Is a Webster Dictionary from 1957 still reliable?
 

Hy!

I recently inherited a quite old Webster's New Word Dictionary (College Edition) it was printed in 1957, but it's in good shape aside from the jacket.

As I'm not native English(American) speaker I'm not sure if I can use it freely or I should treat it as a precious relic from a precious person (or something in between these two?...)

I would say it's okay to use. English from then is pretty much the same as it is now, the spelling is the same and the meaning generally is too. I would be wary if it says 'colloquialism' or 'figure of speech' or 'slang' in the definition, because those kinds of things go in and out of the language very quickly, for example back then 'square' could mean someone very geeky, but no one uses 'square' to mean that anymore. The majority of words you should be fine with though :)

Thanks for the quick reply!

I looked up these three examples and all of them looked fine to me, but 'square' (as an adj.) means rather someone who's old-fashioned and not geeky (I mean in the dict...), so I shall be very careful while I study it.

I would say that SQUARE also meant someone who was not very adventurous or daring-- DULL maybe or Living in the past. but still geeky I think.

So I've mistaken what geeky means!?? lol
It looks like I'm not ready to use it then. :o

to be honest I am not sure when GEEKY appeared-- maybe someone can enlighten us.

I also think that someone who was considered SQUARE was a person who did not keep up with the times. Not willing to take risks MAYBE.


others may give other suggestions.


Isn't geeky someone who is into science and IT etc etc.

Actually this site explains better about the word GEEK. there is much that I did not know about at all.

Geek - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Square_(slang)

maybe "I've mistaken what geeky means." would be better. OR: I misunderstood." what the word "GEEKY" Meant.

Thanks Dogsbody!

Still lots of learning ahead...

I guess the British and the American English are closer to each-other than they were in the past.
The person from who I inherited the dictionary, told me that she was given the book by her American friend, who instead of constantly correcting and quarreling over her mistakes bought and sent her a correct American glossary. She of course used to learn British English so the root cause of the differences was obvious...

They are in some respects, but there's a lot of words and phrases in one that aren't used in the other, and the spelling/grammar is completely different too. In American they would spell "plow" where the British would spell it "plough", for example, so it's probably best not to assume the two are the same, although I admit that they are becoming a lot closer :)

I always thought it must be so confusing for a non-native speaker, because there's so many versions of English. . . I have to ask - just out of curiosity - which version is most commonly taught abroad? Is American more common to learn than British or other forms?

RobinMASk is correct I am sure.

I believe that what we call a pavement-- Americans will call it "sidewalk"

In my country the answer would be: strictly British!! Our language-exam system is based on it; our teachers must use it, even if they are native American speakers.
I use the spell-checker here and must note I have to correct my words often for I use my original knowledge... It's a bit bothersome, but also educational :)

edit: I'd add that learning the words and grammar is quite different than learning the comprehension and pronunciation, so whilst I learned British grammar, I used American tapes/records too to learn the others. So in the end it's kind of a mixture of the 'two languages'.

re the spellchecker. I find that is often Americanised.

words such as flavour-- we add the "U" where they write flavor or favor. COLOUR or their COLOR. etc.

We in UK always end up imitating a lot of AMERICAN slang expressions

By the way, here you should use "then" (in that case) instead of "than" (compares things - this is bigger than that). But this is a very common error among native English speakers, especially around the internet. :)

dogsbody70 wrote: "I believe that what we call a pavement-- Americans will call it 'sidewalk.'"

This is true. In the US, pavement is the surface material covering the street, the sidewalk runs along the pavement. :)

I'm rather relieved, sometimes I think British English is a dying language. . . like Dosgbody said so much is Americanised nowadays!

Dogsbody, you make an excellent point. Do you remember when slang phrases like 'da bomb' or 'that's so gravvy' came into fashion for a short while, because it was really "American" to do so? What drives me mad is how many people are starting to say 'cell phone' rather than mobile phone or 'pants' as opposed to trousers, or - worst - 'sneakers' rather than trainers! I really do wonder where British English is going :mtongue:

Wow! Thanks! Now I'm really embarrassed...

That was certainly not my intention! I don't know what your native language is (I gathered from what you said, not how you said it, that it's not English), but your English is excellent. I'd be proud if I could read and write any other language that well. Besides, if I thought you were a native speaker, I would have just assumed it was a typo. :)

I am really impressed with fileO's command of written English. also many others from other lands who also write in English. All of their efforts are good. I truly admire them all.

Here in UK I feel that we can be lazy about learning other languages-- when we know that ENGLISH is taught in many other countries.


I have a few Scandinavian friends-- and their English is almost perfect.


Perhaps it is time that here in the UK Languages should be taught from early years when it is easier to assimilate them.

Re listening to AMERICAN tapes: I believe that Americans speak very differently from the British.

We see many American films and it is very noticeable how they speak so differently from English.

then again also depending which STATE they live in.

UK has so many different dialects and accents- so it can be really hard to understand many of them.


I certainly cannot understand Liverpudlian-- and lots of Scottish accents etc.

anyway I admire all of you who have or are studying English and taking part inforums such as this one.


My japanese progress is so slow because I feel I need someone to practice with.

I am always making typos.


It would be interesting comparing the differences in describing things.

English (British or American) are pretty much idendtical spoken.

Although there are different rules as to how it is written, in this day and age of mass media each English speaker is well aware of what the others mean.

Of course slang can be a bit hard and accents even worse but really you just need to hear them and get used to them same as anyware else.

so really both are correct.

I couldn't agree with this more. In the US, you don't usually get language courses offered until high school. This year a school was offering Chinese to grade school students and the right wing nutjobs went crazy (crazier), claiming they were trying to indocrinate their children in Communism. Oy. They seem to think learning another language is un-American or something.

I know what you mean about accents. I've always found it amusing that some interviews in documentaries have subtitles when the people are speaking English. :) But what's really interesting to me is the connections between American accents and UK accents. Until I saw The Story of English (riveting - highly recommended, both the book and the series) I would never have guessed or heard the roots of Scots Irish in the American Appalachian accent. There are many more accents and ways of speaking English than most Americans are even aware of.

Dictionaries are good sources of information about word roots which can help in remembering the words and how they're used (just threw that in to be on topic ;) )

I agree, but I think maybe it should be a new thread? Go for it. :)

maybe we can understand one another but I still say that AMERICANS do speak differently from us here in UK.

sorry but I cannot understand alot of speech from speakers in different parts of the country-- especially when they use different dialect etc.


I did as you suggested and have posted on an AMERICAN/ENGLISH differences thread

what I do notice that where we Use "T"s such as

"what do you want?" they sound as if they say "Wadda You want."
Often the "T"s in the middle of a word get changed to D's.


One thing I notice many Brits say is: somethink/sumfink-- when they mean SOMETHING. Or Nuffink-- nothink- instead of Nothing- NUthing. they tend to add a "K" sound when it should be "ING."


I hear it a lot on the TV.

also the letter "H" aich. I hear quite a lot of people say HAICH when they mean "AICH" they seem to think that they have to actually sound the letter HAICH-- to match the letter itself.

I guess thats probably a Londoners trait.

Many of us drop the last "T" in a word.

I've never really heard anyone say that... it's a sort of way of expressing in writing when someone is a chav/common, IMO.

I'm from the north of England so I say 'summat' and my Mum often tells me to speak properly because I sound common! Lol.

I think the English English (lol) is the proper way to speak English, though I would say that because I'm from England so...

I think foreign peoples general preference is to learn English English if they could pick but I doubt they care that much about it.

As for the dictionary, it should be perfectly fine. You might get caught up with some old fashioned words but to be honest I find it nice to hear them sometimes.

Thanks MissMisa! It's good to hear, I also like old fashioned words (in my language) they can sound rather pleasant, and even if we don't use them anymore they're still understood. Some of my emigrant friends tend to use them a lot, as their family went to live in other countries and they didn't developed with the 'live language', they stuck with the one which was used 50+ years ago, but as I said I enjoy their 'strange' dialect.
Now I understand there shouldn't be too many 'old' worlds in the dictionary anyway so I'll be fine. :)

@Dogsbody
Thanks to you too, it's a bit scary how many different dialect your language has. One of my friend told me that when he'd lived with a Briton family a few years ago, at the end of his four weeks there, the only thing he could actually learn to say with the correct accent was 'hello'(even-though he'd tried hard to learn more...). What I want to say is that for us, it's generally hard to learn British accents, American can be a bit easier but still hard. For example we don't use anything like your 'th', I think for me it's the hardest to pronounce. . .

@GinaS
That was an interesting video, I watched some more too, I must admit I never really liked Country-music but now, that I understand it a bit more, at least I find it interesting. (lol I hope it's not an insulting statement!)
About the language learning in the US: I admire the US citizens' attitude towards their country, even if sometimes it means overprotective rampage because of some sort of fears. But I can imagine that, it can be hard to be free when it determine your days, I really feel for you and hope it's not that bad after all.
And thanks for the tip about word roots. :)

Simon cowell always NOTHINK or Somethink-- if you listen he adds the "K" at the end.

I think as I live in the south east of England we have many Londoner type expressions-- lots of Londoners move down here--

I love to hear all the different accents-- especially foreign ones.


I actually think that when we say Learn English-- it means the QUEEN's English. not that many of us speak like her.


Language constantly changes-- which is great. No doubt with more immigration into this country-- UK-- there will be influences from all those other countries.


Its interesting FileO that you say "TH" is difficult for you. I found that very hard as a child-- and living in London was always saying "F"

FINK-- for THINK or FUMB-- for for THUMB.

Our Japanese friend had the greatest difficulty with differences between "R" L" and B" and "V"

also trying to say "WOMAN" was really hard for her. usually she says "Ooman" but with practice she can now actually say "WOOD" instead of "OOD"

It is mainly her listening skills that are her biggest obstacle.


I guess we all speak the way we Hear or listen to those around us. at home a child will mostly imitate the parent/s etc, at school they are like their peers.


In the olden days we used to have ELOCUTION lessons so that we would speak correctly and precisely.

I used to sound like a cockney-- there are still traces of that with the "OW" sound.


because I have lived in many parts of the UK as a child and teenager--I inevitably picked up each local way of speaking. when I lived in with my employers-- if I admired their way of speaking I would try to emulate it to improve my own speech.


In the NORTH it is the "OOo sound that is different from the south.

Lewk at the BEWK for Look at the Book etc.

Even sign language for the deaf has its own varied interpretations of language for each area.


American films and shows have inevitably influenced many of us in UK also the Australian programmes. I really Love Australians.

There is still the hint of COCKNEY there with the "MITE" instead of MATE etc.

Yesterday in the hospital,

I was chatting with a lady from South Africa-- I had mistaken her initially for an Australian-- but the accent is totally different really.

Id have to say thats more regional dialect/accent/slang or just plain influenced by tv, music etc. Not to say im not guilty myself since as a yorkshireman "going to the pub" often comes out as "off t' pub"

but

Ive never really had trouble understanding any English tho I must admit I may need to concentrate a little harder if the accent is thick.

Maybe its just me I dont know and it could be an intresting to know as ive seen British films being shown in America with subtitles for example, but never any foreign English speaking films in the UK with subtitles.

Is it because our t.v/movie industry imports so much from abroad or maybe because our accents/dialects can change in a stones throw.

I can't speak for other places, but from my time in Korea and Japan, American English tends to be the preferred choice, there is a seriously weird America-love that I can't rationalize.

I tell all my students to expose themselves to both accents so as to be comfortable with both, learn to differentiate some vocab etc, neither of them is correct. They are both equally crazy and strange and broken lol ...

I always tell them if they're learning English it's to understand and communicate with people who speak it, so learn the accents and dialects or you're pigeon-holing yourself.

that makes a lot of sense.

I just love the variety of speech an dialects.

Of course what we see and hear on TV radio will be meant for us to understand.

when I lived in scotland the locals definitely exaggerated their accent for the benefit of myself-- a Sassenach LOL

It must be the same everywhere in the world

when I see text books for teaching English Language I shudder at the difficulties for foreign students really

It would be hard even for me to learn from them.

Teaching is a thriving industry of course.

Are the American English teaching text books different from the cambridge system I wonder?

I will post some poems onto a poetry thread with great ACTORS reading poetry

Guess it depends on the person because I've only heard the exact opposite... but I'm from England, so of course everyone is gonna say that.

dogsbody70, I've never heard anyone say 'lewk' instead of 'look' or anything... I know some people do but it's definitely not something associated with the majority of the north of England xD

But yes I'm from Yorkshire so it's always lazy, 'the cat sat on't mat' :P 'I'm off t'pub.' etc ~

well maybe \I have not described it well enough but the vowel difference is quite normal believe me

I've lived in the North all my life, it says you don't live in the North so...

Like, people from Bolton talk like that and that's it. Bolton is a very small town compared to the entirety of the North xD

ah yes but I have lived in different parts of the country so have heard the different ways of talking.

whenever I lived up NORTH they took the mickey out of the way I spoke-- then when I returned SOUTH I had already picked up some of the accents etc.


anyway there is variety everywhere thank goodness.


different parts of the SOUTH or south West or south east vary.

so here's to variety.

Accents and dialects of the UK

here is a website where you can click on the map and listen to various accents and dialects around the country.


YouTube - British Accents

this chap imitates some accents then there are quite a few other sites.