I don't want to live in Japan.
 

I lived in Japan for just over three years, and go back to visit almost every year. I gotta tell you, life is a lot easier and my standard of living is a lot higher in my home country. I loved my time in Japan but will be happy not living long-term there again.

Why do I write this?

I have read dozens, maybe 100 different posts from people that say "I want to live in Japan" without ever having visited. I immediately do a facepalm when I see this, and to be honest it is hard to take most of them seriously. Now the "I would love to visit japan someday" threads much more seriously because those folks tend to be more realistic.

I titled this thread this way to get your attention, and I know I could live in Japan again if I had to or if I wanted. There are tons of things I loved about life in Japan, but there are also things I am not ready to sacrifice for the rest of my life just to be able to live in Japan (centralized heating, NY-style pizza, Christmas, etc.)

I don't disparage anyone that does live in Japan and has or will for a long time. It's a great experience, but for now I am going to throw another log on my wood stove, marinade a rib-eye and turn on some NBA basketball.

I can certainly see your point. I had an extremely tiny, old, drafty apartment that shook every time the train to Osaka rumbled by from 5 AM until midnight. It was blazing hot and humid in summer and bone-chillingly cold in winter thanks to no insulation or central air or heat. I had no car, but used a bike and train to get around, including in rain, heat, or snow. Carrying groceries or my new stereo home was a pain. I had no internet connection and no computer, and only 1-2 shows a night were broadcast with English on the 2nd audio channel (and 1 of those was the NHK news, the other maybe a rerun of X-Files or some old show). I lived far more simply than I do now, and I can't imagine going back to that. If I ever did live there again, it would be very different than I was willing to live 10+ years ago, but then, both I and Japan have changed a lot in that time.

I agree with you but the ones you mention are the anime obsessed people who never end up going to Japan or only end up staying for a short time. I'm probably going to be flamed for saying this but most people who want to live in Japan are social rejects and that is why I think many of them only end up staying in Japan for a short time. In Japan it is HARDER to make friends than in your home country. Japanese people are very busy and have little time to hang out with you. If you feel lonely in your own country you will be 10x as lonely in Japan.

So a warning for those who want to live in Japan without visiting. Please open your mind up and try to accept that their are bad sides of Japan as well. The one I mentioned above is the reason I see most of these people crumble.

Well put, samurai. I put up with a lot of things, similar to what you describe. I had no computer or Internet. In the winter is was basically freezing when I stepped out of the shower. My veranda was my closet, and many of my shirts got sunbleached on one side.

Now in a house with a yard, I can't really imagine going back to that in the same way.

I think you are right about being social. It is very easy to be completely invisible, especially in the big cities in Japan.

Check this out: Hikikomori - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Are there any other reasons you don't want to live there again? Like work hours, wages etc.etc

Well with the work I am doing now, with clients both in Japan and in the US, its nicer living in the US getting Japanese rates than living in Japan and getting paid US rates.

But to answer your question, no, the hours and wages are not a reason I am not looking for a job in Japan.

The only place in Japan I could see myself settling down is Okinawa.

I want to live in tokyo ^^ but thats for my career too .

Just out of curiosity, did you read the first post?

Yes, I did

Even this part?

Yes . but i must become a manga -ka~! and meet UVERworld~!!

i will always want to visit the country first to see if i want to live there that is if im able too.

lol that pic reminds me of the dude from "welcome to the NHK"
its a show about NEET'S and hikikomori.

Ahh yes, the only cold water washing machine, and having no dryer... I hung clothes on the balcony when it was sunny, but had clotheslines strung across my living room/ bedroom for the rest of the year. And it was not uncommon for stuff to take 3+ days to dry in that humidity or on cold winter days with no heat indoors. Oh, and how about when you left your clothes drying outside because it seemed like it'd be a nice day, only to have a sudden rainstorm or showers while you were at the store or work?

These are the kinds of "real life in Japan" things that people who have never been, or only visited a few days or weeks, just don't know about. Sure, they see pictures of Japanese apartments with clotheshangers outside, but they don't always consider all the implications of how common they are, and what that means...

If you have the money, I really do mean a lot, Japan can be awesome to live in!

IMHO, if you happen to be male, single and filthy rich, I just can't think of a better place to live. Almost everything is at your disposal if you have the money.

However, if you happen to be pathetically poor, there isn't a worse place to live for that same reason. All those temptations with no funds...

I think I've survived living here this long ( going to be 5 years this year ) is that I can always go back home whenever I want. I think i never really thought of living here permanently, its always been temporary.

lifestyle , well i don't need much, just give me my computer, internet connection and books and im all set.,.. :D

there are some things that I can complain about, but why bother I choose to be here I might as well deal with it , and look on the brighter side of things :D

To add contrast - my experience was the opposite. I found my standard of living shot up off the charts when I moved to Japan, and has stayed there in my opinion when compared to that of most people I know in the US.

I think it really depends on what you prioritize in your life. Someone who loves the land and is a farmer will likely find their "quality of life" much lower in a city, while at the same time someone who loves the city will find their "quality of life" unbearably low if they were to move to what the farmer would consider paradise.

Although I lived without any heating for a while in the US before coming here, the lack of central heating made me raise my eyebrows at first... Now I loathe it every time I encounter it in the Japan or the US. It`s like you`re in a bubble all year round and have little connection to the seasons. I`m a happier and healthier person now that I really notice the seasons and feel some sort of connection to them. Before, cold weather or hot weather was just inconvenience between the house and car - which is sad in a way. Not to even mention the incredible waste of electricity heating/cooling a whole house year round is.

Transportation... Well, I will say little other than where I lived before it took 10 minutes by car to the grocery store, longer to other shopping venues - even though it was in a "city". Public transportation? Buses that didn`t always come, let alone be close to on time.
In Japan, I can be anywhere in the city by public transportation, and know exactly when I`ll get there.

Lack of a clothes dryer is inconvenient at times, but ends there. My clothes have lasted longer than I could ever imagine them lasting with a dryer. I still have stuff that I bought before I came to Japan that is still in good condition. But yes, it does sort of suck when you want something to dry quickly.

------------

At this point though, I consider my standard of living very high. We live in a large condo, with a large yard. We have heating/cooling units in each room of the house, heated floors, and a dehumidifying unit in our bathroom for drying clothes quickly or on rainy days (3 hours for a load). We have a dedicated 100Mbps FTTH line to our condo, a full HD television, high speed reliable cell phones, etc etc. We also have a car, and access to wonderful public transportation.

I cannot say that I could see myself ever moving back to the US. I would feel that my standard of living had dropped.

I see it as quite unfair to judge the general standard of living in a place based on your bad experience in a crappy apartment. I am completely sure I could find something worse in your home country. It all hinges on what you invest into your lifestyle. If you don`t invest all that much - of course it`s going to suck.

There's just alot of people who says they want to live in Japan because of their ambitions to see these JRockers and it's amazing pop culture. They would'nt even think about the culture shock they will experience. I admit i want to visit Japan someday, but the thought of living there never entered my mind. Sure, US may be in their worst economy, still, I just don't know how I can live in a non-english speaking country.

It just depend on the luck of how succesful you will be. Some can be lucky and have a very nice life there, but not everyone can be lucky.

Nyororin, in no way was my post a dig at people who live in Japan. In fact, I don't use my dryer in the US for the very reason you said (and it is a big drain of electricity).

My point was to put an inkling of a notion in the head of those that say "I want to live my life in Japan" that there is much more to life in Japan that you don't ever even imagine affecting you. Some of those things are positive, and some negative.

As someone who has done it for a few years and is now back home, I don't feel the pull to do it again. I do keep Japanese and Japan as the prime factor in any work I do, and since college I have only had one non-Japanese boss (when I was a Japanese teacher). I love visiting Japan and look forward to every chance I have to go, but crossing the line to living there again is not on my to-do list.

MMM
YOu are a deep thinker I must say and I enjoy your posts. You are correct when you say that life is not easy over there at all. Just as in any foreign country it never is. I do believe that if you plan you will suceed, but I never wanted to live over there just live there for 1-2 years and come back state side. I really want the expirence for my children, well really my whole family. I have been blessed in the fact that I was stationed there for 2 years, and my dad was a pilot until he retired, and I visited with him before I was out of high school, we used to go all the time. That being said anime buffs, and people who have never been there have a rude awakening because if you do not have a plan or ambition you can forget it.

Don`t worry. I don`t feel that you are taking a dig at me in any way. I just wanted to offer my perspective of it. And, well, also because some of the complaints posted had a lot more to do with how much was invested in life in Japan and not actual standards of living.
If you only invest in a b&w tv, of course you`re not going to see colors, so to speak. If you start out thinking of things in a very short term view, you`re going to be much much more willing to get by with something really awful - rather than invest in something that you`re going to have to eventually lose anyway. If the apartment was awful - you could have moved. But I`m almost 100% sure that the thought would have been crushed by "Why go to all that trouble when I`ll be leaving soon anyway." Which, in a short term situation, is surely the right choice. But when you change perspective, and had been thinking in longer terms it would have made sense and probably changed your quality of life dramatically.

Basically, I just see it as a bit unfair to pull out the phrase "quality of life" in reference to a whole country rather than your own life choices. It`s all very subjective, so there is no right and wrong, good and bad when it comes to this sort of thing. It`s all up to your personal choices and perception.

I agree that some of the more... naive... members could do with a dose of reality. The thing is, I`ve pretty much given up as 95% of the time they`re in no position to actually make it to Japan regardless of what they may say... And the law itself will prevent them from just "living" in Japan should they somehow manage to pull off getting over here.
I think the biggest thing they need to realize is that life in Japan requires just as much (if not more) effort as living elsewhere. Simply leaving your home country will not magically alleviate your problems. You will not be handed a perfect life on a platter.

On the other hand, if you do understand this and put forth the effort, there is the possibility that you will find your quality of life higher in the end.

Ill be honest; I don't want to live in Japan either. I visited only for 10 days a few years ago, and although I loved it, i could see that i just isn't the type of life i want.

Don't get me wrong, I Love Japan and I really want to go again, for longer.. but not for more than a few months. :)

The reason I don't want to live in Japan really has nothing to do with the apartment I lived in...that would be pretty short sighted if I did. Basically the sacrifices I would have to make in my lifestyle now are not outweighed by the benefits I would gain by living there.

A love for Japan is not necessarily realized in living there. I love Japan, and have never had a job since college that didn't involve Japan or Japanese. I visit as often as I can, but sacrifices I am willing to put up with on a vacation I am not as willing to put up with for a lifetime.

I figured a thread like this would surface one day given how many hundreds of "i want to move to Japan" threads there are. I believe both MMM and Nyororin bring good idea's to the table that many people should pay attention too. I have not had the opportunity to stay in Japan for longer than 3 or 4 months and each time it was on business with my stepfather or just a vacation i can say i have not lived there in every sense of the word. I love experiencing things that's what i live for, do i want to live in Japan for extended amount of time yes 3 years or so, do i want to stay there forever no because i have many other countries i would like to go live in and experience as many cultures as i can before i turn to dust.

The biggest problem i have is when people seem to want to use Japan as excuse to try to run away from something. How many times have we heard (i hate my home country living in Japan will be so much better) this person has never even left their home country yet Japan seems like the answer to their prayers. "The grass is not always greener" its not just Japan its going to take work to live in another country weather it be Japan, China, Russia or Brazil.

I for one love Japan mainly history and the traditions i have no urge to be Japanese i love my diverse heritage which in some countries would be looked at the norm or interesting (i have 7 different cultures running in my blood) but not so much in Japan.

As i stated above both MMM and Nyororin stated some very nice details that i think will help lots of people. I will point out 1 of each and so of you would do well to pay attention.


MMM: "A love for Japan is not necessarily realized in living there. I love Japan, and have never had a job since college that didn't involve Japan or Japanese. I visit as often as I can, but sacrifices I am willing to put up with on a vacation I am not as willing to put up with for a lifetime."

Ask your self what you are willing to give up and what you are not willing to give up. You can find many answers for yourself weather you should actually try to move or not with just a little thinking this not only applies to Japan but others countries as well. Once again the grass is not always greener. Save yourself the aggravation and unhappiness and make informed decisions using a thought process or dont be surprised when stamps F on your forehead for "FAIL"

Nyororin: "I see it as quite unfair to judge the general standard of living in a place based on your bad experience in a crappy apartment. I am completely sure I could find something worse in your home country. It all hinges on what you invest into your lifestyle. If you don`t invest all that much - of course it`s going to suck."

If you are going to make a move somewhere you need to invest in it 100% and give it a chance not 10% not 20% but 100% otherwise you will find many unhappy things that will make you go this sucks im going home, you will also start looking for reasons to go home. Spending a few months in Japan is not really living it doesn't count as a tourist you are only going to see a fraction of society and how it operates on regular basis. If you are serious you need to do it wholeheartedly every country has it flaws in standards of living i could pick out just as many in the US as i can in France, China or Japan. The point is if you don't really give it a chance how will you know if its really for you or not. Would you buy 60K car without testing driving it first? If you time in Japan ends up sucking because you didn't really give it a chance whose to the blame you or the country?

Nyororin, MMM thanks for the great post you guys i think if posters seriously read your post they themselves can answer a lot of their own questions.

oh btw Nyororin did you get my PM?

That's a great summing up, Sinestra. It's a deeper subject than we usually get into here, but definately worth mentioning.

Less than 6 months after arriving I chose to spend Christmas and New Year's in Japan. I didn't expect how much I would miss the traditions I was accustomed to until I actually did it. I chose not to spend another winter holiday in Japan, and went home for Christmas ever since.

This is just one (though a major one) of dozens of the senses of sacrifice I didn't expect, but am not ready to experience again on a long term basis.

Well that's awesome, I like when people say how hard it is to live in Japan because THAT'S WHAT I WANT. To me, living in Japan is a personnal challenge and I think it should make me better. I think that hard experiences can only make you better. I want to prove myself I can do it. Hurray for volcanoes!

Haha, see, that's why I'm starting in small doses. I went for ten days, and fell in love with it (granted, that was a guided tour with hotels and everything already set up for us, etc. etc.). Now I'm going back again as a study-abroad student (hopefully) for a year, to test if I could actually enjoy living there for an extended amount of time. Once the glamour of Japan wears off and it just becomes "where I live", will even the love of Japanese culture be strong enough to overcome my desire, if I have one, to go back to the American style of living? Granted, my situation is pretty crappy right now (though I say that as a teenager stuck in a dorm room, I realize it could be much, much worse) in comparison to how it was back at home, but we'll see how it goes.

I understand where you're coming from, though. A pet peeve of mine is seeing all these people who claim they want to do the JET programme and become English teachers in Japan, and they don't speak a word of Japanese. I, for one, cannot understand how people would want to live in a country for three years or so as a teacher when they can't even communicate with their neighbours, or the clerks at the convenience stores. It doesn't make sense to me. Plus, I don't think some of these people really realize just how hard being a teacher actually is--I think they should try learning the language first, being a teacher in America where everyone understands them, THEN attempting something like JET. I think Americans tend to have a common mindset that no matter where they go, people will mold to accommodate THEIR needs, speak English to help them, and that living in Japan will be just like living in America, only with more wooden houses and sushi.

Everyone's experiences are different, though. :) I can only wait and see how mine turn out.

MMM... I could not agree more.


I DO wish to live in Japan, at least temporarily, because I want to work in translation, and I figure the best way to learn the language as close to perfect as I can is to go there, and immerse for a while.

Not to mention, I can't imagine a little face-to-face absorbtion of the culture would hurt when it comes to facilitating international communications, you know?

When you say "invest 100% in where you live", that can mean very different things when you know it's temporary vs a permanent move. For instance, as was said before, if you know you'll only be there a few years, why pay several months key money and moving expenses if you don't have to? And why buy the biggest TV, stereo, car, etc that you can afford if you know that you won't be keeping these things, but turning around and selling them (or possibly having to throw them away if you can't find a buyer) in a few years when you leave? You don't tend to invest too heavily in lots of material goods that are hard to ship home when you know you'll be leaving.

However, conversely, you tend to invest MORE than usual in experiences. Every weekend I tried to do something, go somewhere, try something new. I went on more trips, visited temples, museums, went biking and hiking, went on homestays, tried new foods, etc FAAAAR more than I normally do at home, precisely because I knew my time there was limited. Many times I'd ask my Japanese friends or the kids I taught about a place I'd visited that weekend, and they, who had lived there all their lives, had never been to it! So in that sense, I "invested in my life" there much more than at home, where you have a feeling that "ahh, I can go anytime, it's a local sight." But you never do. Or at least not as much as if you knew your time there was short.

In a way, it's almost like "living as if you were dying"... "why invest in material things, you won't have them very long, but lets try and have new experiences as much as possible!"

By the way, don't mistake my comments earlier as "you shouldn't go to Japan". I love my years there, and it was quite possibly the greatest time of my life. But there are hardships and differences to living in Japan that people should be aware of, it isn't some magical-girl fairy tale land, and people should prepare for that when they go.

Well, since quit a few people are telling about their experiences in Japan. I might as well give a go at it.

"Living in Japan", sure sounds nice to think or even say. While living in Japan I did begin to notice a lot of differences than how I lived in Canada. I'd even prefer Japan over anything else. Everything in Japan for me was like a new experience and filled me with joy. I don't know why I get extremely happy just by walking down the roads in Japan. The happiness is so extreme that I even get teary. Yeah it maybe weird to others but that is just how much I love Japan. I just tilt my head up, eyes wide open, smile on my face and than I take that first step out of my house right into Japan every morning. When I come home I go straight to the rice cooker and turn it on and prepare myself for yet another rice dinner. I don't watch much television. Maybe because I only have like 16 channels. I do like to turn it on and see what crazy random commercial or game show that may be on. At night I go into my modernized bed and move away the curtain blocking my view of the outside. I sit up with my back against the back board of my bed and take out a book to read. While I read I sometimes hear cars outside that sound like they're racing each other. Usually a minute after I hear sirens of the police going off. I always grin when that happens and just sigh and say "Those crazy Japanese". When actually going to bed I set my alarm early just for I can get up to see the sun rise above the city. Such a beautiful sight to see.

Even though I don't work in Japan I often help my friends out if they need anything. On some days I like going on vending machine searches just to see how many different ones are out there. I remember seeing one that actually dispensed deep fried french fries. Of course I bought some and yes they tasted great. I often walk by the common drink machine and always buy myself a Royal Milk Tea whenever I can. I just can't get enough of those. I don't have a car here but I don't mind. Taking a bike or train are not to bother. I would understand how hard it is to live here sometimes just by seeing how some of my friends are. I don't see them that much during the weekdays. They're usually getting educated and working at the same time. Once the weekend starts the fun can begin! I love going to sushi bars and udon restaurants. There are also these cool mini-bars that are the size of a normal bedroom. No lies. Though, you have to be 21 to drink in Japan. Well, they do have Asahi vending machines. If you've been to Japan you would know what Asahi was.

When festivals are going on or even events I will most likely go to them. When I was at the Sakura Festival in Okazaki I'd stop by a see all the amazing food that were being sold there. They call the "Corn Dogs" "French Dogs" here in Japan. The place would be crowded but I loved the fact that I was surrounded by my favorite type of people. The Japanese! I'd sit on the big open grass areas were people are scattered all over and just relax and enjoy the sights and sounds. Yet again I started to tear of happiness. The Mechanical Doll Festival was neat as well. I remember last time I went there the cherry blossoms would rain pedals gently onto you. They called it "sakura fubuki" I believe. It was such an wonderful sight when walking up to the main area of the festival. All I can say is that my experience of being in Japan is always unforgettable. I'd die for Japan.

Does Japan have no dryers or something? What is with you people not using a dryer? And is it true that to use the toilet, you have to squat over top of it?

If Japan is so bad, what country other than the US would be the best in which to live, then? I think Japan seems to have a lot of freedom and is rich in history, honor, and hard work. I am seeing a lot of push factors coming into my life making me want to 'shop around' and visit other countries to see where would be the next best place to live. I really don't think Japan is as bad as what you are saying. Maybe it is, but I am sure there is not many better places.

In my experience most people didn't have clothes dryers. You could just hang your clothes to dry, and it saves power.

There are squat toilets, but those are only seen nowadays in train stations and much older homes.

This thread isn't about "Japan is so bad" it is about taking another perspective. Many people here post saying "I want to live in Japan" and I decided to ask myself the question and for me the answer is no. If you got the impression this is a Japan-bashing thread, then I should have been more clear in my first post. I love Japan, and I loved living there...I just don't have the desire to do it again.

Banzai, do you REALLY live in Japan?

Yes, clothes dryers are extremely rare, and those they do have tend not to work very well. I think it has something to do with the electrical power in Japan. While quite a few people there own a washing machine (often with cold water only), I don't think I ever saw a privately owned dryer. Some professional laundromats had them, but that's all. Maybe things have begun to change lately?

And squat toilets were thankfully not all that common. My school had them, as did the train station and a few other places (some restaurants, etc). I avoided them unless it was a dire emergency. But the majority of places had western style, and a few even had electrical gadgets like a seat warmer.

But like MMM said, this isn't a "hate Japan" thread, we've all lived there, and loved it. Like I said, I wouldn't trade my time there for anything. But there are also some realities, some hardships, that never seem to be discussed with those eager to live there and who've never been, and that's the purpose of this thread, to point out some of the realities of living in Japan (and other foreign countries with very different cultures, languages, traditions, and amenities).

...Erm, the legal age in Japan is 20, not 21. And I've heard they don't card there, either (and since they sell beer in vending machines, I don't really understand the point of an age of legality in regards to drinking, but oh well).

The adults watch those vending machines, and if kids are seen buying from them, they can get into trouble. Some boys at my school were suspended for a while because they were seen buying beer from a machine. But that's small towns for you, everyone watches (and knows) what's going on.

Also, I believe those machines shut down after a certain hour, too. Not sure about that, as I don't drink alcohol (though the Japanese tried everything to get me to drink, I would at most have a small sip for the kampai then switch to non-alcoholic stuff.)

They shut down at 11PM, at least in Kansai. And now you need an ID to buy smokes from a cigarette machine. Not sure if you need it for the beer machines, too. If so, how are the homeless guys going to buy their One Cup Ozeki?