JapanForum.com  


Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
(#21 (permalink))
Old
StonerPenguin's Avatar
StonerPenguin (Offline)
loves bein' gross ಥ‿à
 
Posts: 357
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: The Goddamn Bible Belt
08-15-2010, 01:15 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by evanny View Post
well the maker of the thread asked about everyday language that its native users my use - in this case prom... so for the people who do not want to make a damn topic every time they dont understand something and also want to learn more at the time should simply whatch more movies.
P.S o. and the maker is you.
P.P.S basicly im giving a tip on how to learn those words.
Sashimister is a native Japanese speaker fluent in English!!! He's a professional teacher of Japanese to English speakers. He was giving us something to think about in our Japanese studies; 雨男, 雪男, and 晴れ女 don't really have English equivalents so as English speakers of Japanese we avoid using them/just don't learn them. However, as we strive to attain Japanese fluency we should learn phrases outside of our normal vocabulary -- think outside the box, so to speak. That's what the thread is about (...I think, if I'm wrong SM, please feel free to correct me )

I think you've misunderstood this thread entirely!
Reply With Quote
(#22 (permalink))
Old
Sashimister's Avatar
Sashimister (Offline)
他力本願
 
Posts: 1,258
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Tokyo, Japan
08-15-2010, 02:40 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by StonerPenguin View Post
Sashimister is a native Japanese speaker fluent in English!!! He's a professional teacher of Japanese to English speakers. He was giving us something to think about in our Japanese studies; 雨男, 雪男, and 晴れ女 don't really have English equivalents so as English speakers of Japanese we avoid using them/just don't learn them. However, as we strive to attain Japanese fluency we should learn phrases outside of our normal vocabulary -- think outside the box, so to speak. That's what the thread is about (...I think, if I'm wrong SM, please feel free to correct me )

I think you've misunderstood this thread entirely!
Precisely! Thanks for explaining what the thread is all about!
Reply With Quote
(#23 (permalink))
Old
MMM's Avatar
MMM (Offline)
JF Ossan
 
Posts: 12,200
Join Date: Jun 2007
08-15-2010, 06:35 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by manganimefan227 View Post
I never thought even this was so dead serious!
It's always dead serious.
Reply With Quote
(#24 (permalink))
Old
delacroix01's Avatar
delacroix01 (Offline)
JF Old Timer
 
Posts: 252
Join Date: Apr 2009
08-15-2010, 12:36 PM

Very interesting and useful thread. Thanks again Sashimister. It's always fun to learn new words Well, regarding ボケ and ツッコミ, I think the first time I heard these terms was when I was watching an anime. There are other styles of comedy by Kansai people, but this one made the greatest impact on me
Reply With Quote
(#25 (permalink))
Old
StonerPenguin's Avatar
StonerPenguin (Offline)
loves bein' gross ಥ‿à
 
Posts: 357
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: The Goddamn Bible Belt
08-15-2010, 03:24 PM

A little something I'd like to add on my own experiences;
When I first started learning Japanese, my favorite way to practice was translating songs, which really isn't ideal considering that some Japanese songs are very complex...

Anyway, here's a line that messed with my brains; "大切ã«ã—ãªãã¡ã‚ƒ"
It took me a while to figure out that ã—ãªãã¡ --> ã—ãªã‘ã‚Œã°ãªã‚‰ãªã„ but then, I had never heard of 大切ã«ã™ã‚‹. So I translated it as "I must do it importantly" and was really confused. Now I know it means something along the lines of "I have to take care of it/cherish it"

It's also funny how I had heard ã¡ã‚ƒã£ãŸ consciously maybe once or twice before and thought "huh, interesting" but as soon as SM pointed out that ã¡ã‚ƒã£ãŸ-->~ã¦ã—ã¾ã£ãŸ the next time I watched a Japanese show I noticed that ã¡ã‚ƒã£ãŸ must have been said at least 10 times. It's odd to think how automatically we tune out words we don't know (or maybe that's just me D: )

Recently, I called SM "the tits" (which is a very odd saying now that I look at it from a different perspective... ) My dad told me a story of how back in the '80's he had a co-worker who called everything awesome "the tits" (e.g. "That movie was the tits, man!") and my dad said it bugged the crap out of him... so of course my siblings and I used that term a bunch just to mess with him But it seems like as soon as my family started using that term a bunch I started noticing it being used on TV

The point I'm making is it's easy to think "Japanese expressions are weird!" from an English-speaking perspective, but our expressions are pretty damn weird too -- we're just used to them Awesome things are 'the feces' or 'the breasts' haha. Very strange huh?

"This food is shit!" (negative comment)
"This food is the shit!" (positive comment)
These are expressions are made even more confusing considering the Japanese language doesn't really have articles (the words 'a', 'an' and 'the')!
Reply With Quote
(#26 (permalink))
Old
Columbine's Avatar
Columbine (Offline)
Busier Than Shinjuku Station
 
Posts: 1,466
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: United Kingdom
08-15-2010, 04:59 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by StonerPenguin View Post
The point I'm making is it's easy to think "Japanese expressions are weird!" from an English-speaking perspective, but our expressions are pretty damn weird too -- we're just used to them Awesome things are 'the feces' or 'the breasts' haha. Very strange huh?
This is pretty true. I mean, how many of us use or know idioms in english without actually understanding them or why we use them? In fact, pop quiz! How well do you really understand these words?

"To keep mum"
"to pander"
"What the dickens~?"
Reply With Quote
(#27 (permalink))
Old
KyleGoetz's Avatar
KyleGoetz (Offline)
Attorney at Flaw
 
Posts: 2,965
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Texas
08-15-2010, 07:16 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by StonerPenguin View Post
A little something I'd like to add on my own experiences;
When I first started learning Japanese, my favorite way to practice was translating songs, which really isn't ideal considering that some Japanese songs are very complex...

Anyway, here's a line that messed with my brains; "大切ã«ã—ãªãã¡ã‚ƒ"
It took me a while to figure out that ã—ãªãã¡ --> ã—ãªã‘ã‚Œã°ãªã‚‰ãªã„ but then, I had never heard of 大切ã«ã™ã‚‹. So I translated it as "I must do it importantly" and was really confused. Now I know it means something along the lines of "I have to take care of it/cherish it"
ãªADJECTIVEã«ã™ã‚‹ tends to mean "to make something ADJECTIVE."
Reply With Quote
(#28 (permalink))
Old
steven (Offline)
JF Old Timer
 
Posts: 544
Join Date: Apr 2010
08-17-2010, 05:59 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by MMM View Post
It's always dead serious.
I'm pretty sure you're being sarcastic... and I hope you are. Either way, just for a little anecdote:

I don't think language learning should be taken as seriously as it is at all. I think that taking things too seriously is a cause of some of the failures of English education in Japan (some teachers are way cool though... but some are a little on the debbie downer side).

I've learned a LOT of ridiculous words in non-formal situations that I would've never learned in class. I think I would never have gotten away with it in class either.

When I was learning Japanese in college (after the head teacher had told me I should think about a different major... that's how bad I was), I decided to find Japanese friends on Skype. I think I must've just learned what the word "~ã£ã½ã„" meant. My friend showed me a new pair of rainboots that she'd bought recently and they just happened to be really colorful (maybe you guys have already figured out what I said). I basically said her boots were "ã„ã‚ã£ã½ã„", which is like saying "hey sexy rainboots!". I'm glad she didn't take it seriously! Getting laughed at was definitely humbling, but it was an experience I'll never forget.

There was another time when I was talking to one of my ex's (who happened to be Japanese) and I think she was complaining or making a joke about my chest hair, to which I responded with, "what, you don't like my man毛?!". I immediatly realized what I had said and was quite flustered as her mom was in the room! I meant to say "man", like "ç”·", but said it in waseieigo which resulted in one of the greatest ã„ã„ã¾ã¤ã’'s of all time. (Although it's not quite rated G ). Incidentally, I had never heard the word I had said at that point, but had built up enough intuition by then to realize what it meant. The expression on her face was also pretty indicative...

I have countless stories like this. The thing is, when you're learning a language, you can't be too serious all the time. You have to kind of let go and let it all flow out. If you make mistakes like I've made, you'll NEVER forget those words.

What you're looking for is a response. If you get a good response it's a success. If you get a bad response, then you have to think it over and just think of it as an experience. There's no possible way to be perfect while learning a second language. Taking things too seriously can be detrimental to your progress. Even natives make mistakes that are embarassing.
Reply With Quote
(#29 (permalink))
Old
manganimefan227's Avatar
manganimefan227 (Offline)
星ã®ç¿¼
 
Posts: 986
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: In a Starry Night with Fire flies
08-17-2010, 06:41 PM

Hey thank you for sticking up for me

I know there should be some serious in learning but no matter what, I was always the type to goof off alittle when I learned some things . . .The things I said in sixth grade . . .XD Good times!

Though since I see a new learning oppurtunity . . .

Would ãªå‡„ã„ã«ã™ã‚‹ mean "to make something awsome/amazing"?


My Life Sucks- The kids I babysit have drooled, ripped or drawn on all of the cards and put the cars with the little people in the microwave!

I have no Friends- The cats have scratched and destroyed all of the DVDs!

I always owe someone- In fact I put two os in it!

I always ruin my clothes with Bleach!- The show is so dom suspensful I spill my grape soda on them!

But . . .I'll live.
Reply With Quote
(#30 (permalink))
Old
steven (Offline)
JF Old Timer
 
Posts: 544
Join Date: Apr 2010
08-18-2010, 02:20 AM

Just for the record, there are two types of adjectives used in Japanese:
ãªadjectives (ナ形容詞) (形容詞ï¼ã‘ã„よã†ã—)
and
ã„adjectives (イ形容詞)

They are used a little bit differently.

So if you want to color something black, or make something black, you'd say:
é»’ãã™ã‚‹
The adjective is é»’ã„, which happens to be an イ形容詞.

If you want to make something flat, I suppose you could say:
平ら(ãŸã„ら)ã«ã™ã‚‹
The adjective 平ら happens to be a ナ形容詞

So for ナ形容詞, you should do it like this:
(na-adjective)ã«ã™ã‚‹

and for イ形容詞, you should do it like this:
(i-adjective, minus the ã„)ãã™ã‚‹

As far as your question in particular goes... I don't really remember ever hearing the phrase ~ã™ã”ãã™ã‚‹... you might try something like ã‹ã£ã“よãã™ã‚‹ or something along those lines. I'm not a native though so hopefully a native could let you know if people actually say that or not.

As a matter of fact, if you say ~ã‚’ã™ã”ãã™ã‚‹, in my experience it just means that you do a lot of it or something like that. For example, if you said something like "ã‚ã®äººè©±ã‚’ã™ã”ãã™ã‚‹ã‚ˆã­ï¼" (ã‚ã®ã²ã¨ã¯ãªã—ã‚’ã™ã”ãã™ã‚‹ã‚ˆã­ï¼ï¼‰ then it would mean something like "man, that person can really talk!" in English (with the implication that it's not really a good thing). To think of it as a phrase that means the person can take a story and make it amazing would be a misinterpretation in my opinion.
Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On




Copyright 2003-2006 Virtual Japan.
Search Engine Friendly URLs by vBSEO 3.0.0 RC6