Japanophile - and other open discussion

[godwine]

Instead of a thread sticking to just one theme, I wanted to open up an opportunity where people won't get flamed for "stay on the topic!!!" It is perfectly fine if you decide to steer off course if your answer to a post is off topic

So I will start something spawing from a different thread I was on. Was in a recent discussion (See the marriage thread). Some users on this site have some interesting generalization or "steretype" about the Japanese (or Asian as a whole) culture and its People. Ideas which I consider to be "Narrow" and "bias" that stem from an obsession of (yeah Japanese Otaku) of the Japanese culture.

What are your thoughts? I mean, I LOVE Japan, and its people, but as much as me being called a Japanophile by my sensei, friends and family, I don't consider "All things Japanese are good". There will always be good and bad in all things (To me thats common sense). For example, someone told me once that "Everyone in Japan really polite and friendly to tourist". But trust me, I've seen some really dirty looks and experieinced some serious pushing on the Yamanote during rush hour, some people are just not as willing to help.

So thoughts??

[JohnBraden]

As for the latter part of your opening, concerning the Yamanote, people push others, regardless of who they are. I've been pushed and shoved and the people who did it weren't very discriminating. I didn't take it as them being especially rude to tourists. That's when I decided to move to the end cars where there isn't much pushing at all even during rush hour.

I believe there are some cool things about Japan and some dreadful things as well. If you can deal with the latter, the former will be that much better!

[godwine]

Originally Posted by JohnBraden

As for the latter part of your opening, concerning the Yamanote, people push others, regardless of who they are. I've been pushed and shoved and the people who did it weren't very discriminating. I didn't take it as them being especially rude to tourists. That's when I decided to move to the end cars where there isn't much pushing at all even during rush hour.

I believe there are some cool things about Japan and some dreadful things as well. If you can deal with the latter, the former will be that much better!

Agree, and I wasn't implying that they are being discriminating, I am just saying while yes, people are generally more tolerant with tourist, there will definitely be time when they don't give tourist special treatment.

Trips between Yokohama > Sakuragicho on the Keihin-Tohoku Negishi Line is better but the pushing and rudeness are definitely still there... Oddly, I don't remember something like this living around Yokohama when I was a kid...

[JohnBraden]

Originally Posted by godwine

Agree, and I wasn't implying that they are being discriminating, I am just saying while yes, people are generally more tolerant with tourist, there will definitely be time when they don't give tourist special treatment.

Trips between Yokohama > Sakuragicho on the Keihin-Tohoku Negishi Line is better but the pushing and rudeness are definitely still there... Oddly, I don't remember something like this living around Yokohama when I was a kid...

I forgot to add that they (the pushers and shovers) were discriminating. They pushed anybody and everybody in their way. If you're a tourist, oh well. But then again, I was born in Madrid and lived there for 21 years and the same thing happened on the buses and subway. In Tokyo I didn't mind it as much because, as a whole, I was normally taller than most and it didn't feel as bad if you're taller than they.

I did notice a bit of youthful discrimination when a group of elementary school kids boarded the train on the JR Nikko Line back down to Utsunomiya. I was sitting by myself and a bunch of boys and girls sat in the seat across from me. I noticed quite a bit of hesitation with other kids wanting to sit in the same side I was in and they decided not to sit there. Not to be rude or react immediately, I let some time go by (the train wasn't set to leave for a bit) and then decided to move further up the car and closer to the teachers so they could all sit together. I knew I was the cause of them being separated. Once I moved away, the kids bunched together and sat where I had. I don't know if it they didn't sit next to me because they felt uncomfortable next to a gaijin or what. But that's the only time I had people sit away from me on purpose.

[godwine]

Originally Posted by JohnBraden

I forgot to add that they (the pushers and shovers) were discriminating. They pushed anybody and everybody in their way. If you're a tourist, oh well. But then again, I was born in Madrid and lived there for 21 years and the same thing happened on the buses and subway. In Tokyo I didn't mind it as much because, as a whole, I was normally taller than most and it didn't feel as bad if you're taller than they.

I did notice a bit of youthful discrimination when a group of elementary school kids boarded the train on the JR Nikko Line back down to Utsunomiya. I was sitting by myself and a bunch of boys and girls sat in the seat across from me. I noticed quite a bit of hesitation with other kids wanting to sit in the same side I was in and they decided not to sit there. Not to be rude or react immediately, I let some time go by (the train wasn't set to leave for a bit) and then decided to move further up the car and closer to the teachers so they could all sit together. I knew I was the cause of them being separated. Once I moved away, the kids bunched together and sat where I had. I don't know if it they didn't sit next to me because they felt uncomfortable next to a gaijin or what. But that's the only time I had people sit away from me on purpose.

Similar things happened to my Italian friend when I took him to Japan several years back. The first time was at Kaiyukan in Osaka, we were at the area with the Jelly fish, there was a group of Elementry school kid on a school trip. I was chatting with my friend, and a bunch of kids start following him, then one kid came to me and asked me why was I able to communicate with him. Some just stood in front of him and looking at him like a freak show

Second incident was on the same trip, but in Kyoto, we were on our way back to Kyoto from Nara, same thing, elementry school kid, sat across from him and I heard a lot of discussion about the Gaijin, funny thing is, they completely ignore my presence and the possibilities of me understanding them....... the conversation was somewhere around "How come there are foreigner on this train", "Where are they going", "Maybe he is a kaiju" etc etc

My friend actually understood enough to make a laugh out of the whole situation.. it was fun in its own way..

[JohnBraden]

Originally Posted by godwine

My friend actually understood enough to make a laugh out of the whole situation.. it was fun in its own way..

A few years back at the Sunshine City shopping area in Ikebukuro, my friend and I were taking the down escalators when I noticed a group of school kids walking down the corridor in our general direction. Have you ever had one of those premonitions that something is going to happen? Before I could even mention that to my friend, three of the kids in the group darted off towards us. When they got to us, they all said, "Herrow!!!" and ran back to their group giggling. It was as is I could sense the kids seeing us and dared each other to say something. It was a very funny anecdote that day.

I'd love to have some kids try to really speak to me and have a conversation. That would be cool.

[RealJames]

A lot of the great things were blown out of proportions even in my own point of view when I first arrived, as were the bad things.
Japan to me was a land of greats and worsts.

The greats seriously overshadowed the worsts though, in fact some of the worsts I secretly home to take advantage of when I get older

By the way, I don't sit beside foreign tourists, .... they STINK!! haha, I bet I did too when I first got here...
And if they don't stink, they're obnoxiously loud, and are ultra KY.

regarding the conversation so far,
kids are hardly a good representation of any culture, granted they are much more honest, but hell if America was defined by the way it's children behaved... lol

I've been on the good and bad end of the discrimination, and I'll take the bad any day for a few days of the good each year

I know the rock-star charisma man thing is a bit of a sensitive point and is someone dismissed as a thing of the past, but it's alive and well if you've got what it takes.

and regarding the marriage thread off-topicness,
I've been propositioned to have affairs by more than few married ladies here with absent (probably also cheating) husbands. This land is no different when it comes to people wanting sex/money/love/fun before they die.

[RealJames]

Originally Posted by JohnBraden

A few years back at the Sunshine City shopping area in Ikebukuro, my friend and I were taking the down escalators when I noticed a group of school kids walking down the corridor in our general direction. Have you ever had one of those premonitions that something is going to happen? Before I could even mention that to my friend, three of the kids in the group darted off towards us. When they got to us, they all said, "Herrow!!!" and ran back to their group giggling. It was as is I could sense the kids seeing us and dared each other to say something. It was a very funny anecdote that day.

I'd love to have some kids try to really speak to me and have a conversation. That would be cool.

When I first arrived here I was walking around Hep5 in Umeda and a group of junior high school girls decided to talk to me and my (Japanese) friend to try out the English they'd been learning.
They actually did very well, I was impressed how well they could speak, kids nowadays in Japan are getting much better English education than their parents did or even 10 years ago.
The girls were super cute, cute in a puppy dog kind of way, not a sex-appeal kind of way, until one of them tried to sneakily put her email in my phone lol, then it was just creepy!

(ps, I'd risk jail time to beat the life out of a grown man who fucks a junior high school girl)

[JohnBraden]

Originally Posted by RealJames

When I first arrived here I was walking around Hep5 in Umeda and a group of junior high school girls decided to talk to me and my (Japanese) friend to try out the English they'd been learning.
They actually did very well, I was impressed how well they could speak, kids nowadays in Japan are getting much better English education than their parents did or even 10 years ago.
The girls were super cute, cute in a puppy dog kind of way, not a sex-appeal kind of way, until one of them tried to sneakily put her email in my phone lol, then it was just creepy!

(ps, I'd risk jail time to beat the life out of a grown man who fucks a junior high school girl)

I guess I'm not the approachable kind of guy. Or maybe I do stink! LOL I'm sure I smell different than they do, since I don't buy their hygiene products-I use my American-brought. Well, I'd still love to have such encounters next March.

I do remember another incident on the Yamanote. It was the first time I had gone to Japan as a tourist and I found myself separated from my friend. I took the train from Shinjuku towards Ikebukuro. I'm used to standing by the doors on the trains in Chicago since the trains are much shorter and narrower than the Japanese. I was standing next to a young couple, early to mid-20s and the guy couldn't stop sniffling. After a while I did what I was always taught to do. (Can you see where this is going and how un-Japanese it is?) I went into my backpack and grabbed one of the dozen of so packs of tissues those girls kept handing me on the street and handed it to him. He was visibly surprised and took it. He didn't blow his nose though, though now I know why. After a few stops, they got off and the girl actually turned around to face me and bowed. The look on both of their faces when I handed him the tissues was priceless. I wonder if I insulted them, even though I was just being civil and not expressing my displeasure at the sound of him sniffling. Any comments on that one? II now know my error and that blowing your nose in public is considered rude, but, dude, the guy was just hurting bad!

[evanny]

RealJames..you are like 35 ? o.O


anyway. my friend told me that living with her host family was probably the worst part of he experience that Japan had to offer. while friends at school were cool and fun the family was rather cold. they went to dinner and all the family did was to play game-boy that each one had. same with everyday life - usually watches tv or plays games. even when asked to cook them hers traditional foods they added rice since only potatoes are weird presumably.
............
well many families are like that but for 留学生 it was a bit disappointing since she didn't get much of a practise in a way of speaking with them. Other than that not much of a "pushing" or "stares" from others. probably since it was Osaka and everyone is used to gaijin.