KyleGoetz's Thread of Questions

[KyleGoetz]

I'm going to make this my new thread in which I ask questions—they're going to be random and not substantial enough to deserve their own thread. Usually I imagine it will just be vocab questions.

I started a new system for learning vocab, and I've got three words that mean substantially the same thing. How are they different?

笑み
微笑
笑い

Thanks in advance!

[Sashimister]

Originally Posted by KyleGoetz

I'm going to make this my new thread in which I ask questions—they're going to be random and not substantial enough to deserve their own thread. Usually I imagine it will just be vocab questions.

I started a new system for learning vocab, and I've got three words that mean substantially the same thing. How are they different?

笑み
微笑
笑い

Thanks in advance!

祝　新スレ立ち上げ！

まず、三つの単語を意味の上からふたつのグループに分 けます。

1. 笑み　+　微笑. 2.　笑い.

笑み = "a smile", "smiling" の大和言葉です。
微笑 = "a smile", "smiling" の漢語です。文学的な香りのすることばです。

笑い　= "a laughter", "laughing" の大和言葉です。
__________

もうひとつ、「ほほえみ」という言葉も覚えておくとよ いでしょう。意味は上の第一のグループと同じです。も ちろん大和言葉です。

[Nyororin]

Originally Posted by Sashimister

もうひとつ、「ほほえみ」という言葉も覚えておくとよ いでしょう。意味は上の第一のグループと同じです。も ちろん大和言葉です。

I hate to jump into this thread, but reading this sparked a small question.
微笑 read as びしょう is 漢語... But I often see ほほえみ also written as 微笑 or 微笑み. Often enough that I generally read 微笑 as ほほえみ unless it`s indicated otherwise by ふりがな or totally doesn`t fit in with the feel of the passage.

Is this just connecting the 大和言葉 to the 漢語 of the same meaning? Or can 微 actually be read as ほほ?

In the large scheme of things, it probably doesn`t matter much, but I was a bit curious.

[KyleGoetz]

Originally Posted by Sashimister

祝　新スレ立ち上げ！

まず、三つの単語を意味の上からふたつのグループに分 けます。

1. 笑み　+　微笑. 2.　笑い.

笑み = "a smile", "smiling" の大和言葉です。
微笑 = "a smile", "smiling" の漢語です。文学的な香りのすることばです。

笑い　= "a laughter", "laughing" の大和言葉です。
__________

もうひとつ、「ほほえみ」という言葉も覚えておくとよ いでしょう。意味は上の第一のグループと同じです。も ちろん大和言葉です。

分かりました。ホンマニオオキニ

[Sashimister]

Originally Posted by Nyororin

微笑 read as びしょう is 漢語... But I often see ほほえみ also written as 微笑 or 微笑み. Often enough that I generally read 微笑 as ほほえみ unless it`s indicated otherwise by ふりがな or totally doesn`t fit in with the feel of the passage.

Is this just connecting the 大和言葉 to the 漢語 of the same meaning? Or can 微 actually be read as ほほ?

In the large scheme of things, it probably doesn`t matter much, but I was a bit curious.

You've brought up a very good point. Evidently, you should be the biggest bookworm in Central Japan.

In schools, the only reading they teach you for 微笑 is びしょう, which makes sense because:
1. The word was borrowed from Chinese. and
2. There is no kun-reading ほほ for 微.

However, as you stated, it's true that in many fictional and non-fictional writings, 微笑 often has the furigana ほほえみ added by the authors. This happens quite often to some words, which is a unique feature of the language. It's like you want a word to pysically appear in one way but sound in another. Amazingly, this is possible in Japanese.

Another good example (though with no On-Kun relation) is 女 read as ひと in so many novels and song lyrics. People prefer the feminine look of the character 女, but not the sound of おんな since it can sound more like a "broad" than a "woman" or "lady".

My general analysis is this. Even after well over 1,000 years of pronouncing both On and Kun, our ears still long for the Kun unless we are in proffesional/academic/business situations. Seems this is in our DNA, and it's truly amazing that you now have a Japanese ear for reading 微笑 as ほほえみ when there is no furigana to read it as such.

[KyleGoetz]

Hey, hey, hey! I've got another triplet to divide and conquer!

逃げる
逃げ出す
逃れる

やっぱり「逃走」って漢文で、上級な日本語なんだけど 、「逃げる」と「逃げ出す」と「逃れる」はどうちがう のかな〜っと。

Edit: Moreover, 「解かす」と「溶かす」はどう違うの？

[Sashimister]

Originally Posted by KyleGoetz

Hey, hey, hey! I've got another triplet to divide and conquer!

逃げる
逃げ出す
逃れる

やっぱり「逃走」って漢文で、上級な日本語なんだけど 、「逃げる」と「逃げ出す」と「逃れる」はどうちがう のかな〜っと。

Edit: Moreover, 「解かす」と「溶かす」はどう違うの？

「かな～っと」の使い方がメッチャ自然やん。おっさん ホンマ米国人かいな！

「逃げる」 is the most generic with many meanings such as to run away from someone, to escape from danger or arrest, to flee, to take flight, to shirk one's duty, etc.

「逃げ出す」 has two (sets of) meanings.
1. 「逃げる」
2. 「逃げ始める」. 　

For #1, 逃げる and 逃げ出す are often interchageable. In fact, the only exceptions I can think of is that kids only say 逃げる in tag. The other one is when two guys are performing an illegal activity and one notices the police car siren and says to the other "逃げろ".　He sure won't say "逃げ出せ".　

「逃れる」 is different in that it often doesn't involve physical "running". You can 逃れる from responsibility, punishment, job, yapping wife, etc.
_______

「解かす」 and 「溶かす」, in the average Japanese person's daily life, are completely interchangeable. No one really cares as they had been one word before we had letters.

In some dictionaries, however, you will see 解かす defined as "to melt ice or snow", and 溶かす as "to dissove in water".

[MMM]

I am not going to put up with any bickering in this thread. You are all regular and valued members, so let's work together and post only what is necessary.

[KyleGoetz]

I'm not even sure what's going on. Huh?

[Sashimister]

Originally Posted by KyleGoetz

I'm not even sure what's going on. Huh?

Some unhappy member called this thread names and I told him to get out. He has never even studied Japanese but somehow firmly believes that romaji is a vaild and recognized option for writing Japanese.