I don't want to live in Japan.

[mercedesjin]

最初の投稿者：Nyororin

I didn`t see anyone discounting the experience. Just making the statement that it is worlds away from mainland Japan. That is a fact. It is Japan, but it is unique within Japan.
Is it wrong to tell people that one place is going to be very much different than the rest?

It's fine if one were to simply say, "Your experience is different from my experience." However, look at what was said:


A: Hello everybody, Just moved to Okinawa...and am loving it. I saw this post and am just giving my opinion. I lived in NY, went to college out there and i loved it but Japan is not so bad. Yes things are expensive here but you wont hear me complaining, I live in a nice condo and have a decent car and am loving the the beach life...and that was my 2cents.

Kam


B: Okinawa is worlds away from mainland Japan

B's statement is presented as though to say, though you're on Japan, you're "worlds away" and so can't know what "mainland" culture is like. The word "mainland" is often used to say that one part of land is more important than the other. It's "main" and "land" put together, so it's an example in itself. So, yes, I do think that the statement is trying to discount A's experience in Japan.

[Tsuwabuki]

最初の投稿者：bELyVIS

I saw an interview with a old lady who was a child when the Americans landed there. She talked about the same thing, that they were told the Americans would hurt the survivors. She said just the opposite happened. The Americans were very kind and fed them and gave the kids candy. She still is angry with the Japanese soldiers who told them that and she really loves Americans.

The interesting thing is that I learned all of this in Japan, not in America. You think I would have, as this is definitely a part of the end of the war that Americans can be proud of.

I first learned of this in the Japan Times. Following that, I found out that Kyoto is pretty darn liberal and peace-loving, and my students go to Okinawa each year to visit the beaches and reflect on what the Japanese people did to the Okinawan people. The most amazing part is how the students come back recognising this as well. I've spoken to a few after the trips each year, and they tend to agree with the Okinawans. It is interesting how they can manage to discuss the issue with an American at all.

Finally, I learned a lot about it because the Hiroshima Peace Memorial is really, really balanced. It doesn't have too great a bias in any direction. It talks about Okinawa and how as horrible as nuclear bombs were, there was a sense that America was able to point to the actions of Japanese commanders in Okinawa and say, "Look, look. If we invade the country by traditional means, we won't be able to stop the fighting until we've killed a large portion of the population." While America certainly had ulterior motives like scaring the Soviet Union in their own backyard to prevent the spread of communism, it is true that the "Death with Honor" strategy meant that America certainly could claim justification when it said that the body count of a traditional invasion would simply be too high.

In the past few years Japan has done a lot of self-reflection, and I think the younger generation realises that Japanese history is a lot more complex than the older generations would some times like to believe. I see progress, and it can only help make the world a more peaceful place.

[bELyVIS]

最初の投稿者：Tsuwabuki

The interesting thing is that I learned all of this in Japan, not in America. You think I would have, as this is definitely a part of the end of the war that Americans can be proud of.

I first learned of this in the Japan Times. Following that, I found out that Kyoto is pretty darn liberal and peace-loving, and my students go to Okinawa each year to visit the beaches and reflect on what the Japanese people did to the Okinawan people. The most amazing part is how the students come back recognising this as well. I've spoken to a few after the trips each year, and they tend to agree with the Okinawans. It is interesting how they can manage to discuss the issue with an American at all.

Finally, I learned a lot about it because the Hiroshima Peace Memorial is really, really balanced. It doesn't have too great a bias in any direction. It talks about Okinawa and how as horrible as nuclear bombs were, there was a sense that America was able to point to the actions of Japanese commanders in Okinawa and say, "Look, look. If we invade the country by traditional means, we won't be able to stop the fighting until we've killed a large portion of the population." While America certainly had ulterior motives like scaring the Soviet Union in their own backyard to prevent the spread of communism, it is true that the "Death with Honor" strategy meant that America certainly could claim justification when it said that the body count of a traditional invasion would simply be too high.

In the past few years Japan has done a lot of self-reflection, and I think the younger generation realises that Japanese history is a lot more complex than the older generations would some times like to believe. I see progress, and it can only help make the world a more peaceful place.

I'm with you. The younger Japanese are great and since most of them have traveled they see the world as a different place then Japanese did before WWII.

[Barone1551]

最初の投稿者：Tsuwabuki

The interesting thing is that I learned all of this in Japan, not in America. You think I would have, as this is definitely a part of the end of the war that Americans can be proud of.

I first learned of this in the Japan Times. Following that, I found out that Kyoto is pretty darn liberal and peace-loving, and my students go to Okinawa each year to visit the beaches and reflect on what the Japanese people did to the Okinawan people. The most amazing part is how the students come back recognising this as well. I've spoken to a few after the trips each year, and they tend to agree with the Okinawans. It is interesting how they can manage to discuss the issue with an American at all.

Finally, I learned a lot about it because the Hiroshima Peace Memorial is really, really balanced. It doesn't have too great a bias in any direction. It talks about Okinawa and how as horrible as nuclear bombs were, there was a sense that America was able to point to the actions of Japanese commanders in Okinawa and say, "Look, look. If we invade the country by traditional means, we won't be able to stop the fighting until we've killed a large portion of the population." While America certainly had ulterior motives like scaring the Soviet Union in their own backyard to prevent the spread of communism, it is true that the "Death with Honor" strategy meant that America certainly could claim justification when it said that the body count of a traditional invasion would simply be too high.

In the past few years Japan has done a lot of self-reflection, and I think the younger generation realises that Japanese history is a lot more complex than the older generations would some times like to believe. I see progress, and it can only help make the world a more peaceful place.

Really? You though it was balanced. I didn't really think it was that balanced, I definitely saw more biased towards the Japanese side. Which is understandable considering what happened there. But I never really saw where they blamed themselves for anything if full. They kind of skippied over the details of the wrong things they did. They played the role of the victim and played it off like the US did this horrible thing they didn't deserve. Now Im not defending the dropping of the bomb, becuase it was a horrible thing. But going through that museum I felt even worse becuase it felt very one sided. This is basically what I felt like the museum was saying: Japan- "We did some things in the time of war." "But then the overzealous Americans came and bombed our innocent country for no reason". Now this could have something to do with going to other museums first to compare to the Hiroshima museum to but I'm not sure. I went to the Kyoto peace museum first and though that that was very neutral. While the Hiroshima museum seemed to play the victim throughout. The Kyoto one took more of the side that warfare is bad in general. I learned a lot of things that happened in Japan throughout that time that I had never heard of. And I though I knew a decent amount. I saw a lot of things both US and Japan did during WWII at the Kyoto one, and the a lot of the bad things Japan did were missing at the Hiroshima one.

[Tsuwabuki]

Maybe the exhibit has changed since you were there. Now, at least, there are several times where the Hiroshima museum says "We were a military base, and we sent our troops to be part of this specific action, thus, in many ways, we were a legitimate military target." A good example is Nanking, which the museum does talk about. Hiroshima troops were involved in that massacre. Another is Okinawa, as mentioned above.

Now obviously there is a sense, especially during the portion dedicated to the children, that the bomb killed indiscriminately and took the lives of mostly civilians, but I thought the museum did a good job of blaming all sides equally in the run up to the dropping of the bomb. My personal beliefs didn't change, but it did make the reasons I have my beliefs that much more depressing.

[Chile]

最初の投稿者：MMM

I think you are right about being social. It is very easy to be completely invisible, especially in the big cities in Japan.

Check this out: Hikikomori - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

I have read this wikipedia entry about Hikikomori and find it very interesting.
This will not be the first time that I have heard about such things in Japan. Naturally, it is not the romantic place that anime fans idealize it to be. I am not afraid of living a life that is less cushioned than the one I have here in America - and indeed I think it would be good in its way.

However, I am frightened by the descriptions of intellectual pursuits in Japan.
In regards to the mind I am an inquisitive, difficult to please sort of person. I have read that many Eastern Asian societies focus greatly on the material, and deeper analysis is discounted. If I am disgusted by the superficiality of many Americans I have met, I will certainly be discouraged (if what I have heard is true) at social life in a country where a more extreme form is exhibited. I have had these concerns about Japan for years, and my suspicions about Eastern Asian cultures have been fueled not only by what I have read, but by a friends' experiences in Taiwan.
I am hoping my frame of reference is not quite correct.

[MMM]

最初の投稿者：Chile

I have read this wikipedia entry about Hikikomori and find it very interesting.
This will not be the first time that I have heard about such things in Japan. Naturally, it is not the romantic place that anime fans idealize it to be. I am not afraid of living a life that is less cushioned than the one I have here in America - and indeed I think it would be good in its way.

However, I am frightened by the descriptions of intellectual pursuits in Japan.
In regards to the mind I am an inquisitive, difficult to please sort of person. I have read that many Eastern Asian societies focus greatly on the material, and deeper analysis is discounted. If I am disgusted by the superficiality of many Americans I have met, I will certainly be discouraged (if what I have heard is true) at social life in a country where a more extreme form is exhibited. I have had these concerns about Japan for years, and my suspicions about Eastern Asian cultures have been fueled not only by what I have read, but by a friends' experiences in Taiwan.
I am hoping my frame of reference is not quite correct.

I can't quite understand what you are saying. What have you heard about intellectual pursuits in Japan?

You are an American, so you know not all Americans are superficial. What happened to your friend in Taiwan?

[Chile]

最初の投稿者：Nyororin

Although I lived without any heating for a while in the US before coming here, the lack of central heating made me raise my eyebrows at first... Now I loathe it every time I encounter it in the Japan or the US. It`s like you`re in a bubble all year round and have little connection to the seasons. I`m a happier and healthier person now that I really notice the seasons and feel some sort of connection to them. Before, cold weather or hot weather was just inconvenience between the house and car - which is sad in a way. Not to even mention the incredible waste of electricity heating/cooling a whole house year round is.

I want to put in that I love your mindset on the seasons! While I was growing up, I often did not have a place to stay and found myself returning to my Grandmothers' home. Beginning her adulthood in during the Depression, she is a frugal and constructive person. Very different from many of the young Americans I know today (I, too, find it difficult to go without). When staying at her house for long periods of time, I always felt the weather. She and my Grandfather built the house from the ground up and insulated it themselves. But it was damn cold in the winter.
There's something very good about putting on a sweater and sitting under a blanket while doing work, or reading.
There is also something rewarding about harshing the environment to get from point A to point B.

I think that living conditions will be the least of my worries if I can find a good education in Japan. My greatest concern is school and the social construct. What is life really like there, I wonder.
You can not get a real feel for a place by visiting there for a matter of weeks or months. I think it is a great mistake to pretend that you are any authority on a country, having only visited it. We are arrogant. None of us are so smart as to avoid culture shock entirely.

[Chile]

最初の投稿者：MMM

I can't quite understand what you are saying. What have you heard about intellectual pursuits in Japan?

You are an American, so you know not all Americans are superficial. What happened to your friend in Taiwan?

I am trying to find the correct word. Intellectual pursuits may not be the right one. I am used to living a way of life where I can openly question what is placed before me, or ponder it.

Definitely, not all Americans are superficial by any means. What I speak of is a general mindset, which may not be specific to the United States. Having never been out of my country, I can only speak from the experiences I have had here. What I think of is a quality of existence that is satisfied by surface pursuits, and even surface philosophies. For instance, I have met a number of people who adhere to wise adages but are not sure why beyond their basic instinct. A group perception. If this is confusing, I don't know that I can further discuss it - it's a tough thing for me to convey. Maybe, at this tender young age, I haven't yet found the words.

What my friend experienced in Taiwan was culture shock. His host families, he described, preferred monetary endeavors for their children over the achievements of personal desires or dreams. He described people as working too hard, as pushing their children too hard in school and towards work. He also had (and has) trouble accepting the school system - which I assume has much to do with culture shock. Although he wasn't a fan of American schools, either.

[MMM]

最初の投稿者：Chile

I am trying to find the correct word. Intellectual pursuits may not be the right one. I am used to living a way of life where I can openly question what is placed before me, or ponder it.

I am still having a hard time getting what you mean here. Can you give an example?

最初の投稿者：Chile

Definitely, not all Americans are superficial by any means. What I speak of is a general mindset, which may not be specific to the United States. Having never been out of my country, I can only speak from the experiences I have had here. What I think of is a quality of existence that is satisfied by surface pursuits, and even surface philosophies. For instance, I have met a number of people who adhere to wise adages but are not sure why beyond their basic instinct. A group perception. If this is confusing, I don't know that I can further discuss it - it's a tough thing for me to convey. Maybe, at this tender young age, I haven't yet found the words.

When you say "surface pursuits" do you mean things like drugs, drinking, sports, anime?

最初の投稿者：Chile

What my friend experienced in Taiwan was culture shock. His host families, he described, preferred monetary endeavors for their children over the achievements of personal desires or dreams. He described people as working too hard, as pushing their children too hard in school and towards work. He also had (and has) trouble accepting the school system - which I assume has much to do with culture shock. Although he wasn't a fan of American schools, either.

Parents pushing their children is common in Japan, as it is anywhere, I imagine. I wish I could be more help.