American in Hiroshima...

[Enkidu22]

I'm too lazy to write so much as you did (^_^) so I will just say that of course you may have your opinion and I'm not saying that I must be 100% right (most likely there is some truth on both sides) but the fact is that most of non-american WW II specialists agree that Hiroshima and Nagasaki weren't necesary and every year more and more books and publications about war on Pacific state so. This show that there might have been another way.

Also from other conflicts throught the XX century I developed an opinion that US politics generaly don't care about civilian lives. Korea, Vietnam and Iraq show clearly that they disquise US interests and their own agenda into "fighting for freedom/justice/democracy" and such things, and they don't care that innocent suffer. The thing is that becose of modern mass media people all around the world see this and they start to hate americans.

[samurai007]

Originally Posted by Enkidu22

I'm too lazy to write so much as you did (^_^) so I will just say that of course you may have your opinion and I'm not saying that I must be 100% right (most likely there is some truth on both sides) but the fact is that most of non-american WW II specialists agree that Hiroshima and Nagasaki weren't necesary and every year more and more books and publications about war on Pacific state so. This show that there might have been another way.

Also from other conflicts throught the XX century I developed an opinion that US politics generaly don't care about civilian lives. Korea, Vietnam and Iraq show clearly that they disquise US interests and their own agenda into "fighting for freedom/justice/democracy" and such things, and they don't care that innocent suffer. The thing is that becose of modern mass media people all around the world see this and they start to hate americans.

Modern mass media is severely biased in many cases. Al Jezeera is incredibly biased against the US and Israel, as is the Guardian and other leftist media outlets. Even most American media has a massive leftist tilt that tends to be anti-American (polls show 92% of American newscasters are leftists!) Many good things are happening in Iraq, but that never gets reported. Violence is way down, refugees are returning by the thousands, the terrorists are losing ground, etc, but they won't report that because they don't want America or Bush to be able to point to it and say "look, there are some successes." Yeah, it was botched for a long time, many mistakes were made, but the surge is working and conditions are improving rapidly now.

The US does care about fighting for freedom, democracy, and justice. They aren't just slogans or disguises. It doesn't always work out as planned, but then there is an old soldier's saying "no plan of battle ever survives first contact with the enemy". It is all that BS about "war for oil" that are the lies and slogans. If we wanted oil, Saddam was eager to sell as much as he could (look at the oil for food scandal in the UN where tons of people and countries were taking him up on his offer.) If we wanted his oil so badly, why haven't we taken it yet? We've been there for years, we're paying much more than usual for gas here, and yet most Iraqi oil is being sold to Europe and Asia. We get our gas from other countries.

[noodle]

Originally Posted by samurai007

Al Jezeera is incredibly biased against the US and Israel

I wouldn't say that at all... My brother has worked for BBC, MBC and is has now been working for Al Jazeera for the past 4 years and he tells me they are NOT allowed to show half the crap the US does... eg, read that example i gave to MMM...

Personally, i would say Americans are Biast... And thats fine if it was only slightly biast, everyone is to a certain extent proud, patriotic and biast about their country... BUT i think some if not most americans sometimes prefer to totally ignore reality & truth and then just have these images in their heads of how the US gov is doing the right thing!! Of course, eventually the people start to realise what the governemt is doing and then most of them don't like it, BUT there are always plenty of people that are clueless and seem to ignore reality!!

[MMM]

Originally Posted by noodle

I wouldn't say that at all... My brother has worked for BBC, MBC and is has now been working for Al Jazeera for the past 4 years and he tells me they are NOT allowed to show half the crap the US does... eg, read that example i gave to MMM...

Personally, i would say Americans are Biast... And thats fine if it was only slightly biast, everyone is to a certain extent proud, patriotic and biast about their country... BUT i think some if not most americans sometimes prefer to totally ignore reality & truth and then just have these images in their heads of how the US gov is doing the right thing!! Of course, eventually the people start to realise what the governemt is doing and then most of them don't like it, BUT there are always plenty of people that are clueless and seem to ignore reality!!

I don't think any of those Americans are here...

Samurai says Al Jazeera is anti-American, yet you say they aren't allowed to show the Army in a negative light. Both these things can't be true. Who is stopping the presentation of Al Jazeera news?

When you say your brother wasn't allowed to show something what does that mean? Did the US Army take the videotape from him? Or is it a policy thing?

[noodle]

Originally Posted by MMM

I don't think any of those Americans are here...

Samurai says Al Jazeera is anti-American, yet you say they aren't allowed to show the Army in a negative light. Both these things can't be true. Who is stopping the presentation of Al Jazeera news?

When you say your brother wasn't allowed to show something what does that mean? Did the US Army take the videotape from him? Or is it a policy thing?

I wish i could tell you and i wish my brother was allowed to tell me who is stopping them (if he even knows)... Of course they have some freedom to show what they want, but he's told me dozens of stories where his boss didn't let them air some tapes!!! BUT, its a FACT that they aren't allowed to show some of the horrible things that the US army has done! Thats why i disagree with what samurai said! And because i disagree, of course both things can't be correct!

And i wouldn't say that... i believe some comments made on this forum by americans are rather biast!...

[samurai007]

Originally Posted by MMM

I don't think any of those Americans are here...

Samurai says Al Jazeera is anti-American, yet you say they aren't allowed to show the Army in a negative light. Both these things can't be true. Who is stopping the presentation of Al Jazeera news?

When you say your brother wasn't allowed to show something what does that mean? Did the US Army take the videotape from him? Or is it a policy thing?

They can both be true, actually. They can try to spin things in an anti-American light, and present their stories with a bias that is subtle enough that they can still appear to be a legitimate news agency, and thus also be unwilling to air some stories that are too sensational and over the top in their bias. It can sometimes be a fine line between subtly spinning the news in the direction you want and going so far that no one takes you seriously as a news source anymore.

Also, not every person within an organization as large as Al Jezeera is going to agree on things. There can be internal conflicts, with some editors killing stories they deem too biased and others promoting such stories.

But Noodle, surely you aren't trying to claim that Al Jezeera tries to show the US and Israel in a favorable light, or even a completely impartial light, are you? Whether it's one story being killed or "half the crap the US does", surely you must agree that Al Jezeera has a pro-Arabic and (at least subtly) anti-American and anti-Israeli agenda, right? I mean, I can easily admit FOX news has a right-wing agenda and bias, even if they still report on Republican scandals and stories that show the right in a negative light.

[noodle]

Originally Posted by samurai007

They can both be true, actually. They can try to spin things in an anti-American light, and present their stories with a bias that is subtle enough that they can still appear to be a legitimate news agency, and thus also be unwilling to air some stories that are too sensational and over the top in their bias. It can sometimes be a fine line between subtly spinning the news in the direction you want and going so far that no one takes you seriously as a news source anymore.

Also, not every person within an organization as large as Al Jezeera is going to agree on things. There can be internal conflicts, with some editors killing stories they deem too biased and others promoting such stories.

But Noodle, surely you aren't trying to claim that Al Jezeera tries to show the US and Israel in a favorable light, or even a completely impartial light, are you? Whether it's one story being killed or "half the crap the US does", surely you must agree that Al Jezeera has a pro-Arabic and (at least subtly) anti-American and anti-Israeli agenda, right? I mean, I can easily admit FOX news has a right-wing agenda and bias, even if they still report on Republican scandals and stories that show the right in a negative light.

I guess i should have been more specific!!! I'm talking about Al Jazeera English!!! not the arabic one... Though they carry the same name, they don't have the same news, nor do they have any arabic speaking editors!! It's actually quiete funny, In the whole office in Qatar, there are only a hand full of people that speak arabic (one being my brother, as he has to do some translations sometimes), MOST are american!

And of course it doesn't try to show US in favorable liight, but it doesn't try to show it negatively either... Like you said, there is a limit and a fine line on what to show and what not to show, and also depending who has the story, editors may choose to air or not!
With that said, according to what my brother has seen, the US has done things far worse than is shown! And that goes the other way as well, "some" US soldiers have done some amazing things that will never be shown either!

EDIT:. I just spoke to my brother... Aparently there's a certain level of independence with aljazeera, but you can never be completely sovreign as a company or a nation.... Also, when it comes to anything outside Africa and the Middle east most of the news is provided by Reuters and APTN which is regarded by MOST to be pro-western. but when it comes to Palestine, Iraq, Africa, Aljazeera is more independent and doesn't need reuters or APTIN. With that said, aparently it is controlled by the west to a certain extent! He also said its to do with the politics. meaning that a lot is controlled by the US and UK leaders!!

[MMM]

The implication I had from you a couple days ago, Noodle, was that the US military wasn't allowing negative stories about the US military to be shown in Iraq. I said if that really was true, that would be very big news and scandalous. I see now that isn't what you are saying, and that the biases come from inside the company, correct?

[noodle]

Originally Posted by MMM

The implication I had from you a couple days ago, Noodle, was that the US military wasn't allowing negative stories about the US military to be shown in Iraq. I said if that really was true, that would be very big news and scandalous. I see now that isn't what you are saying, and that the biases come from inside the company, correct?

No no... i apologize if it came across as me saying it was the Military that controlled it!!! thats not what i meant, and of course if that were the case, that would be a big story!!!

[Tenchu]

LOL, Samurai000 gave up on me.

Have nothing to say when I tell truth? US commits the same crimes as the people it fights, and justifies it with ornamental words. Its morality is a paper tiger.

Samurai000, I do not think the war was over oil, myself. However, you do undertsand that whoever controls the flow of oil holds the western world to ransom?