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Location: Kawasaki,Japan
07-21-2010, 09:03 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sashimister View Post
@yt & Yytt

そろそろ日本語レッスン始めないと逃げられちゃうぞ~ 。もう二度と来ないからね、こういう人。

チャットに走り過ぎではないかなと、老婆心ながら危惧 する次第です。とにかく、ドカンと一度始めないと、こ のままダラダラいきそうでおっかない。

(いっそのこと乗っ取っちゃおうかな、スレごと・・・ ・なーんて、ウソ。でもそう考える人がもし入ってきた ら、マジで簡単に乗っ取られるよ。まだ、日本語レッス ンは始まってもいないんだから。)
組長、押忍!
チャーリーズ・エンジェルって…一人足りなくないです か?

日本語レッスンをドカンと始めると言っても、わたしと しては、これで十分はじめてるつもりなんですけど…?
覚さんは、日本語学習サイトで自分で勉強すると言って るので、
彼のペースを乱さない程度に、興味を日本にひきつけて るつもりです。
忙しい人で、週末しか勉強できないと言っているので、
学習のペースはかなり遅いと予想されます。
かれが自分で質問をしてくるまで、このペースでいくつ もりだったんですが、
ダメでしょうかねえ???
だってさー、人に日本語教えたことなんか、ないんだも ~ん


Hello, I may not understand English very well and I may lack words but I will try to understand you.

If you have questions about my post or Japanese customs, don't hesitate to ask.

I YamaP
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07-22-2010, 05:00 AM

Why Japan prefers a monocultural society.
This is my answer to Kakusa’s comment.


Kakusan: Of course in the case of the Potato Famine, there were many other historical factors that induced the dependence upon potatoes, but when one has the choice it is certainly preferable not to rely upon a single variety of crops.

Yuri: In Ogasawara Islands which is located in the south of Tokyo, there had been about 350 endemic insects, but alien species are exterminating most of them. Especially, a green anole (lizard) has a very big effect to the insects and plants in the Islands. This is only one example and alien species have been doing a lot of damage to Japanese endemic insects, plants, fish and animals throughout Japan.


Kakusan: In genetics, too, we see that if we have two specimens that are weak due to high homozygosity, but they are highly heterozygous with respect to one another, so to speak, their offspring will be much stronger, larger and healthier.

Yuri: I do not see why you need to be large. I do not fight hand-in-hand combat or hunt animals. I’m sure that I have enough muscle strength, and Japan has the world’s highest longevity rate. I think this means Japanese people are healthy.


Kakusan: However, if one society comprises many cultures rather than just one, then it is much more likely that the society as a whole will be able to find within itself those cultural resources with which to equip itself against the new difficulty. In this way, we can learn from those who are different from us how best to cope with unfamiliar situations.

Yuri: We can learn from other country because we can study abroad when we need. I do not see why you need to live together in one society.


Kakusan: In turn this eventually leads to a more peaceful society.

Yuri: Do you know that Japan is very safe and girls can walk outside alone in the middle of the night wearing skirts and high heels? I do not think the UK and the US are more peaceful.


Kakusan: People will always find reasons to hate one another. Whether they be religion, culture or skin colour,

Yuri: Japanese people do not hate people because of religion or skin color. I do not see why you hate people because of such reason. Japan persecuted Christianity in 17th century, but it was just to prevent being colonized by Western countries.


Kakusan: I understand what you are saying about "reading between the lines" and hearing what is left unsaid. However, when we have to learn how to do this with a new group of people with different mores, we leave our "comfort zone" and both exercise a new area of our brain and learn something about ourselves which could not have otherwise been revealed.

Yuri: When moving in a new workplace, after saying nice to meet you, you say like you do not know anything and ask to tell everything in Japan. This is the Japanese way to say things. We do not expect that other co-workers would tell me everything, but we say like that because attitude of self-confidence is hated when you first meet people. On the other hand, Western people always show their self-confidence, and if you say things like Japanese, they would hate or look down on you, right? I believe the Japanese way of saying is from the Japanese spirit. Do we need to change our culture and spirit? I do not want to.
When we go abroad, we conform to your way, but in Japan, we want to be ourselves.


Kakusan: Obviously there is the long-term history of the "Bamboo Curtain",

Yuri: Bamboo Curtain is of China.


Kakusan: So, to take a very broad, overall message from history, one could get the impression that Japanese interactions with the "outside" have had a tremendously unfortunate negative tendency.

Yuri: Yes. In addition, our culture and spirit is different from yours, so when you behave ordinary, sometimes we can’t help feeling you are cowards, because we do not have the culture of debate. I think Japanese people may have been feeling we have been agued down by foreign people.


Kakusan: In this sense, it seems to me, and correct me if I'm wrong, that Japan has benefited from an exclusive kind of "multiculturalism of ideas" in a way that few other nations can claim to have done.

Yuri: Yes, you are right. So, I do not see why we have to live with foreign people when we can get a lot of information about foreign countries easily.
I don’t dislike foreign people, I love foreign countries, but still I prefer a monocultural society than a multicultural one to live myself.


Thank you.
覚さん、Could you correct my English?


Hello, I may not understand English very well and I may lack words but I will try to understand you.

If you have questions about my post or Japanese customs, don't hesitate to ask.

I YamaP

Last edited by YuriTokoro : 07-22-2010 at 02:24 PM.
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07-22-2010, 02:19 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by sarvodaya View Post
こんにちは。
覚さん こんにちは!
Quote:
Ah, yes, I looked it up. Monkey!
But it looks like when you use it for a person it might be more like "cheeky monkey",
or something indicating a sly person. Is that correct?
Yes, it's correct! I checked my dictionary too.I didn't know how to use the word さる like that. 
Even now I know the usage,I probablly won't use さる that way. Because I love さる so much!

But Im glad that we have ゆりさん here to come up with a good name for you!

Quote:
Yes, I like サル too, especially orangutans and gorillas, although of course they are actually apes!
But I see サル often means the Japanese Macaque.
It's lovely to see them bathing in the hot springs surrounded by snow:
そうですね。かわいいです!

Guess what?! Actually they are my neiboures
We live in the same prefecture called 長野県 (Nagano ken)!
(I basically live in 神奈川県(Kanagawa ken) but I go to Nagano almost every week and stay there for 3-7days,so I kind of live there too)
I have been that Onsen area to see the monkeys!

覚さん、覚さん、Look!
This is my favourite one!
YouTube - お猿の温泉で有名な「地獄谷野猿公苑」

I hope you enjoy watching all the かわいい おさるさんたち!

You will see the subtitles there,but there are too many 漢字s, so let's come back here together to read them when you feel more confortable with 漢字s.

********
Im sorry 覚さん Im afraid my last posts have too many 漢字s and all.
So let's go back there later

********
So...How are you going with your ひらがな(and カタカナ) study?
Are there any characters confuse you?

When I started learning English Alphabet, b and d confused me all the time.
The other day one of my students told me she often forgot how to write q.
Here is how I told her to remember it (the pic below)
Im ready to give you some quiz/test/homework about ひらがな and カタカナ so when you are ready, please let me know!

Have a good day(^^)/

Last edited by yumyumtimtam : 03-04-2011 at 04:56 PM.
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07-27-2010, 12:01 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by YuriTokoro View Post
Yes, but Japanese people would say 「頑張ります(がんばります)≒I will try hard.」.
「頑張ります」is a politer version of 「頑張る(がんばる)」.
“頑張る”の検索結果(72 件):英辞郎 on the Web:スペースアルク
When you try something, you say 「頑張ります」to somebody.
When your friend is trying something, you say「頑張ってください(がんばってください)≒Good luck! Or Give it your all.」to the friend. The casual saying of this is 「頑張って」and「頑張れ」. (Women would say 「頑張ってね」)
ゆりさん、こんばんは。

I am still here! Sorry for disappearing, I have been buried under work and a couple of other matters, but I have now tunnelled to the surface and I am poking my head out...

Quote:
Do you know the Japanese language has men’s way and Women’s way?
When men would say 「頑張れ」, women would say 「頑張ってね」meaning Good luck.
Many women speak like men when they speak casually, but if you(a man) say something like women, you would sound like gender identity disorder.
However, don’t worry. Polite expressions are same between men and women. Men and women say 「頑張ります」and 「頑張ってください」.
Hmm... I didn't know this. So does the "women's way" come from the -て form with ね added to the end?

Quote:
I believe that 行ってらっしゃい was originally 気をつけて行ってらっしゃい。This means like Go well or Go carefully.
Nowadays some people say 「行ってらっしゃい。気をつけて。」

I’m home is 「ただいま」.
We say it every time we get home.
The literal translation is “just now”.
The original and polite expression of「ただいま」 is「只今(ただいま)戻りました(もどりました)≒I’ m back now.」
When you returned to your office (after going out), you say 只今戻りました to your co-workers and your boss.

When you get home and say 「ただいま」, your family say 「お帰りなさい(おかえりなさい)」
I know that you say “Welcome back” when someone return from a long absence, but we say 「ただいま」when I was out only for 30 min and my family say 「お帰りなさい」.
The casual version is 「お帰り(おかえり)」.

So, we say these words every day.
「行ってきます」「行ってらっしゃい」
「ただいま」「お帰りなさい」
I see, that's very helpful ゆりさん, ありがとうございました。

Quote:
I will tell you some expressions you say when you start eating next time.
I have put these in my book; I will practise them all and wait for the new expressions!

Quote:
This is your home work.
This is a very popular Japanese song.
Almost all Japanese people know this.
When you go to Karaoke with Japanese people, sing this song!


Title:ああ人生に涙あり (ああじんせいになみだあり)
Wow, thanks for this. Once I learn this the music will help me to remember the new words.
I have toiled over it, and I think I have translated the first verse:

Quote:
人生 楽ありゃ 苦もあるさ (じんせい らくありゃ  くもあるさ)
In life there is comfort; there is hardship too,

Quote:
涙のあとには 虹も出る  (なみだのあとには にじ もでる)
After tears a rainbow will appear.

Quote:
歩いてゆくんだ しっかりと  (あるいてゆくんだ  しっかりと)
自分の道を ふみしめて  (じぶんのみちを ふみし めて)
In order to proceed along the path, walk and step firmly.

Quote:
人生 勇気が必要だ  (じんせい ゆうきがひつよう だ)
くじけりゃ 誰かが先に行く (くじけりゃ だれかが さきにゆく)
あとから来たのに 追い越され  (あとからきたのに  おいこされ)
泣くのが嫌なら さあ歩け  (なくのがいやなら さ ああるけ)

人生 涙と笑顔あり
そんなに悪くは ないもんだ
なんにもしないで 生きるより
何かを求めて 生きようよ
Is that anywhere near correct?

I'm really not sure about those last two lines. I know あるいて is "walking", ゆく is "to proceed" or "to move forward", しっかり is "firmly", じぶん is "self", みち is "way" or "path" [through life], を means "along" and ふみしめて is "step firmly", but I'm really not sure how it all fits together...!

I will tackle the next two verses next time.

Quote:
I have posted your comment. Now you see it properly.
Thank you for reposting my comment, now it can be seen properly; but what I meant was that my editorial comment:
Quote:
[this sentence is a little ambiguous, perhaps you mean "Many Japanese people aren't used to saying everything explicitly" or "Many Japanese people aren't used to spelling everything out in detail"?]
was left in the body of your composition; it just needs to be removed.

Quote:
Oh! I almost forgot again!
Do you have a dictionary of kanji? I don’t mean a Japanese dictionary. It’s kanji dictionary or kanwa dictionary.
Amazon.co.jp: ベネッセ新修漢和辞&#x 5178;: 新田 大作, 福井 文雅: 本
No, I don't. For kanji I have mostly been relying on google and sites like:

mahou Kanji Dictionary!
and
Kanji - Tangorin.com Japanese Dictionary

to find out what they mean and how to write/draw them.

I should get a proper dictionary once I start using kanji regularly...

Now I see you have completed your reply, so I must take a look at it.....



ニックネームは「覚醒(sarvodaya)」からとって「覚(か く)」です。

Kaku is the nickname given to me by ゆりさん, derived from the word sarvodaya (सर्वोदय). This, in turn, is a word that was used by Mohandas Gandhi in his 1908 translation of John Ruskin's "Unto This Last" (1860s).
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TV crew - 07-27-2010, 10:59 AM

Apparently we had a Japanese TV crew in the office yesterday. I must have missed them!

Still, keep an eye out and tell me if you see the OUP on tv.


ニックネームは「覚醒(sarvodaya)」からとって「覚(か く)」です。

Kaku is the nickname given to me by ゆりさん, derived from the word sarvodaya (सर्वोदय). This, in turn, is a word that was used by Mohandas Gandhi in his 1908 translation of John Ruskin's "Unto This Last" (1860s).
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Corrections for Yurisan - 07-27-2010, 11:41 AM

I wasn't really trying to argue and prove that multiculturalism is decisively the best course, but merely to explain what I believe is the thinking behind multiculturalism as a plausible premise. We can have a bit of a to and fro debate if you like though!

Here are the corrections:

Quote:
Originally Posted by YuriTokoro View Post
Why Japan prefers a monocultural society.
This is my answer to Kakusa’s comment.


Kakusan: Of course in the case of the Potato Famine, there were many other historical factors that induced the dependence upon potatoes, but when one has the choice it is certainly preferable not to rely upon a single variety of crops.

Yuri: In Ogasawara Islands which is located in the south of Tokyo, there were about 350 endemic insects, but alien species are exterminating most of them. In particular, a green anole (lizard) has had a profound impact on the native [sounds a little more natural] insects and plants. This is only one example and alien species have been doing a lot of damage to [EITHER: ]"endemic Japanese insects, plants, fish and animals" [OR] "endemic insects, plants, fish and animals throughout Japan.

Kakusan: In genetics, too, we see that if we have two specimens that are weak due to high homozygosity, but they are highly heterozygous with respect to one another, so to speak, their offspring will be much stronger, larger and healthier.

Yuri: I do not see why you need to be large. I do not fight hand-in-hand combat or hunt animals. I’m sure that I have enough muscle strength, and Japan has the world’s highest longevity rate. I think this means Japanese people are healthy.

Kakusan: However, if one society comprises many cultures rather than just one, then it is much more likely that the society as a whole will be able to find within itself those cultural resources with which to equip itself against the new difficulty. In this way, we can learn from those who are different from us how best to cope with unfamiliar situations.

Yuri: We can learn from other countries because we can study abroad when necessary. I do not see why you need to live together in one society.

Kakusan: In turn this eventually leads to a more peaceful society.

Yuri: Do you know that Japan is very safe and girls can walk outside alone in the middle of the night wearing skirts and high heels? I do not think the UK and the US are more peaceful.

Kakusan: People will always find reasons to hate one another. Whether they be religion, culture or skin colour,

Yuri: The Japanese do not hate people because of religion or skin colour. I do not see why you hate people for such reasons. Japan persecuted Christianity in the 17th century, but that was just to prevent being colonized by Western countries.

Kakusan: I understand what you are saying about "reading between the lines" and hearing what is left unsaid. However, when we have to learn how to do this with a new group of people with different mores, we leave our "comfort zone" and both exercise a new area of our brain and learn something about ourselves which could not have otherwise been revealed.

Yuri: In Japan, when you are starting out in a new workplace, after introducing yourself, you communicate that you know hardly anything and ask to be shown the ropes. This is the Japanese way to say things. We do not expect our co-workers to tell us everything, but we act like this because we find the attitude of self-confidence when you first meet people despicable. On the other hand, Western people always show their self-confidence, and if you were to act like the Japanese, your co-workers would hate or look down on you, right? I believe this way of behaving comes from the Japanese spirit. Do we need to change our culture and spirit? I do not want to.
When we go abroad, we conform to your way, but in Japan, we want to be ourselves.

Kakusan: Obviously there is the long-term history of the "Bamboo Curtain",

Yuri: Bamboo Curtain is of China.
Perhaps it's different in Japan, but in the west we refer to the Japanese policy of isolationism during the Edo period as the "bamboo curtain". Here are some examples:
Quote:
"From time to time enterprising Yankee sea captains had defied the boycott of the hated foreigners, but nevertheless found it impossible to raise that bamboo curtain which cut the native Japanese off from contact with the West...
The documents were delivered to the princes Idzu and Iwami, representatives of the Emperor, in an interview which lasted no more than half an hour. His Imperial Highness, correct protocol or not, got the point of Fillmore's letter, responded through his commissioners in a friendly manner, and on March 31, 1854, made a treaty with the United States granting trade rights at the two ports of Hakodate and Shinoda. The bamboo curtain had at long last been lifted."
Great Presidential Decisions: State papers that changed the course of history — R. B. Morris, 1961; p180.
Full text of "Great Presidential Decisions State Papers That Changed The Coures Of History"

"Of course the bamboo curtain of Tokugawa seclusion was never completely impenetrable."
Albert Craig in The autobiography of Yukichi Fukuzawa; p.374

"In 1853, Commodore Perry of the US Navy arrived in Japan with a flotilla of warships to end Japan's "Bamboo Curtain" against the West."

"In 1853, when Commodore Perry lifted the bamboo curtain that surrounded Japan, the Landreth Company sent along a box of seeds and in return received a box of Japanese seeds."
Jefferson's garden - Google Books

"In those days Japan was a highly civilized, open country with large military forces and merchant fleets trading throughout the vast eastern Pacific. Dutch and Spanish traders and diplomats were followed by missionaries seeking to Christianize the Japanese. The activities of such men as Vizcaino, and in particular the increasing arrival of missionaries, were in large measure responsible for a sudden and drastic decision which shut Japan off from the modem world. It remained, withdrawn and sullen, behind its own bamboo curtain until the arrival of Commodore Perry in 1853."
https://www.sandiegohistory.org/book...rschapter5.htm

"After short periods of limited trade with some European countries (primarily Holland but only on an off-shore trading zone) in the early 17th century, Japan once again closed the bamboo curtain solidly to the west."
Hempen Culture In Japan
Of course this is also used to refer to the isolationist policy of communist China, so it can be confusing. I think you call it 鎖国 or 海禁.

Quote:
Kakusan: So, to take a very broad, overall message from history, one could get the impression that Japanese interactions with the "outside" have had a tremendously unfortunate negative tendency.

Yuri: Yes. In addition, our culture and spirit is different from yours; so when you behave ordinary, sometimes we can’t help feeling you are cowards because we do not have the culture of debate [not exactly sure what you mean here, perhaps elaborate a bit?]. I think Japanese people sometimes feel we have been argued down by foreign people.

Kakusan: In this sense, it seems to me, and correct me if I'm wrong, that Japan has benefited from an exclusive kind of "multiculturalism of ideas" in a way that few other nations can claim to have done.

Yuri: Yes, you are right. So, I do not see why we have to live with foreign people when we can get a lot of information about foreign countries easily.
I don’t dislike foreign people, I love foreign countries, but still I personally prefer to live in a monocultural society rather than a multicultural one.

Thank you.
覚さん、Could you correct my English?


ニックネームは「覚醒(sarvodaya)」からとって「覚(か く)」です。

Kaku is the nickname given to me by ゆりさん, derived from the word sarvodaya (सर्वोदय). This, in turn, is a word that was used by Mohandas Gandhi in his 1908 translation of John Ruskin's "Unto This Last" (1860s).
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Talking ヤムさん! - 07-27-2010, 12:07 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by yumyumtimtam View Post
覚さん こんにちは!
ヤムさん こんにちは!

Quote:
そうですね。かわいいです!
"Isn't it. They're cute!"

I concur.

Quote:
Guess what?! Actually they are my neighbours
We live in the same prefecture called 長野県 (Nagano ken)!
(I basically live in 神奈川県(Kanagawa ken) but I go to Nagano almost every week and stay there for 3-7 days,so I kind of live there too)
I have been that Onsen area to see the monkeys!
...
I hope you enjoy watching all the かわいい おさるさんたち!
Yes they are very sweet! Especially that tiny one at around 3:00! I also find their grumpy faces hilarious! Overall, however, I still must concur with your original analysis that they are cute...!

Quote:
You will see the subtitles there,but there are too many 漢字s, so let's come back here together to read them when you feel more comfortable with 漢字s.
Yes, I couldn't read any of that...!

Quote:
********
I'm sorry 覚さん I'm afraid my last posts have too many 漢字s and all.
So let's go back there later

********
So...How are you going with your ひらがな(and カタカナ) study?
Are there any characters confuse you?
Erm, almost all of them...? Actually it's not too bad. I'm trying to get used to them just by using them and going over things we've said here; I find it very helpful to have examples. As I get used to them, though, I'm picking up on patterns that don't make sense to me.

For instance:

ま and よ have similarities of form, but sound completely different.
As with え and ん and others...

But I guess I'm only looking for patterns because their are patterns of same vowels and same consonants in the sounds, which don't correspond to any of the same forms; whereas in English the letters have not born any significance in themselves for thousands of years, so perhaps I shouldn't be looking for a pattern...?

Quote:
When I started learning English Alphabet, b and d confused me all the time.
The other day one of my students told me she often forgot how to write q.
Here is how I told her to remember it (the pic below)
Ah yes, that's good, but I don't get the second one; why is q like 9?

Quote:
I'm ready to give you some quiz/test/homework about ひらがな and カタカナ so when you are ready, please let me know!
A quiz sounds good...

Quote:
Have a good day(^^)/
行ってきます!



ニックネームは「覚醒(sarvodaya)」からとって「覚(か く)」です。

Kaku is the nickname given to me by ゆりさん, derived from the word sarvodaya (सर्वोदय). This, in turn, is a word that was used by Mohandas Gandhi in his 1908 translation of John Ruskin's "Unto This Last" (1860s).
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ああ人生に涙あり - 07-27-2010, 11:19 PM

Haha! This has been playing on my mind, and I think I'm quite close...

Quote:
Originally Posted by YuriTokoro View Post
This is your home work.
This is a very popular Japanese song.
Almost all Japanese people know this.
When you go to Karaoke with Japanese people, sing this song!


Title:ああ人生に涙あり (ああじんせいになみだあり)

人生 楽ありゃ 苦もあるさ (じんせい らくありゃ  くもあるさ)
In life there is comfort; there is hardship too,

Quote:
涙のあとには 虹も出る  (なみだのあとには にじ もでる)
After tears a rainbow will appear.

Quote:
歩いてゆくんだ しっかりと  (あるいてゆくんだ  しっかりと)
自分の道を ふみしめて  (じぶんのみちを ふみし めて)
In order to proceed along the path, walk and step firmly.

Quote:
人生 勇気が必要だ  (じんせい ゆうきがひつよう だ)
In life courage is essential

Quote:
くじけりゃ 誰かが先に行く (くじけりゃ だれかが さきにゆく)
One once crushed can carry on

Quote:
あとから来たのに 追い越され  (あとからきたのに  おいこされ)
Coming from ruination and yet leaving it behind

Quote:
泣くのが嫌なら さあ歩け  (なくのがいやなら さ ああるけ)
If it is unpleasant to weep, come now and walk.

Quote:
人生 涙と笑顔あり
そんなに悪くは ないもんだ
なんにもしないで 生きるより
何かを求めて 生きようよ
Is that anywhere near correct? Please give me a hint!



ニックネームは「覚醒(sarvodaya)」からとって「覚(か く)」です。

Kaku is the nickname given to me by ゆりさん, derived from the word sarvodaya (सर्वोदय). This, in turn, is a word that was used by Mohandas Gandhi in his 1908 translation of John Ruskin's "Unto This Last" (1860s).
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YuriTokoro (Offline)
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Location: Kawasaki,Japan
07-28-2010, 07:17 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by sarvodaya View Post
ゆりさん、こんばんは。
覚さん、こんばんは。

Quote:
I am still here! Sorry for disappearing, I have been buried under work and a couple of other matters, but I have now tunnelled to the surface and I am poking my head out...
Your expressions seem to be very unique.
Do British people usually speak like you?

Quote:
Hmm... I didn't know this. So does the "women's way" come from the -て form with ね added to the end?
Sometimes, yes.
However, there are some other ways to make women’s way.

For example:
Could you pass me the salt, please?:
≒(Both men and women) 「塩(しお)をとってくださいませんか」「塩 とっていただけますか」
(a little less polite) 「塩をとってくれませんか」「塩をとってくだ さい」
(women sometimes) 「塩をとってくださいません?」

Pass me the salt!:
≒(both)「塩をとって」
(a little politer than 「塩をとって」) 「塩をとってくれる?」
(men: a little politer than 「塩をとって」) 「塩を(とって)くれないか」
(men) 「塩を(とって)くれ」
(women) 「塩を(とって)ちょうだい」「塩を(とって)くれ い?」「お塩ちょうだい」「お塩とってくれる?」

Salt!:
≒(Both)「塩!」

I think there are too many expressions.
So, at first, you should learn only polite expressions. Otherwise, you would go insane.

I know that you have some other expressions like “I was wondering if you could pass me the salt” or something, but the Japanese language is a little more complicated.

You don’t need to learn all the expressions I have written above.
I just want you to know there are too many expressions in Japanese.

By the way, Professor Sashimister advised me that you shouldn’t try to learn too many kanji within a short period of time, or you would get fed up with the Japanese language.
So, don’t care kanji I write for a while. I will write in hiragana or katakana too. I just hope kanji will be familiar to you.

Quote:
Wow, thanks for this. Once I learn this the music will help me to remember the new words.
I just want you to listen to the Japanese pronunciation many times.

Once, I had an American friend. (He is not my friend any more, I think.)
He started studying Japanese and came to Japan for a week.
A cat is “neko” in Japanese, but he said it “neekou”, shoes is “kutsu”, but he said “kuutsuu”, so I didn’t understand what he said at all.
I just want you to get used to Japanese sound. I think you understand what I mean. After you listen to the sound a lot, you say it easily.
By the way, he(my ex-friend) was an attorney and very sure he would learn Japanese soon. However, he seems to have threw up Japanese and become dislike Japan.

Quote:
I have toiled over it, and I think I have translated the first verse:

In life there is comfort; there is hardship too,
Great!!

Quote:
After tears a rainbow will appear.
Genius! You are talented!


Quote:
In order to proceed along the path, walk and step firmly.

I'm really not sure about those last two lines. I know あるいて is "walking", ゆく is "to proceed" or "to move forward", しっかり is "firmly", じぶん is "self", みち is "way" or "path" [through life], を means "along" and ふみしめて is "step firmly", but I'm really not sure how it all fits together...!
Japanese lyrics are very difficult to translate into English, and yet you have done excellently.
あるいてゆくcan has many meanings. In this song it means like “carry on living”.
ふみしめて can be step firmly, but the Japanese sentence has something more, you know, this song is about a life, not just some roads.

So I would translate these two lines as:
Carry on steadily
Keeping your foot firmly on your way
(This is liberal translation, thought)

However, my English is really bad. I’m not sure my English makes sense.
Frankly speaking, I can’t tell your translation’s hidden shades of meanings or something.
Your's must be really great.


Quote:
I will tackle the next two verses next time.
人生 涙と笑顔あり(じんせい なみだとえがおあり)
そんなに悪くは ないもんだ (そんなにわるくは な いもんんだ)
なんにもしないで 生きるより (なんにもしないで  いきるより)
何かを求めて 生きようよ (なにかをもとめて いき ようよ)


Quote:
Thank you for reposting my comment, now it can be seen properly; but what I meant was that my editorial comment:

was left in the body of your composition; it just needs to be removed.
Thank you! I forgot.

This seems to be very good.
When you study kanji, you need to know the stroke orders to write them. The stroke orders are very important.
Still, you shouldn’t study kanji too hard for now.

Quote:
I should get a proper dictionary once I start using kanji regularly...
You don’t need to buy one now. The web site will do.

Quote:
Originally Posted by sarvodaya View Post
I wasn't really trying to argue and prove that multiculturalism is decisively the best course, but merely to explain what I believe is the thinking behind multiculturalism as a plausible premise. We can have a bit of a to and fro debate if you like though!
Thank you for correcting my English. I will study where you’ve corrected.

If you feel like saying something about my comment, I will accept your challenge!!
However, I’ve never learned how to debate at all. Most Japanese schools don’t teach it. In Japanese society, it is supposed that the silent type is better than silver tongue.
In addition, I don’t even know what real debate is. So, when you find my comment is strange, tell me, please.

Quote:
Perhaps it's different in Japan, but in the west we refer to the Japanese policy of isolationism during the Edo period as the "bamboo curtain". Here are some examples:
I didn’t know this. The dictionary says bamboo curtain is of china after WW2. I believe that most Japanese people haven’t heard the word.
Now, we are talking in English, then I respect your way, so OK, you can call it Bamboo curtain.

Quote:
Of course this is also used to refer to the isolationist policy of communist China, so it can be confusing. I think you call it 鎖国 or 海禁.
It’s鎖国. I’ve never heard the word海禁. This may be Chinese?


New Expressions:

You say 「いただきます」when you start eating.
This 「いただきます」is usually translated as “Let’s eat!”, but this expression is not only a call, but an expression of thanks to the cook, the person who has afforded the food, the gods, the nature and all the things which have produced the food.
So you should say this with a sense of gratitude.
The person who has made the food also says this.

Besides, いただきます has many other meanings.
“いただきます”の検索結果(290 件):英辞郎 on the Web:スペースアルク

You should learn this as a saying when you start eating today.

When you finish eating, you say 「ごちそうさまでした」, and its literal translation is “That was a delicious meal”.
When you say it casually, it’s 「ごちそうさま」.
“ごちそうさま”の検索結果(11 件):英辞郎 on the Web:スペースアルク
You should say it with a sense of gratitude too.

After you say ごちそうさまでした, the cook replies;
「おそまつさまでした」
そまつ(粗末) means meager, but when the food was not meager, the cook still says this.
I believe this original was;
When you have guests and cooked for them, you say 「おそまつさまでした」meaning “Don’t mind about the food. You don’t need to repay. You can forget.”
These days, this expression has become daily words.

それでは、日本語、がんばってください。Take it easy!
ゆり


Hello, I may not understand English very well and I may lack words but I will try to understand you.

If you have questions about my post or Japanese customs, don't hesitate to ask.

I YamaP
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07-28-2010, 08:02 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by sarvodaya View Post
Haha! This has been playing on my mind, and I think I'm quite close...
If you like the song, I’m very happy.

Quote:
In life courage is essential
Yes!! You need courage to live!!

Quote:
One once crushed can carry on

Coming from ruination and yet leaving it behind
Sorry. I don’t understand what you mean.
So I write here the meaning of these two lines in Japanese.

あなた/わたしが 誰かに(だれかに)/何かで(なにかで) 負けたと(まけたと) 思って( おもって) 止まっている(とまっている) 間に(あ いだに)、
誰か(だれか) ほかの人(ひと)が あなた/わたしの 先に行きます(さきにいきます)

後から(あとから) 来た人に(きたひとに) 追い越 されて(おいこされて)


泣くのが嫌なら さあ歩け
Quote:
If it is unpleasant to weep, come now and walk.
This is very good.

Now you understand that this song’s hidden subject is “you” in English.
I mean the both the singer and the listeners.
the writer has avoided あなたorわたし in the lyrics on purpose.
In English, you just can say “you” meaning both the speaker and the listeners, but in Japanese, the word would beわたしたちorわれわれ(我々), and these words can’t fit this song.
So the writer didn’t put the subject.


人生 涙と笑顔あり(じんせい なみだとえがおあり)
そんなに悪くは ないもんだ (そんなにわるくは な いもんんだ)
(人生は、悪いことばかりが起こるわけではありません 良いこともたくさんあります)

なんにもしないで 生きるより (なんにもしないで  いきるより)
何かを求めて 生きようよ (なにかをもとめて いき ようよ)

I think this might be easier than the second verse.
Good luck!


Hello, I may not understand English very well and I may lack words but I will try to understand you.

If you have questions about my post or Japanese customs, don't hesitate to ask.

I YamaP

Last edited by YuriTokoro : 07-28-2010 at 12:34 PM.
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