're being rude.

In the city in Japan, I think such things would not happen, while in rural places, it’s likely.

I don't mind if a friend uses it now and then as a joke, or ironically, but I don't like it when people use it all the time. Even if ~you~ don't think it's got a bad meaning, the foreign community generally does, so if I let everyone call me 'gaijin' all the time, I'll have to deal with my foreign friends asking me why I allow it, don't I find it demeaning, don't I realize it's a bad thing, and so on.

I see. I will never say “gaijin” anymore.

Also it lumps us all together, like it doesn't matter who or where we come from, the thing is we're Not-Japanese.

Yes, the Japanese people like to lumps people all together.
We often lump ourselves all together. It may be difficult to understand why you don’t like to be lumped together to most Japanese people.

I've also had conversations like "gaijin cause a lot of crime in Japan; these days loads of drug dealers and prostitutes are gaijin....

I agree with you!
I’m sure that there are more Japanese criminals than foreign criminals, but the Japanese people like to say so.

Oh, Hi Columbine! Everyone, this is my friend Columbine, she's gaijin." I think you can see why sometimes it's really frustrating!

I must say here there are differences.
In Japan, if one of my friends come to with someone, and said “this is my friend, and she is gaijin”, other friends and I would be really interested in the person, and try to be friends with the person.
And I would say “I have a foreign friend!” to many other friends.
I believe that many Japanese people want to be friends with foreign people, but they can’t because of the language.

If I was in England and my friend said “this is my friend, and she is gaijin”, I would feel nothing, and say “Hi, I’m Japanese.”

I’m sorry; I don’t understand what you feel.

Also if you're white, a lot of Japanese people seem to think 'gaijin' means 'american', so it can be annoying for Europeans to be introduced as 'gaijin' and then get asked about America.

OK, this is understandable.
It must be frustrating.
I am really sorry to hear that.

My guitar teacher has said that he was often spoken to in Chinese in the US.

So for me, if you have to refer to me by something other than my name, please use my actual nationality, イギリス人、or I'd rather be called 外国人 than がいじん、even if it's more formal. The formality actually means that both the japanese people using it and all the foreigners KNOW for sure there's no bad meaning.

I will say外国人 or イギリス人.
Your comments are really instructive and helpful.
勉強になりました。どうもありがとう。

[YuriTokoro]

Originally Posted by JamboP26

It IS an interesting topic. Despite being the actual translation of 'foreigner', I think a lot of bad press has turned it negative. If somebody shouts 'Gaijin', shout back 'Nihonjin', and see what happens. hahahahaha. I've never had the fortune of meeting a Japanese person in person (I'm hoping uni will change that. lol) but I'm sure with there great humour, it will cause a laugh or to, not directed at you, of course. lol

Hi, Jambo.

Actually, most Japanese people would not feel anything if you shout “Nihonjin”.
In the first place, there are not any malevolent intentions saying “gaijin”, so Japanese people would like to be called Nihonjin when you are smiling.
And the Japanese would say, “Hello, hello, nice to meet you! You speak Japanese! Great!”, if the person can speak English.

By the way, that does uni? Is it University?