Lost In Translation?

[bearcat]

Something I am struggling to understand: I can't claim to have
watched a lot of Japanese material. I've seen lots of Monster movies
(Godzilla, that type) and quite a bit of modern Anime.
Something I've noticed is that a LOT of the translated dialog
makes no sense whatsoever. I'm curious to know if this
is because the translators are incompetent, if there are special
expressions in Japanese that will not translate to English, no matter
what, or if the material is just badly written.
For example, I'm watching "Godzilla: Tokyo SOS".
Now, don't waste your breath telling me that this is junk.
I know it is junk. It isn't "Seven Samurai", I already know that.

However, things I keep noticing in Japanese movies are this:

1. Overstating the obvious, and doing it multiple times
in the same conversation. Case in point is the conversation at 0:21:27 in the aforementioned movie, which I am streaming off of Netflix right now.

2. Emotional reactions and exclamations that are completely absurd and out-of-context. This isn't just twitlike young girls screaming and exclaiming: Everyone makes incredibly stupid and over-the-top exclamations
that don't fit the situation, at all.....do Japanese flip out like this in real life? I had the idea that most Japanese are very restrained and polite?

I guess it boils down to that: it isn't just excited utterances. This is ALL dialog, every scene has a comment or emotion that doesn't match the situation at all!

To a very small extent, it's similar to the mismatch in dubbing between sound and lip movements, except the words you are hearing don't make any sense inside the story?!

[MMM]

Since you are streaming off of Netflix I assume you are watching a dubbed and not subbed version of the movie.

This is likely a source of the problem. When a movie is dubbed, a bilingual speaker can't look at the subtitles and say "That's not what he said!" but unless they are expert lip readers as well, no one can tell what had been changed from the original Japanese.

The problem is lip matching, so that while lips are moving some dialog must be being said. As a result you get superfluous lines, repeated dialog, and stuff that just doesn't make sense.

[Tturtle]

Does this happen in many other movies you have watched? This Godzilla film you are watching seems retarded or something. Not that it couldn't still be enjoyable to watch.

[Tturtle]

Originally Posted by MMM

Since you are streaming off of Netflix I assume you are watching a dubbed and not subbed version of the movie.

This is likely a source of the problem. When a movie is dubbed, a bilingual speaker can't look at the subtitles and say "That's not what he said!" but unless they are expert lip readers as well, no one can tell what had been changed from the original Japanese.

The problem is lip matching, so that while lips are moving some dialog must be being said. As a result you get superfluous lines, repeated dialog, and stuff that just doesn't make sense.

To add to what MMM said its worth noting that sometimes when movies are brought to another country entire plotlines are removed so what you are watching may not be a "translation" at all. That may also be what you are experiencing with the repetivenes.

[bearcat]

Originally Posted by MMM

Since you are streaming off of Netflix I assume you are watching a dubbed and not subbed version of the movie.

This is likely a source of the problem. When a movie is dubbed, a bilingual speaker can't look at the subtitles and say "That's not what he said!" but unless they are expert lip readers as well, no one can tell what had been changed from the original Japanese.

The problem is lip matching, so that while lips are moving some dialog must be being said. As a result you get superfluous lines, repeated dialog, and stuff that just doesn't make sense.

Thanks for your response. Yes, this movie is dubbed, not subtitled.
Usually, subtitles are really very good, almost never weird or stupid.
I don't understand why that would be.

I'm not completely sure we understand each other. The situation really has nothing at all to do with the fact that what is heard and how the lips move does not match.

It is the statements that are made. I guess to completely understand me, you'd have to go to the "Godzilla: Tokyo SOS" movie, fast forward to the section I mentioned, and watch the conversation between the Japanese Prime Minister and the old retired guy.
The retired guy says he wants the Mechagodzilla project shut down, and something like ten seconds later, the president says, "So, what you're saying is, you want the Mechagodzilla project shut down."
WTF? WHY repeat that? Just wrong and weird!

It's as if the people are all retarded or something. It isn't just bad movies.....even the GOOD japanese anime and movies have this problem......saying stuff that doesn't need to be said, repeating what the other person just said, making comments that don't fit the situation.

I'm just insanely curoius to know WHY this happens:

1. Translators who are incompetent;
2. Japanese scripts are always this way;
3. Japanese people really do talk this way all the time.
4. Some other reason?


Do Japanese people frequently quote/repeat what's already been
said in order to show respect in some twisted way?

[Aniki]

I was hoping this thread will be about the movie. Too bad.

[bearcat]

Originally Posted by Tturtle

To add to what MMM said its worth noting that sometimes when movies are brought to another country entire plotlines are removed so what you are watching may not be a "translation" at all. That may also be what you are experiencing with the repetivenes.

That makes sense. Some company that doesn't care at all, with underpaid workers, inserts junk that doesn't really match the story. Makes good sense.

[MMM]

Originally Posted by bearcat

Thanks for your response. Yes, this movie is dubbed, not subtitled.
Usually, subtitles are really very good, almost never weird or stupid.
I don't understand why that would be.

I'm not completely sure we understand each other. The situation really has nothing at all to do with the fact that what is heard and how the lips move does not match.

It is the statements that are made. I guess to completely understand me, you'd have to go to the "Godzilla: Tokyo SOS" movie, fast forward to the section I mentioned, and watch the conversation between the Japanese Prime Minister and the old retired guy.
The retired guy says he wants the Mechagodzilla project shut down, and something like ten seconds later, the president says, "So, what you're saying is, you want the Mechagodzilla project shut down."
WTF? WHY repeat that? Just wrong and weird!

It's as if the people are all retarded or something. It isn't just bad movies.....even the GOOD japanese anime and movies have this problem......saying stuff that doesn't need to be said, repeating what the other person just said, making comments that don't fit the situation.

I'm just insanely curoius to know WHY this happens:

1. Translators who are incompetent;
2. Japanese scripts are always this way;
3. Japanese people really do talk this way all the time.
4. Some other reason?


Do Japanese people frequently quote/repeat what's already been
said in order to show respect in some twisted way?

I am understanding you. I am saying it may be "none of the above".

1. If a translator is incompetent it becomes clear early on, and they should be let go. What a translator writes is not written in stone, and that script goes through several hands before filming begins.

2. Having seen dozens of Japanese movies, nope.

3. Nope.

4. What I said.

[bearcat]

I got some good answers elsewhere:

The Japanese find it rude to simply answer "Yes" or "No".
an explanation, often an elaborate one, has to accompany the reply.

The Japanese use body language MUCH more than Westerners, and what we consider overstatement is
considered normal.

The wordy replies in Japanese films make the mouth move for a long time, so the translators struggle to fill this in with more English words, resulting in some repetition and absurdity.

[MMM]

Originally Posted by bearcat

I got some good answers elsewhere:

The Japanese find it rude to simply answer "Yes" or "No".
an explanation, often an elaborate one, has to accompany the reply.

I think a better way of putting that is that Japanese conversation is less direct, so when a simple yes or no would do, often the answer is less direct...especially if it is an answer that the asker is not going to like.

Originally Posted by bearcat

The Japanese use body language MUCH more than Westerners, and what we consider overstatement is
considered normal.

I am curious where you got this one. I remember reading a scale of how much communication is done through gestures, Italy was number 1 (or near the top) and Japan was at or near the bottom. The US fell somewhere in the middle.

I would say what we consider understatement is normal in Japan. Many Westerners not accustomed to Japanese communication will miss cues that answer questions because they are used to direct answers, not more subtle, indirect answers

Originally Posted by bearcat

The wordy replies in Japanese films make the mouth move for a long time, so the translators struggle to fill this in with more English words, resulting in some repetition and absurdity.

Isn't that what I said in the first place?