JapanForum.com  


Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
(#1 (permalink))
Old
sTEV0 (Offline)
New to JF
 
Posts: 4
Join Date: Jul 2009
Using 'according to' and referencing sources - 07-05-2009, 04:01 PM

Textbooks say that using 'ni yoru to' (ie shimbun ni yoru to) is too formal for a casual conversation.

What is a more casual way of saying 'according to' when referencing news, people etc?
Reply With Quote
(#2 (permalink))
Old
KyleGoetz's Avatar
KyleGoetz (Offline)
Attorney at Flaw
 
Posts: 2,965
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Texas
07-05-2009, 04:13 PM

によって is less formal than によると.

Edit: This is incorrect.

Last edited by KyleGoetz : 07-05-2009 at 10:20 PM. Reason: I'm an idiot.
Reply With Quote
(#3 (permalink))
Old
sTEV0 (Offline)
New to JF
 
Posts: 4
Join Date: Jul 2009
07-05-2009, 04:17 PM

Brilliant, thanks a lot. I only have a formal education in Japanese, my casual chatting leaves something to be required.
Reply With Quote
(#4 (permalink))
Old
Nagoyankee's Avatar
Nagoyankee (Offline)
中庸を得るのだ~
 
Posts: 2,119
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Tokyo, Japan
07-05-2009, 04:23 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by KyleGoetz View Post
によって is less formal than によると.
Those two don't even mean the same thing.....
Reply With Quote
(#5 (permalink))
Old
sTEV0 (Offline)
New to JF
 
Posts: 4
Join Date: Jul 2009
07-05-2009, 04:25 PM

Oh?
Crossed wires somewhere?
Reply With Quote
(#6 (permalink))
Old
Nagoyankee's Avatar
Nagoyankee (Offline)
中庸を得るのだ~
 
Posts: 2,119
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Tokyo, Japan
07-05-2009, 04:44 PM

新聞によると~~ = according to the newspaper

"新聞によると、マイケル・ジャクソンが亡くなったら い。" = According to the newspaper, Micheal Jackson is dead. 

新聞によって~~ = by the newspaper (it speaks of a function of a newspaper)

新聞によって世界のニュースが分かる。 = The newspaper enables us to learn the world news.

によって and によると are never interchangeable.
__________________

To answer the original question, ”~によると” isn't all that formal to begin with. Even elementary school kids use the phrase.

But if you absolutely HAVE TO make it less formal, you could say "新聞ではマイケル・ジャクソンが亡くなったと言っている。"
Reply With Quote
(#7 (permalink))
Old
KyleGoetz's Avatar
KyleGoetz (Offline)
Attorney at Flaw
 
Posts: 2,965
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Texas
07-05-2009, 09:46 PM

Really? I was specifically taught by multiple Japanese teachers that they mean "according to." Of course, that would be the English meaning, so that could explain how the wires got crossed.

You honestly can't say 友達によってミスターインクレディブルがおもしろい? You have to use によると?

Wow, that's a big anvil dropped on my head after years of using them interchangeably.

How many more grammar points have I been using incorrectly all these years without knowing so?

This is exactly why I never claim to be "fluent," and why I caution people use that term willy nilly. I mean, I was 100% sure I was right when I made that comment. Darnit.

Last edited by KyleGoetz : 07-05-2009 at 10:19 PM.
Reply With Quote
(#8 (permalink))
Old
Ronin4hire's Avatar
Ronin4hire (Offline)
Busier Than Shinjuku Station
 
Posts: 2,353
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: ウェリントン、ニュジランド
07-05-2009, 11:04 PM

I thought によって means depending on.

So to me your sentence means

"Depending on the friend, Mr Incredible is interesting."

I didn't realise there were other uses.

Thanks all
Reply With Quote
(#9 (permalink))
Old
MMM's Avatar
MMM (Offline)
JF Ossan
 
Posts: 12,200
Join Date: Jun 2007
07-05-2009, 11:13 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ronin4hire View Post
I thought によって means depending on.

So to me your sentence means

"Depending on the friend, Mr Incredible is interesting."

I didn't realise there were other uses.

Thanks all
I think you are thinking of ~によって違う
Reply With Quote
(#10 (permalink))
Old
Ronin4hire's Avatar
Ronin4hire (Offline)
Busier Than Shinjuku Station
 
Posts: 2,353
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: ウェリントン、ニュジランド
07-05-2009, 11:34 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by MMM View Post
I think you are thinking of ~によって違う
I'm not familiar with that grammar point maybe

I've always used によって like "depending" but never with 違う (or is 違う just an example of a verb?)

Like in the above example. Or perhaps a more natural example would be

天気によって、.海に行きます。

That to me means:

"Depending on the weather, I will go to the beach."

Is that correct? If not how should I say this sentence?

I've always just used で in the examples Nagoyankee gives.

新聞で世界のニュースが分かる
Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On




Copyright 2003-2006 Virtual Japan.
Search Engine Friendly URLs by vBSEO 3.0.0 RC6