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08-28-2010, 09:30 PM

...
Quote:
Originally Posted by YuriTokoro View Post
Thank you!
I understand that “when” means two things happen in parallel, and “while” means the term is a bit longer. Is this right?
Broadly speaking, yes, but take note of the examples I gave and remember the phrase "When you are talking about the general case, say 'when', but while she was speaking about a particular case, she said 'while'."

Quote:
Originally Posted by sarvodaya View Post
However, it can also mean "during the time that..." in particular contexts such as using the present tense to talk about the general case:

"When the weather is nice, I'm happy."

"Sing when you're winning!"

"When you're away, I'm lonely and sad."

If we took these sentences out of the "general-case" sense and particularised them thus:

"I was happy while the weather was nice, but now I'm sad."

"He sang while he was winning."

"While you're away I will be lonely and sad."

Then "while" is more appropriate. Have I explained that well?

So, when you are talking about the general case, say "when"!

Thus, since we are talking about a general case here, I think we can say "when":

When you have lost something dear and feel like giving up,
Thus it's not just a question of the relative duration, but also whether or not we are talking about the general case, as in "what tends to happen" or "what tends to be the case".

I just want to be sure I have explained that well as it is a bit of an oddity!

Quote:
のに is not <nevertheless>.
“の”means 人in this context.
That meansあとから 来た人に 追い越されて
I see!
So that is what gives us "a person who came from behind", which I have rendered as "your successors".

Quote:
This is excellent!
ありがとうございました。

Quote:
Now, about “の”.
When you are pointing your pen, you say “This is mine.” That’s これは私のです。
You can say これは私のものです, and これは私のですmeans the same.
When you are holding one of your books, you can say これは私のです.

When you are in a parking lot, and being asked which your car is, you would say pointing at a car, “That red car is mine.” =「あの赤い車がわたしのです」=「あの赤いのが私の です」

Usually, の doesn’t indicate person or people, but when you speak casually, it can indicate 人.
“The person who is coming from behind is Sukesan.” = 後から来ているのが助さんです。

When you want to say it politely, and Sukesan is not one of your relatives; 後から来ている方(かた)が助さんです。
When Sukesan is one of your relaties; 後から来ているのが助です。

I have written some complicated things. You don’t need to remember the sentences as of now. I just want you to know that “の” can indicate material objects (and sometimes, a person or people), and there is Honorific speech in Japanese which is very complicated.
Honorific speech in Japanese - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Yes, I have heard about this; it is quite fascinating to me. I will have to wait to learn more about the details of honorific speech.

Quote:
Yes, that’s clear now. Thank you.
どういたしまして。

Quote:
I think you understand my meaning. I don’t accuse the colors of the Americans or the English people.
I don't think the word "accuse" is what you intended here. Perhaps "discriminate against"?

Quote:
Your attitude must be natural in their country. The problem must be there are great differences between us.


The word “Chicken-hearted” may be not good to describe Japan. I don’t know any right words.
Many Japanese people regard that the Japanese can’t say any “No” to foreign people, and almost always stub our toe over international negotiations.
When you can't say "no", it is often because you are "too polite".

When my mother was a little girl her father would offer her the last biscuit. She would say "no" out of politeness, despite the fact that she wanted it. He would then say "Are you sure? Go ahead." Then she would eat it. One day, to teach her a lesson, he offered her the last biscuit again. When she said "no" he gobbled it up. She expressed her surprise and he explained that you can be too polite, so of course she learned the lesson!

Quote:
My dictionary says that “cowardice” means 憶病 and卑怯, but憶病 and卑怯 are completely different.
Sometimes we call ourselves 憶病 to foreign people , but we actually might be “not overbearing”.
“Timorous” sounds to be similar to憶病. I think I should have said “timorous” or “not overbearing”.


Oh,yes! “Humility” must be the word! Thank you! I didn’t know it.
We can also say people are "too polite". People are always telling me I'm too polite. Usually politeness is considered a virtue, but by saying "too polite" you can indicate that it is too much of a good thing, which can be a foible.

A friend of mine in school was also very polite and considerate. He used to say "Nice guys always come last." To which I would reply "Yes, that's true, but it's worth it!"

Quote:
I don’t seem to have seen the sense of the word “chicken –hearted.” Thank you.
どういたしまして。

Quote:
I don’t mean to say Japan is idealistic. Some Japanese people dislike some foreign people’s spirit who are from a few certain countries, because the people in the countries often do what we call 卑怯. For example; they make imitations of Japanese products illegally.
I see. I know what you mean.

Quote:
Our religion is polytheism and nobody knows the exact number of our Gods. I think we are relatively generous about other religions. We don’t deny other religions, or say our Gods are only approximately eight million real Gods.
Ah, this is similar to the way of some Hindus.

Quote:
Our skin is colored. I think we don’t have any color-based prejudice.
I watched the スタジオジブリ version of "Tales from Earthsea". I have not read the originals, although I intend to. I noticed a comment made by Ursula K. Le Guin on her website:

Quote:
The issue of color:

My purpose in making most of the people of Earthsea colored, and the whites a marginal and rather backward people, was of course a moral one, aimed at young American and European readers. Fantasy heroes of the European tradition were conventionally white — just about universally so in 1968 — and darkness of skin was often associated with evil. By simply subverting an expectation, a novelist can undermine a prejudice.

The makers of the American TV version, while boasting that they were "color blind," reduced the colored population of Earthsea to one and a half. I have blasted them for whitewashing Earthsea, and do not forgive them for it.

The issue is different in Japan. I cannot address the issue of race in Japan because I know too little about it. But I know that an anime film runs smack into the almost immutable conventions of its genre. Most of the people in anime films look — to the American/European eye — white. I am told that the Japanese audience perceives them differently. I am told that they may perceive this Ged as darker than my eye does. I hope so. Most of the characters look white to me, but there is at least a nice variation of tans and beiges. And Tenar's fair hair and blue eyes are right, since she's a minority type from the Kargish islands.
I too had noticed that a lot of anime characters seem to be what I would call "white" or "Caucasian" if I had to put a label on it, which seems curious to me given that, to put it plainly, that doesn't seem to reflect the natural range of skin tones indigenous to Japan.
...


ニックネームは「覚醒(sarvodaya)」からとって「覚(か く)」です。

Kaku is the nickname given to me by ゆりさん, derived from the word sarvodaya (सर्वोदय). This, in turn, is a word that was used by Mohandas Gandhi in his 1908 translation of John Ruskin's "Unto This Last" (1860s).
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08-28-2010, 09:36 PM

...
Equally I know nothing of this issue or whether this even is an issue in Japan, but given what you say I see there must be no such prejudice. The trouble in the West is that these prejudices have such historical resonance and are so visible that they can cause tensions. Having said that, the majority of developed nations have now overcome such prejudices for the most part.

Quote:
Now you see what I mean. Thank you.
We need to get out of this pitiful situation.


Thank you for understanding.
どういたしまして。

However, at least you have something to show for your deficit. We have bailed out banks that were collapsing due to their own irresponsible and greedy conduct. To add insult to injury, those same banks now refuse to lend that money back to us and yet continue to pay themselves ridiculous bonuses. This is very demoralising.

Bear in mind also that Japan has a solid export market to rely upon. In the list of sovereign states by current account balance, Japan is 2nd while the U.K. is 175th! I think this is related to Japan's magnificently strong skill-base.

Quote:
I have thought that Tony Blair is a strong leader. Now I know why your country was flourishingly while the Thatcher Administration, and after that, the economy has turned downward.
Yes, but it is a bit more complicated than that. You see, the war took a lot out of our country. To put it bluntly, in economic terms we paid for the war and the U.S. profited from it. To make things worse the economy was subsequently mismanaged and all the while the U.S. showed no mercy. The Thatcher administration made some huge gains and put the economy back on its feet, but in the long-term we are left with a swathe of poorly privatised industries and an economy over-reliant on financial services. The recovery during Thatcher's administration was less a result of her particular brand of Reaganomics and more to do with simple competency.

A major problem of Blair's government was figure-fiddling, both amongst large businesses and within the government itself. Now you have some insight into our current economic state.

Quote:
Originally Posted by YuriTokoro View Post
Really!?
I know that Vancouver is the best place to live.
ゆりさん! You read my mind!

Quote:
Yes! They have delicious Japanese rice in their stores. Try it if you move to Canada. However, I hope you won’t need to emigrate there.
Well, at least if I go on holiday there now I know to try the Japanese rice!

Quote:
You mean these three above give the impression of an incomplete?
What are the complete sentences?
They are not incomplete sentences. They are grammatically correct. They represent incomplete thoughts. What they do is give the impression of an incomplete thought. This is because the copula, as the name implies, is used to link things. Most commonly it links a subject and a predicate, as follows:

"Grass is green."

"I'll be alright."

"You seem happy"

However, in these cases...

Quote:
"Do you know what the time is?"

"Do you know what time it is?"

"I want to know what morally correct behaviour is."
...the verb "to be" appears in an apparent copular role, but the second part of the link is missing. Thus time and behaviour are not linked to anything. This is because the speaker expects the listener to give the missing partner in his/her answer. Do you see how the unpaired part of the copular expression creates the expectation of more information to complete the pair?

Thus the completed thoughts are:

"The time is six o'clock."

"Morally correct behaviour is most easily characterised by mindfulness of the consequences of one's actions."

Quote:
Yes. I have published.
Ok, I'll write my response! Expect it soon.

Quote:
I start a short story here!
I like a good story.

Quote:
1
イギリス人の覚は、日本に引っ越してきました。
<Englishman> <Kaku>, <Japan(to)> <to move house> <he came>
Kaku the Englishman came to move house to Japan.
Quote:
隣の家に住む刺氏さん(Sashmister)に挨拶に行きました
<next door(of)> <house(in)> <lives> <Sashimister(to)> <to say hello> <he went to>
He went to say hello to Sashimister who lives in the house next door.
Quote:
「はじめまして。隣に引っ越してきました覚です。どう ぞよろしく」
"<How do you do?> <next door(in)> <to move house> <I came> <Kaku> <I am>. <pleased to meet you>"
"How do you do? I'm Kaku; I've just moved in next door. I'm pleased to meet you.
Quote:
「はじめまして。刺氏です。助(すけ)と呼んでください こちらこそ、よろしく」
"<pleased to meet you> <Sashimister> <I am> <assistance> <if> <call> <please> <it is I who should say so> <nice to meet you>"
"Pleased to meet you. I'm Sashimister. If you need assistance please call. It's nice meeting you too."
Quote:
To be continued.
How is my translation? I have tried to put the literal meanings (with postpositions in brackets) on the first line, and then a more natural rendition in English below that. Is it correct?

Quote:
Today, I just want you to know that the English tense sense and the Japanese’s are very different. The sequence of tenses is completely different.
You don’t need to memorize all the sentences above as for now.
My head hurts...
but I think I understand...

Quote:
My explanation must be complicated.
If you have questions, don’t hesitate to ask, please!
I don't understand this bit:
覚はイギリス人だった人で
What is だった?

Is the point that you need to use auxiliary verbs or something?

Quote:
I’m sorry, I have written too long.
Not at all, ゆりさん! I enjoyed it very much. You are very thorough and you are teaching me a lot. I just need to fit it all together in my head!

Quote:
Originally Posted by YuriTokoro View Post
人生 楽ありゃ 苦もあるさ (じんせい らくありゃ  くもあるさ)
涙のあとには 虹も出る  (なみだのあとには にじ もでる)
歩いてゆくんだ しっかりと  (あるいてゆくんだ  しっかりと)
自分の道を ふみしめて  (じぶんのみちを ふみし めて)

人生 勇気が必要だ  (じんせい ゆうきがひつよう だ)
くじけりゃ 誰かが先に行く (くじけりゃ だれかが さきにゆく)
あとから来たのに 追い越され  (あとからきたのに  おいこされ)
泣くのが嫌なら さあ歩け  (なくのがいやなら さ ああるけ)

人生 涙と笑顔あり (じんせい なみだとえがおあり)
そんなに悪くは ないもんだ (そんなにわるくは な いもんんだ)
なんにもしないで 生きるより (なんにもしないで  いきるより)
何かを求めて 生きようよ (なにかをもとめて いき ようよ)

There are only two parts.

When you have lost something dear and feel like giving up,
くじけりゃ 誰かが先に行く (くじけりゃ だれかが さきにゆく)

You have lost the part誰かが先に行く. It means like “someone would overtake you”
Oh, I'm confused.
I thought that あとからきたのに おいこされ meant "a person who came from behind overtakes you"
I also thought that was governed by なら on the line below, so I translated it as:
"If it is unpleasant to be surpassed by your successors,"

But you're saying 誰かが先に行く means "someone would overtake you".
I thought that くじけりゃ だれかが さきにゆく as a whole somehow translated to "When you have lost something dear and feel like giving up,"

Where did I go wrong?

When I look up くじけりゃ I find something about being crushed or broken. Is that correct?
だれかが means someone. Is that correct?
さきに means before. Is that correct?
ゆく means to go. Is that correct?

Oh, I think I see now. さきに is more like ahead. So だれかがさきにゆく means someone goes ahead [of you]. Is that correct?

Ah, of course, you were worried about "while" and now I see why...

Ok, so it's something like "When you've lost something dear and feel broken, others may pass you by."
or "When you've lost something dear and feel broken, others may take advantage."
Is that correct?

Quote:
From living, great things can come,
Set a goal and live!
なんにもしないで 生きるより
何かを求めて 生きようよ

I have written about this part in my previous post.

Good luck!
So then, it should be:

In life there is comfort; there is hardship too.
After tears a rainbow appears.
Carry on steadily,
Keeping your foot firmly upon your chosen path.

In life courage is essential,
When you've lost something dear and feel broken, others may take advantage.
If it is unpleasant to be surpassed by those around you,
If it is unpleasant to weep, come now and walk!

In life there are both tears and smiles.
Life is not so bad.
Rather than wandering aimlessly through life achieving nothing,
Let's set a direction in life, and go forth!

How is that?



ニックネームは「覚醒(sarvodaya)」からとって「覚(か く)」です。

Kaku is the nickname given to me by ゆりさん, derived from the word sarvodaya (सर्वोदय). This, in turn, is a word that was used by Mohandas Gandhi in his 1908 translation of John Ruskin's "Unto This Last" (1860s).
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08-28-2010, 09:49 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by manganimefan227 View Post
Hiya!! I'd like to ask for your help in Japanese for practice in conversation, even if it's just a typed one XD

I know all hiragana and katakana and a little kanji I've studied for a year now. I hope to be atleast somewhat fluent by the time I leave college.
Quote:
Originally Posted by YuriTokoro View Post
こんにちは。manganimefanさん。
あなたが好きなマンガは何ですか?
What is your favourite manga?

Quote:
Originally Posted by manganimefan227 View Post
名前はここにルキアです。
Quote:
Originally Posted by YuriTokoro View Post
Hi.
名前はここにルキアです doesn't make sense.
Do you use an online translator?
Quote:
Originally Posted by manganimefan227 View Post
Nyo T.T

That was a self-written statement!

My name here is Lukia . . .
Quote:
Originally Posted by YuriTokoro View Post
I'm so sorry!

「私のここでの名前はルキアです」should be better.

ルキアさん、you are welcomed!
I think sarvodaya and Yamu-san will also welcome you.
こんにちは、ルキアさん。
はじめまして。覚です。
よろしくおねがいします。
ようこそ。


ニックネームは「覚醒(sarvodaya)」からとって「覚(か く)」です。

Kaku is the nickname given to me by ゆりさん, derived from the word sarvodaya (सर्वोदय). This, in turn, is a word that was used by Mohandas Gandhi in his 1908 translation of John Ruskin's "Unto This Last" (1860s).
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08-28-2010, 10:59 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by YuriTokoro View Post
@覚さんへ (@sarvodaya)

Hi. I have three questions.


1. Can I say “while” instead of “during which” ?
What is the difference?
Quote:
Originally Posted by JamboP26 View Post
You can say 'while' instead of 'during which'. There's no real difference. Its just quicker to say.
Quote:
Originally Posted by dogsbody70 View Post
I think in this context "During which" is preferable, more dynamic)
No. You cannot. It would not make sense. "While" can be substituted for "during the time that".

In this case, if you wanted to use "while" you would have to say something like:

"While the famine was ongoing around a million people died and a similar number left the country in order to survive."

Ok, ゆりさん? Remember, while is "during the time that", "as long as". It can sometimes mean "whereas" and almost "although". It can also mean "at the same time". It doesn't mean "during which".

"Meanwhile" can mean "during which time" or "at the same time". Perhaps this is what you were thinking of.

However, a substitution of "meanwhile" would imply a disconnect between the two contemporaneous events. This is inappropriate to our example, because the fact that "this was a terrible time of starvation and poverty in Irish history" is intimately linked with the fact that "around a million people died and a similar number left the country in order to survive". The latter adds to the explanation of why and how "this was a terrible time".

Does all that make sense?

Quote:
Originally Posted by YuriTokoro View Post
2. Does “one variety of” mean “various”?
Why isn’t that “one variety of crops”?
Quote:
Originally Posted by JamboP26 View Post
2. 'One variety of' means a certain group out of multiple groups. For example: Car makers Toyota, Nissan and Honda all make various models of car. If you were looking for 'one variety of' Nissan, you'd be looking for a certain kind of Nissan. Whereas if you are looking for 'various' Nissan's, you'd be looking at every car Nissan makes. A poor example maybe, but it makes my point. As for the second question in 2, as your looking for 'one variety of' crop, you use the singular version, instead of the plural.
Quote:
Originally Posted by YuriTokoro View Post
Hi, JamboP26.
Thank you!

I see. So, “one variety of Nissan” means “a certain type of vehicle of Nissan”. Right?
Thanks again!
Quote:
Originally Posted by JamboP26 View Post
That is right. “one variety of Nissan” can be a group of Skyline's, GT-R's or March's. But it can also be, as in your example, a group of Nissan vans, Nissan trucks or Nissan cars. It's quite a flexible phrase. lol. Here to help any time.
Quote:
Originally Posted by dogsbody70 View Post
Well you could say ONE crop variety but as there are many plants to make that CROP-- then variety of crops is fine.
"One variety of" doesn't mean "various". JamboP26 is correct.
"Various" simply means "different". Thus "various crops" means "different varieties of crops", whereas "one variety of crop" means "one particular variety out of a number of various possible varieties".

Now, a particular crop can be something like wheat, rice, oilseed rape, etc. Thus the following is a list of various crops:

Wheat
Corn
Rice
Maize
Oilseed rape
Sweetcorn

Within each crop there may be different varieties or cultivars. That is, different strains with given characteristics and genetic trends. Here are some different varieties of sweetcorn (from Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia)

Earlivee
Jubilee
Silver Queen
Precocious
Merlin
Divinity
Ravelin
Mattapoisett
and so on...

Thus the reason for writing "one variety of crop" instead of "one variety of crops" is that I have in mind selecting one particular variety of one particular crop. If I had said "one variety of crops" there could have been some ambiguity as to whether I just meant one particular crop (as in one crop out of all the crops that there are) or one particular group of different crops, such as cereals or something. I could equally have said "one variety of a particular crop", for added clarity.

Quote:
3. “A single variety of crops” means one strain?
Why isn’t it in singular form?
Yes, this means one particular strain or variety or cultivar etc.
I no longer needed to use the singular to clarify the meaning as by this point the meaning was well established. I could have said "a single variety of crop", but I naturally chose the plural because I was thinking in general terms. That is, the sentence begins by talking about the Potato Famine, but then moves on to the general case: "when one has the choice", so it just feels more natural to use the plural. However, there is no major difference in meaning, it is more of a stylistic issue, especially given that we have already eliminated any ambiguity with the earlier occurence of "one variety of crop".

I hope that's clear, but don't hesitate to ask again if it isn't because I had to think for a moment!

Quote:
It is a little late to ask. Sorry; I’m slow.
Thank you.
It is never too late to ask, ゆりさん!

For now, I must say お休みなさい。
I will write something more tomorrow.


ニックネームは「覚醒(sarvodaya)」からとって「覚(か く)」です。

Kaku is the nickname given to me by ゆりさん, derived from the word sarvodaya (सर्वोदय). This, in turn, is a word that was used by Mohandas Gandhi in his 1908 translation of John Ruskin's "Unto This Last" (1860s).
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08-29-2010, 03:54 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by YuriTokoro View Post
OK. I will correct your Japanese. Post something in Japanese.


You are welcome!


「はじめまして。ユリです。どうぞよろしく」
What would you answer?
はじめまして
私のここでのなまえはルキアです
どうぞよろしくおおねぎあします!
てんきはどう?


My Life Sucks- The kids I babysit have drooled, ripped or drawn on all of the cards and put the cars with the little people in the microwave!

I have no Friends- The cats have scratched and destroyed all of the DVDs!

I always owe someone- In fact I put two os in it!

I always ruin my clothes with Bleach!- The show is so dom suspensful I spill my grape soda on them!

But . . .I'll live.
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08-29-2010, 05:36 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by yumyumtimtam View Post
覚さん こんにちは。
おへんじを ありがとうございました。
どういたしまして。

Quote:
I saw this news several times on TV today about the Dictionary.
(English)
'Hikikomori' finds way into Oxford Dictionary of English
Hrm. Ah, for a moment I thought they meant OED, my mistake!

I couldn't follow this link. It took me to a list of stories.

Quote:
A guy on the TV said
it's kind of sad to see not-happy-にほんごs are introducing to the world.
You mean that it's not nice to be exporting such negative words? Indeed, it is curious. I have never found the need for words like that though, nor have I heard them used. I don't think they are very common. There are only a few Japanese words I can think of that I depend on. For instance, we have no word for 旨味, or the way of tasting amino acids, and so I sometimes have to use that word when explaining this flavour. Obviously there are more common words like 津波, カラオケ, 空手, 道場, 神風, 侘寂, 侍, 忍者, 鮨, 着物, 浪人, 酒, 漫画, 指圧, 手裏剣, 鉄人, 梅干 and so on... I can't think of any more!

So, anyway, the point is that it's not just negative words that come from Japan! There are plenty of nice and interesting words too.

Quote:
そうそう、
Do you see/hear people using the word "mottainai" in UK?
Not really, but the concept is becoming more popular. There is a Hebrew phrase ‫בל תשחית‬, which refers to a similar ethical principal. Bal Tashkhit literally means "do not destroy", and it has been extended over time to all types of needless waste and destruction.

Quote:
About 5 years ago,there was some international youth meeting in Tokyo and I was in it.
We all were staying in the same accommodation for 3 days and it made us very close so I cried a lot on the last day...oops..this isn't the point...
Aww...

Quote:
one of the groups did a great presentation about environment and they said "mottainai" was going to be an international word.
Well, as I say, I hadn't really come across the word itself, but it is an important concept.

Quote:
I see...
you know 覚さん... I have been totally opposite of hyperactive and feeling so low...
maybe because it's been too hot here.  たぶん なつばて です。
Ah, well then, "lethargic" is definitely the right word. You are suffering from summer lethargy.

Quote:
OK ☆そうですね☆

yes songs!
***
I went to YOUTUBE and was looking for one with a male vocal singer with lyrics that are not too poetic... but couldn't find any. Let me try again later.

but here are some love songs for the moment.
I used to go to karaoke with a big group of Japanese students and they liked レミオロメン's songs.
YouTube - レミオロメン sakura (歌詞つき)
YouTube - レミオロメン 3月9日
YouTube - レミオロメン 粉雪

lyrics serch
http://www.uta-net.com/user/ichiran....ount=86&sort=2
Thanks; I will have a look at these.

Quote:
はい。せいかいです。
"Yes, that's right."
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(笑) = (laugh)
yes mint chocolate works the best
Mmmmmmm...

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Maybe vegemite on a toast will work too! but not marmite!!
UGH!
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そのとおりです。
It's quite so.

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I think...
I didn't understand = わかりませんでした
I didn't know= しりませんでした
ありがとうございました。
私はこのことをしりませんでした。

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そうですね。こんどから そうします!
"That's so. Next time I'll check!"

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くわしいせつめいを ありがとうございました。
Thank you kindly for the detailed explanation.
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よく わかりました。
I have understood properly.
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mmm a bit confusing... sounds like a riddle to me... maybe I had too much wine already?

Why not in summer and winter?
Sorry, that was ambiguous. For a period during the spring, and then again during the autumn, the BBC make one episode of "Have I Got News for You" every week. The number of episodes varies a little from year to year, but in general there are around a total of 17 episodes each year. I don't know why they don't make the show for the other 35 weeks of the year. I wish they did!

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なるほど~。
"Indeed."

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I just loved how they were talking so I watched it more than 5 times and laughed some, but yes,there were some parts where I didn't get why it was funny.
Why don't we go back to Paul Merton as you like him and I think his show will be easier to understand.

Quote:
Wow.... you know what? You just gave me the best homework ever! Thank you!!
When I come back from my trip to とうほく と ほっかいどう( I'm leaving tomorrow!), I will totally work on them.
I hope you enjoy your trip. You must tell me all about it when you get back!
Let's work on this when you get back:



Quote:
Yes I got it,
but I was surprized when I found out who was singing that song!

Your translation was a great help for me.
How about this?
このタイヤは もえている
どうろを ころがりおちていく(or ころがっていく)
I see. Yes this looks much better. It has the sense of rolling down, which I think is important.

Quote:
but...I don't quite understand "best notify my next of kin" part...
Does it mean like... I've got to let my closest relative know (that the wheel will explode) ?or a relative who lives nextdoor?
This song was written by Bob Dylan and Rick Danko. No-one knows exactly what it means. I think that "this wheel" is the singer referring to him/herself. They are "on fire" with chaotic ardour for something ill-defined and dimly perceived. They are "rolling down the road", unable to control or stop themselves. A wheel cannot stop itself, it needs a brake. "Notify my next of kin" is what you do when someone has died. It is considered bad etiquette to publicise a death before notifying the next of kin. The next of kin is usually a nominated nearest family member. "this wheel shall explode" indicates that the singer is firmly on course to meet his/her untimely end in a blaze of either glory or destruction.

I found this website that discusses the song:
Peter Viney: This Wheel's on Fire
He quotes Andy Gill who writes:
Quote:
Given suitably enigmatic melody by Rick Danko, Dylan's lyric draws again on Shakespeare's King Lear … itself inspired by the biblical visions of Ezekiel, possibly the Old Testament's nuttiest prophet - to offer what seems like a mea culpa for past transgressions, a moment of self revelation in which the singer realizes that in order to get to this, it was necessary for him to go through that. The road down which the flaming wheel rolls is of course the road of excess, which Rimbaud claimed, leads to the palace of wisdom. … The mood of the song is far more portentous, capturing a soul suspended on the cusp of torment and deliverance, unable to arrest its headlong drive towards destruction, yet aware of the tasks which have to be completed. It is virtually impossible not to see the locked wheel of Dylan's Triumph 500 in the title, the very wheel upon which his own accelerating pursuit of disaster was borne so swiftly, and then arrested so abruptly. The verses brim with unfinished business, anchored by the certainty that "we shall meet again."
...
A quarter of a century later, it provided the theme music for … Absolutely Fabulous, where it brilliantly evoked the high-octane burn out of the show's hippie hangover characters.
So you can see how the words relate to the lifestyle of the main character in the programme.

Quote:
yep, please try "i" line too!
Ok:
いきしちにひみりゐ
i-ki-shi-chi-ni-hi-mi-ri-wi
いぎじぢにびみりゐ
i-gi-shi-dji-ni-bi-mi-ri-wi
いきしちにぴみりゐ
i-ki-shi-chi-ni-pi-mi-ri-wi

Quote:
as a joke, maybe...
but I think when we say 行ってきます 
we know that the listeners know where we are going to.

"well now I'm going to the supermarket to buy some icecream (and come back here)."
かいに(かい に) = かうために = in order to buy です
買う(かう) is the basic form (sorry Im not sure if you call it the basic form, but Im sure you know what I mean)
I see. This is a useful construction.
ありがとうございました。

Quote:
I don't see/here many people use 「会」alone, but usually like...
XXX会. but when we know what会 we are talking about, we might use 会 alone.

運動会
Athletic meet
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誕生会
Birthday party
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誕生日会
Birthday party
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自治会
Neighbourhood council
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飲み会*
Get-together
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These are all different types of 会(かい)。
*colloquial
ありがとうございました。
This is useful vocabulary.

Quote:
では わたしは りょこうに いってきま~す☆
"Well, I'm off on my trip. See you!"
いってらっしゃい
Enjoy your trip and please tell me all about it when you get back.
Have a safe journey.

have a good day! 覚さん
Thank you ヤムさん!



ニックネームは「覚醒(sarvodaya)」からとって「覚(か く)」です。

Kaku is the nickname given to me by ゆりさん, derived from the word sarvodaya (सर्वोदय). This, in turn, is a word that was used by Mohandas Gandhi in his 1908 translation of John Ruskin's "Unto This Last" (1860s).

Last edited by sarvodaya : 08-30-2010 at 09:59 AM.
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ゆりさんの報告 - 08-30-2010, 07:40 PM

ゆりさん、こんばんは。

I have written my response on your blog. I hope you enjoy reading it!



ニックネームは「覚醒(sarvodaya)」からとって「覚(か く)」です。

Kaku is the nickname given to me by ゆりさん, derived from the word sarvodaya (सर्वोदय). This, in turn, is a word that was used by Mohandas Gandhi in his 1908 translation of John Ruskin's "Unto This Last" (1860s).
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08-30-2010, 07:56 PM

Hello !
My names Lizzie and Im from Canada ! ^ _ ^
Hope everyone is well!

Whew, So I just spent a good time reading all of that !

I too am looking for a tutor in Japanese
Ive been studying the culture and such for 2 years and I am desperate to learn the language.

I need someone to be able to skype with me and say the word and I can say it back. Vice versa!

Be awesome if someone was able to help me out too !!

I will be moving there in 6-8 months but im a very fast learning and I pick up on things quick !
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08-30-2010, 09:14 PM

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Originally Posted by LizzieRobinson View Post
Hello !
My names Lizzie and Im from Canada ! ^ _ ^
Hope everyone is well!

Whew, So I just spent a good time reading all of that !

I too am looking for a tutor in Japanese
Ive been studying the culture and such for 2 years and I am desperate to learn the language.

I need someone to be able to skype with me and say the word and I can say it back. Vice versa!

Be awesome if someone was able to help me out too !!

I will be moving there in 6-8 months but im a very fast learning and I pick up on things quick !
ようこそ。
はじめまして。覚です。
よろしくおねがいします。

You are welcome to join us here Lizzie. My name's Kaku and I am also learning Japanese. I'm sure ゆりさん and ヤムさん will be happy to help you as they are helping me.

What do you know about the Japanese language so far?
You will need to know your kana (平仮名 & 片仮名) to participate here.
We are conducting the tuition within this thread so that others can learn from our mistakes and examples.

I would like to wish you the best of luck with your endeavour!



ニックネームは「覚醒(sarvodaya)」からとって「覚(か く)」です。

Kaku is the nickname given to me by ゆりさん, derived from the word sarvodaya (सर्वोदय). This, in turn, is a word that was used by Mohandas Gandhi in his 1908 translation of John Ruskin's "Unto This Last" (1860s).
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09-02-2010, 05:24 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by sarvodaya View Post
ゆりさん、こんばんは。
覚さん、こんばんは。

Quote:
Yes, that's exactly right. So it's still advice, but its hyperbolic ironic seriousness is amusing at the same time.
I see! I find that the expression “hyperbolic ironic seriousness” is really funny words. If I translate the words, it should be 超皮肉っぽい真面目さ. However, 超(ちょう)is a very casual word. You can’t say that.

Quote:
Ah, I see. It's good to know how to avoid sounding arrogant!
ありがとうございました。
There are many things I want to tell you, but I think I should wait for now.

Quote:
No, ゆりさん, your English is not too poor: I understand!
You mean it is like "Can I get you to pass the pepper, please?"
Or maybe "If I ask really nicely, do you think I could get you to pass me the pepper please?"
(Yes, people do actually say that!)
The literal sense you want to convey is that it's talking about persuading someone to do something. Is that right?
I’m not sure if it is “persuading”.
「取っていただく」is a politer expression of 「取ってもらう」.
[verb + もらう] implies thank. You don’t say that when someone do something mean to you. There are some other versions of this kind of expressions. For example, 「取ってくださる」「取ってくれる」(the subject of 「取っていただく」is “I”, while 「取ってくださる」is “you”).
However, these things are too early for now. I want you to know the fact that there are many versions

Quote:
ありがとうございました、ゆりさん! I now have all the skills necessary to find a Japanese bride!
OK. The sentences I wrote don’t sound silly at all. You can use these words.
Probably you need some expressions to ask a lady out. Do you?

Quote:
ゆりさん、of course I remember; I love that expression! By the way, "I receive this boon" is technically correct, but no-one would say that in England. The word "boon" can sound pretentious, and it would in this context. There is not a direct translation, but the closest acceptable English sentence may be: "I humbly and gratefully receive this."
Oh, yes! That’s it. "I humbly and gratefully receive this."
If you need to say that in shorter words, that’s “Thanks”.

Quote:
I understand. In English, this is the difference between "I read one book" and "I read a book". However, if you really meant that the flight was long, you would probably say "I read one whole book on the flight". I think the structure is more straightforward in Japanese.
The Japanese people would say "I have finished reading one whole book on the flight". 「飛行機の中で本を一冊、読み終わってしまった」
English native speakers like to say 「飛行機の中で 一冊の本を 読みました」,but we don’t say like that.

When you say 「最近、一冊の本を読みました」, you must mean that you have read one certain book and you are telling about the book.

Quote:
About Sakoku, here is what Ronald P. Toby had to say on the matter in 1977:
So that's interesting. Apparently the original terminology really was different and the word sakoku was used to make it sound draconian and worse than the reality. Is that the impression you get from reading this?
I know that people in Edo era didn’t say “sakoku”.
My impression from reading that article is that western viewpoints are much different from ours.
In Edo era, people were prohibited getting out of the prefecture (which was called country, then) where the person was born. How were they able to go abroad?
The authority of the day was “bakufu” and the top was shohgun. “Bakufu” wanted to have a monopoly on profits of overseas trade, so they prohibited people to have contact with foreign countries.
Bakufu was carrying on overseas commerce with the Netherland, China, and Korea.
The Netherland said that other western countries were trying to make Japan a colony using Christianity, and bakufu believed that. Then bakufu hated the U.S. and other countries.
They just hated western countries except the Netherland which people didn’t promote Christianity. They didn’t mean closing the country, but just hated Japan to be a colony.

Quote:
Ok, let's do it!
Please would you help me with the words like last time?
After that I would like to learn a more traditional Japanese song as well!
Sure!


“My Way”

今 船出が近づく この時に
ふと たたずみ わたしは振り返る
遠く旅して歩いた 若い日を
すべて 心の決めたままに

愛と涙と ほほえみに あふれ
今 思えば 楽しい想い出よ
君に告げよう 迷わずに行くことを
君の心の 決めたままに

私には 愛する歌があるから
信じたこの道を わたしは行くだけ
すべては心の 決めたままに

愛と涙と ほほえみに あふれ
今 思えば 楽しい想い出よ
君に告げよう 迷わずに行くことを
君の心の 決めたままに

私には 愛する歌があるから
信じたこの道を わたしは行くだけ
すべては心の 決めたままに

信じたこの道を わたしは行くだけ
すべては心の 決めたままに




FYA. This is the English version.

“ And now, the end is near, ”
(そして今、最後の時が近づき)
“ And so I face the final curtain ”
(人生の幕を私は迎えようとしている)
“ My friend, I'll say it clear, ”
(はっきりと胸を張ってそう呼べる友人)
“ I'll state my case of which I'm certain ”
(自分の意見だってはっきり言えるくらいだ)
“ I've lived a life that's full ”
(この波乱に満ちた人生を私は生き抜いた)
“ I've troubled each and every highway ”
(あちこちのハイウェイで、よくもめ事も起こしたもの だ)
“ And more much more than this, I did it my way ”
(だけど、それ以上に、私は自分の思うように生きてき た)

“ Regrets, I've had a few ”
(後悔、そんなものはほとんどない)
“ But then again too few to mention ”
(だが、取り立てて言うほどの人生を送ったわけでもな い)
“ I did what I had to do ”
(やらなきゃならないことを私はやって来た)
“ And saw it through without exemption ”
(一つの例外もなくやり通してきた)
“ I planned each charted caurse ”
(人生の設計を計画立てて)
“ Each careful step along the byway ”
(たまにそれる脇道も注意深く進むようにしてきた)
“ And more much more than this, I did it my way ”
(だけど、それ以上に、私は自分の思うように生きてき た)

“ Yes, there were time, I'm sure you knew ”
“ When I bit off more than I could chew ”
(それは確かに、手に余るようなことに関わったことも あったが)
“ But through it all, when there was doubt ”
“ I ate it up and spat it out ”
(でもその全てを通して、納得がいかなければ
議論に熱中もしたし暴言まで吐いたことだってあった)
“ I faced it all, and I stood tall ”
(堂々と胸を張って、全てに正面から立ち向かい)
“ And did it my way ”
(私は自分を貫き通してきたんだ)

--- 二番 ---

“ I've loved, I've laughed and cried ”
(人を愛し、大声を上げて笑い、あるいは泣き叫んだこ ともあった)
“ I've had my fill, my share of blue jeans ”
(大食いもしたし、作業着に身をくるんで働いたりもし た)
“ And now, as tears subside ”
(だが今は、涙も枯れはて)
“ I find it all so amusing ”
(人生に起きた全てが面白く思えてきた)
“ To think I did all that ”
(私がその全てを経験してきたんだと考えることが)
“ And may I say not in a shy way ”
(そして、それを臆面もなく言えることが)
“ Oh no ! Oh no, not me, I did my way ”
(そうだ!私ならはっきり言える、私は自分を貫き通し てきたんだと)

“ For what is a man, what has he got ”
(一人の人間であるためには、人は何を手に入れるのだ ろう?)
“ If not himself, then he has not ”
“ To say the things he truely feels ”
(もしそれが自分自身でないのなら、
本当に感じたことを口にすることさえ禁じられてしまう )
“ And not the words of one who kneels ”
(目の前でひざまいている人の言葉を信用することさえ も)
“ The record shows I took the blows ”
(だが、今までの記録が示す通り、私はそんなものは振 り払い)
“ And did it my way ”
(私は自分を貫き通してきたんだと胸を張って言えるん だ)


The Japanese version is almost completely different in meaning.

By the way, the singer, Akira Fuse (布施 明) who sang this song, is Olivia Hussey’s ex-husband.


Hello, I may not understand English very well and I may lack words but I will try to understand you.

If you have questions about my post or Japanese customs, don't hesitate to ask.

I YamaP
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