Toyota Recall
 

As everyone might have read, heard or experienced first hand, the Giant Toyota Recall and sales freeze, what are your feelings?

Will you ever buy a first time Toyota or another Toyota? If not, what would you favor and why?

Is Toyota doing enough now?
Was Toyota too slow to react when initial issues started to creep up?
Is the reaction from Japan surprising in any way?

Will Toyota recover and if so, how fast; if not why?

If you drive one of the recalls, do you know what to do in the event of a runaway Toyota?

Motorists Alarmed by Japanese Car Recalls, Except in Japan - Auto - FOXNews.com

My reaction is: strangely, American cars still not going to be any good.

My family is a Honda, Kia and Ford family, my parents think Toyota and Daewoo are the biggest pieces of junk on the road and I have to agree with them.

Toyota
 

Yes, I will. All my former cars were made by Toyota. I have no complaints at all concerning to reliability or comfort.

Obama Administration to get involved in Toyota's Recall:

"while Toyota is taking responsible action now, it unfortunately took an enormous effort to get to this point."

Obama Administration 'Not Finished With Toyota' - WSJ.com


Should the US Government get involved more on this issue or not at all?

Currently in the process of buying another Toyota, and will continue to do so.
At this point I see no evidence of mismanagement of the issue.

People simply do not realize how systems work, and the process of elimination pattern that goes into finding a fault and issuing a proper reaction to it. The first day someone says there is a problem, you don`t magically know what caused it. There has to be a process of elimination - finding problems that are real and not user error, sorting the problems into chronic issues and total flukes (or due to gross misuse) - and then figure out what to do about it.

It seems like the media is so willing to jump on them for having multiple recalls, but what else would they have had them do? Wait for more accidents so they could be 100% sure of every possible issue?

With the Toyota recall the first problem they were able to confirm was the floor mat issue - so there was a recall. Was it the only issue? No, but if you know that even one accident was caused due to the mat eliminating that chance is the first step. Afterward, they were able to isolate another unrelated issue which they took prompt action on and issued another recall.

It seems people expected them to KNOW these issues ahead of time and fix them at the first complaint. But obviously if they had known the issues they would have been fixed before the cars were being sold. Even 20 similar complaints out of millions and millions of cars is not enough to magically know what the issue is (or even know if there is a real issue - without research it could have been people spilling glue into the pedal shaft. With the rarity of it, it would be plausible.)

I think the biggest problem is that US dealers aren`t required to know much of anything, and that there doesn`t seem to be any regulation on them. As long as they sell the cars that is all that matters. So the behavior of idiotic salespeople is reflecting badly back on the company as a whole. If people are reporting the problem but the dealers are saying "I`ve never heard of that!" and not even bothering to report it to corporate... It`s a dealer (franchised in the US) mismanagement issue, not a corporate one.

In the end, I think this is really a head shaking level of media hyperbole about a very rare issue - fueled by a couple high profile cases. I believe even the pessimistic figure on the probability of being involved in a recall related accident was 0.0004%. Of course, if you`re over 60 it jumps to 0.02% - which somehow makes me think "user error" in a lot of those cases. Unacceptable numbers - even one case is too many - but I`m more likely to be hit by a falling meteor while out in my garden.

As for "bouncing back" - who knows. Too many people see "Recall" "safety" and "Toyota" in the same sentence and set their minds without bothering to actually look into it.

Here is possibly a new twist. Until now its been called a mechanical problem only. Now hitting national news in America, Steve Wozniak, co-founder of Apple Computer, has his Prius take off.

Apple co-founder Steve Wozniak says his Prius has acceleration 'software glitch' - Drive On: A conversation about the cars and trucks we drive - USATODAY.com

What?! How can you say this is media hyperbole. If the media didn't alert people to this problem, they wouldn't know what danger exists - Toyota cried floormats before the media got more involved. Also they wouldn't know to shift it in to Neatral etc. This is what I expect the media to report on. I also expect them to follow up.

Would you then continue to drive one of these vehicles knowing of the recall? It says a lot for their QA and Engineering department of the current Era.



I think this is going to hit them hard. Very hard. Kinda of like the Bridgestone Tire recall back 10 years or so ago.
But like you said, who knows..
With mass media today, people have a very short memory.

except for the prius, toyota makes the best cars and trucks around
I am going to buy an sw20 or an aw11 when i get the chance

the explanation for this action is simple
toyota realized the issue of overpopulation a while back, and built up a huge support group by building nuke proof cars.. then, they sabotaged them to kill off lots of people :D

guess what? (new american cars are the shittiest piles you'll ever drive) Our family bought a suburban back in 2000 (1999 version - brand new) 3 years down the road and about 14,000 usd in repairs, we are going to school, about four blocks from the freeway where we'd be travelling at 60mph and the entire rear axel snaps in two @ the diff. and half goes flying off towards a house.
the reason for their shittieness is simple, they are all made in mexico. I just love hearing people talking about "buying american"... I respond, then buy a toyota or a honda.

I'd drive one of the recalled vehicles to be perfectly honest. and also, entities learn from mistakes... the organisms on the planet that do not have any immediate predators do not have anything to adapt to and in a system that is constantly shifting, leaves those creatures as the most vulnerable in the scheme of things. same with companies "I'll bet the last buggy manufacturer made the best goddamn buggy you ever saw." (Danny Devito, Other People's Money)

Are you trying to tell me that the media is only alerting people of the recall and telling them that if they experience an issue like that (with any car, by the way - not just a Toyota) to shift to neutral / cut the engine?

You must be seeing something different than I, as all the reports *I* have seen are talking about "how to protect yourself in a runaway TOYOTA" - "Would you buy an unsafe Toyota for your children?!" "Toyota cover up and conspiracy!" "Toyota isn`t stopping this fast enough!" "Do you have a Toyota death machine in your driveway?!" etc etc.

Reporting a recall and informing consumers of the danger is one thing, jumping up and down with glee and telling people they`re all going to DIE if they so much as walk in front of a Toyota (another media thing I saw - apparently they`re so likely to just suddenly accelerate that you should make sure not to walk in front of a parked one. :rolleyes: )

Yes - But I would go and have the fix done. Which is what media should be encouraging people to do - not scream and treat cars like wild beasts or hunt for conspiracies to "kill Americans" (another gem from US news).

Or a long one. It depends.

salesmen
 

Seems to be true.

Believe it or not, some people just don't know what to do when I car behaves this way.

Toyota delayed and doesn't have the means of doing this.

Without the Media Toyota would never gets its message out or sweep it under the carpet a bit longer so THEY could of been the ones that announced that the gas pedal etc sticks. ABC News was the one that brought this to the public eye continuously until they had video of some guy pulling his car into a dealer with tires spinning and then put out of gear and the engine running at 100%.

Depite what you go to on the Internet, if you watch the evening national or local news you mostly get what Toyota is trying to convey to the public when asked by the news agency. But frankly it WAS NOT fast enough, and Toyota stone walled.

Frankly Toyota should get some of these headlines and simply expect this. ALL OF THEM ARE TRUE!!!

"how to protect yourself in a runaway Toyota" IS very valid ... BECAUSE THESE CARS ARE DANGEROUS.

Well you know what, Toyota ignored first, then ID'd the problem wrong, then reacted slowly when they did know the problem while still selling vehicles. And as you can see from the above article about Steve from Apple computer cruise control malfunction, there may be another problem. I love the part where he could not get through to Toyota to tell them what happened so he had to go to the media.

SO WHAT. Toyota deserves it. They had a chance to find the problem during the floor mat investigation, they blew it off and more people died until ABC enlarged their investigation.

People are dead, families ruined and having them BBQed in the media would be nice to see.
Same for ANY product manufacturer that kills people and how they reacted.
I think media is doing this. Toyota surely wasn'tt. As you can tell from the recent articles, you can even contact Toyota.

You exagurate with bad taste that there is main stream media out there that are claiming there are conspiracies out there to "kill Americans" in a political nationalized sense. Please direct me to this main stream media source so I can read the comments on it.

what the hell? false.. you downshift successively putting strain on the engine in the case of a runaway car. and if possible, you shove that baby right up against the curb... weaving is also a good technique making you cover more ground than you would in a straight line
and if you by chance have an automatic (y would you though? manual is better in every way! :D) you stay in gear and use the e-brake lever along with the e-brake so it doesn't lock up.

haha
Try this at 100+Mph with the gas pedal stuck to floor weaving (most likely flipping the vehicle) and as your transmission catches fire.

Questions Grow on Japanese Manufacturing Quality
 

Questions Grow on Japanese Manufacturing Quality - WSJ.com

Good article on the topic.

Not having the means and delaying are completely different things. But there is also a difference between conveying information and fear mongering.

How about "How to protect yourself in a runaway VEHICLE"? Because you know, my friend was in a wreck with a stuck pedal in a Ford - years and years ago, but the point is the information shouldn`t be Toyota specific. It ISN`T. (She cut the engine, the power steering and power brakes went off and she couldn`t control or stop the car.)

Either way, I find it kind of silly to have seen reports acting like EVERY Toyota car on the road is a cage of death, and that everyone who even looks in the direction of one is going to be run down. Media thrives on fear and shock. No different in this case.

Lack of immediate action does NOT equal "ignoring". That`s the reaction of the dealers. If there is a POSSIBLE problem, not confirmed, not known if it`s a complete and total fluke - you don`t announce it. You try to figure it out as quickly as possible and take action. They didn`t ID the problem wrong - they were just extremely unlucky that there were two separate problems happening at the same time. They identified ONE of them before the other (the floor mat issue) and took action on it first. Should they have ignored that problem and waited until they knew the other? That would be stupidity.

With Steve, I really have to cringe as he is doing something that will cause an issue with almost ALL the electronic cruise control systems out there. The car does not instantly speed up when you push the button - the Prius isn`t a sports car, it takes a few seconds to react. Push the button again, and again, impatiently because the car isn`t hitting the speed you want... and what do you know, you want the car to go 80, but you`ve knocked the setting up to 95... And then the car starts picking up speed, and you panic because it`s more than you wanted. Just pressing the down button, again, will not immediately slow the car down as it doesn`t brake for you... If you`ve picked up momentum speed continues to rise temporarily even without the engine.

Either way, even Steve admitted there was no real safety issue because - as normal - braking works and turns the cruise control off. The cruise control safety radar also worked normally.

I also love the fact that he complains about not being given special priority service based on who he is. Even though he says HIS phone dropped the calls, etc. What an ego! :mtongue:
Guess you also missed the follow up where it turns out he actually had gotten through and that Toyota has his car now and is running it through tons of tests.

They DID find the problem. The investigation didn`t stop. They just took action on the problem they found FIRST - the floor mats. I`m sure they were crossing their fingers that it was the only issue, but they certainly didn`t stop at the floor mats. I really do not get this big uproar about acting on the first problem they found, first, when they found it... and then acting on the second problem they found - second, when they found it. Should they have waited and ignored the first problem until they had found all of them? Should they have let other people potentially die because they hadn`t found ALL the problems yet?

Exactly. This is EXACTLY why a company doesn`t make an announcement until it`s SURE of what is going on. You can`t go back later and say "Turns out that possible danger we mentioned was a complete fluke" or "we later found out that the driver had poured glue down the shaft!" That doesn`t make the top page - even if it turns out there was no problem the damage of one announcement is bad enough.
Let`s say it was just one single batch of cars from one single manufacturing day - if you announce that you recognize a dangerous issue in your cars - but don`t yet know for sure what it is... Do you think people are going to be around to hear you announce a couple of weeks/months later that you found it was only 500 cars that had the potential problem and all the rest are totally safe?

Remember, I`m in Japan. Clips of US news are just what I see clipped on TV here. I`m sure it`s just one tiny program, with one crazy newscaster... but it`s still stupidity. And there are people out there who will happily slurp up the latest fear craze.

Toyota had the means... its called the mass media.
Sugar coating headlines do not make people take the time to watch or read it.

The information provided about how to stop the recalled vehicles is Toyota specific. Why would they confuse people in the same report how to stop different vehicles in different situations with different problems.



Steve only got attention from Toyota AFTER the media got involved. Think of how many people like Steve are out there that can't get on National TV.
(I do like how the I-phone dropped his call though).
Cruise control taking your car to excess speed without the driver asking for it is a safety issue - despite what Steve might have been quoted as saying.
Why do you demonize someone with a reputable reputation as crying wolf?

Lack of immediate attention IS ignoring the problem. I'm not saying call for a recall on one or two cases, but seriously, determine what the real problem is and don't have CEO come out and say it is a definite on the floor mats, there isn't a safety issue, case closed. There is not a defense to Toyota lack of *immediate* attention and the fact they said case closed when they said floor mats. ABC had to drag Toyota to the fact, not Toyota.

Yes, I remember you are in Japan. Stop calling this a Media Hyperbole if all you are watching is one tiny program with one crazy newscaster. Please direct me to the media you have seen that is calling all Toyota vehicles death traps. You write:
"Either way, I find it kind of silly to have seen reports acting like EVERY Toyota car on the road is a cage of death, and that everyone who even looks in the direction of one is going to be run down. Media thrives on fear and shock. No different in this case."

Please direct me to these reports or links.

But blowing them out of proportion is also only going to get people to panic rather than looking at the situation calmly and taking proper action.

No it isn`t. Toyota vehicles aren`t so amazingly different that directions on how to stop one is different than that for others. Even the push button ignition isn`t unique to Toyota. Stopping a car that has an acceleration issue - or one with failed brakes - falls into the common sense category of information. Everyone should know this - it shouldn`t be directed only at Toyotas. But fear mongering is what sells...

I`m not demonizing him. I never said it wasn`t a safety issue - but apparently that is a subject of opinion. It`s a known issue with electronic cruise control systems and should be fixed. The thing is, it`s not limited to Toyota or the Prius. BMW has the same issue in some of their cars. (FIL does, and was told by the dealer that it`s a "sporty driving feature"...)
And by the way - you are asking for it to take you to excessive speed. The problem is that the system makes it really easy for you to accidentally ask for that, but not easy (short of hitting the brakes) to change the speed setting to a lower one. It`s a design flaw, no doubt, but not a "runaway Toyota!"

Lack of immediate recall isn`t lack of immediate attention. I guess the wording on that could be better... You can have action and attention behind the scenes without calling for a recall day one if you don`t know what the problem is. I tried to explain this. You don`t come out and say "Yeah, it looks like there is a problem but we don`t know yet what it is! Sorry!" - you wait until you do know the problem and then announce it. Corporate culture sucks, but it`s not just Toyota. If every company announced every complaint they received without knowing for sure what caused it, without checking it was really their fault, etc, there would be so much crap flooding the air that no one would bother listening.
It would have been better if they`d figured out the other problem first, or the two issues at the same time. But it would have been silly of them to say "Yeah, this isn`t the issue, but we`re just going to recall mats anyway." Unfortunately this has come back to bite them.

The "single program" bit was referring specifically to the "conspiracy to kill Americans" silliness. The rest - do a search on Google. Shouldn`t be too hard to find enough examples. I`m not going to go through my history to hunt down the specific articles I have read since this fiasco started.
Of course, if you agree that every single Toyota on the road is an out of control death trap, then I guess you might not think anything of the articles.

Clint, why the torches and pitchforks? It sounds like you not only are relishing in Toyota's issue, but would rather see them fail than fix the problem.

I think its time to panic when a company refuses the acknowledge what a national news agency such as ABC is telling the nation... cars are running out of control and original Toyota Stone walled: SEE SLIDE SHOW FIRST LINK BOTTOM OF PAGE. It was originally played down when it was though come to florishen that there are millions of these cars on the road.

I ask again: Where is this fear mongering you are speaking of?
Everyone should know how to control a car with a stuck accelerator but they don't. The media had to provide this little tid bit of life saving information, Toyota didn't because they didn't acknowledge the problem.

If the cruise control jumps you from 60 to 100 without the driver doing it, then its a runaway car plain and simple. This may be the case with Steve Apple's model. A software bug.


I want the company to tell me when there is a problem of problems that can kill me or someone else, simple as that. Then I can decide if I want to risk driving it or not or endager other people's lives. Its fine if you don't know what the problem stems from but TELL ME IF THE CAR COULD GO OUT OF CONTROL.

It wouldn't be silly, it would be cautious at the expense of the company for their customers.

recall no, admit problem yes
No. I'm calling BS on this. If there are so many, direct me to only two. The go google it yourself thing won't cut it for me when you write up this up as media hyperbole. If you have time to write all of this then you got time to direct me to two of these articles.

I'm asking YOU for the articles/news that said "every single" Toyota on the road is out of control death trap. DONT turn this around and try to make it look like I'm saying this.

You call this recall a media hyberbole, when I call it the media doing its job and Toyota asleep at the wheel.

Terror on the Roads: Runaway Toyotas - ABC News

Toyota Recall: New Questions About What the Motor Company Knew and When - ABC News

Toyota President Denies Cover-Up - ABC News

I like the idea of having a law like Japan does (as posted in this thread from my post of the wall street journal online) that its required by law for companies to report a product that has caused injury or death by how many counts to the government so they can get the word out.

Questions Grow on Japanese Manufacturing Quality - WSJ.com

Stop being a bully.
Where you are getting that I'm relishing in it?
Where are you getting that I want them to fail or give up rather than fix the problem?
Think before you write sir.

I'm angry at the Toyota situation now the more I read about it and the statistics on how many lives destroyed while the company drags their feet.

They refused to acknowledge the problem at first, gave a luke warm, incorrect fix (floor mats) and closed the case, more people died, more cars sold on the road with the same defect, more will probably die because of the delay. CEOs and management response to this is unappologetic and disgusting. I have little forgiveness for companies like this despite their past successes and service.

New problem. Now complaints in the US and Japan.
Toyota Hit by Over 100 Prius Brake Complaints - Auto - FOXNews.com

Fear mongering is jumping on the info that there is a slight risk, and presenting info as if the risk is much greater, the numbers much larger than they really are.

I am getting tired of repeating myself, but information on how to stop a car with a stuck accelerator is important. The things is ... It is not limited to Toyotas. It should not be worded "to stop a Toyota".

Apparently you missed what I wrote. It is easy to press the button more than necessary due to the delayed response and set your car for 100. The car is doing what it is told. The problem is that it isn`t easy to lower the setting (short of hitting the brakes), which is indeed a problem that should be fixed.

The key here is that the company knew that it was their yogurt in their own packaging that was at fault. There are so many things a driver could do, so many things that could screw up a car that aren`t the company`s fault, etc, that you can`t look at one or two accidents and say "Our cars are definitely causing this!!"
Someone dying after eating a yogurt is a little different than someone having an accident and saying "It wasn`t my fault! It was the car!". I don`t think there are many people out there who want to admit it if it was indeed their fault. People don`t want to admit their own mistakes. In this case it WAS the car, but it isn`t as clear cut as eating a yogurt and dropping over dead. You don`t get tons of people blaming any death on yogurt - however, you DO get tons of people blaming cars for everything. Sorting through a couple of deaths possibly caused by yogurt isn`t that hard - you might have a handful of reports with one or two that are bogus. With a car, you will have thousands of people blaming the car and only a handful of real ones... Hunting for those isn`t an easy or quick task. Especially if you say "there is a potential problem" - and everyone everywhere leaps to hopefully get a settlement by blaming every accident on that.

Corporations suck. They`re big and they`re slow.

I dug through Google news, and it`s impossible to find the articles as there are literally 10000+ items that fit the criteria. Skimming through every single one of them to find the ones I read would take MUCH MUCH longer than typing this up. Happily, it seems that eHow (One I can bring up quickly as someone who knows I drive a Toyota mailed me the link for my safety) has changed their "How to stop a runaway Toyota" into something a little more universal (the original is still cached on Google though)... No wait, they`ve changed it to this. "Anticipate a runaway situation whenever driving a Toyota vehicle" - sounds like all Toyota cars to me. (Nevermind that the article suggests doing something advised against by Toyota and pretty much every one else - pumping the brakes.)

Either way - I should have known better than to bother discussing this with you, as I`ve seen how close to talking to a brick wall it is when you`ve made up your mind on something. You`re out to crucify Toyota for this and nothing is going to make a difference.

The fact is, there is a 0.001% chance you`ll experience the problem without doing the recall fix (which everyone should) and a 0.0004% chance you will be in an accident because of it. Everyone should know how to stop a runaway car, but it is nowhere near the level of danger it has been presented as. As I have said SO MANY TIMES in this thread, painting a problem as much larger than it is counts as fear mongering - and fear mongering sells.

ETA;
It`s a sucky trait of ABS. When regenerative braking switches over to ABS, you have to push harder on the brake - if you don`t, it feels like the brakes suddenly weakened. According to Japanese news, they`ve already built a fix to even out the pressure levels in the brake which has been installed in the cars produced this year. It is not a new problem and was the same in the previous Prius. And yes, I`ve felt this one first hand. Press harder on the brake and it works normally.

What are you talking about, did I miss something? what other car mfr has this problem right now? "To stop a Toyota" is not fear mongering.. its a plain and simple fact for Toyota right now. You seem to have a problem with that.
Its not fear mongering ITS A FACT.


Nope... the car isn't doing what its told, its doing what the software tells it to do. The software appears flawed. Bottom line... car takes off when user doesn't want to.....
FAIL BOAT. PERIOD.



Maybe so, but ABC and not Toyota was able to sort through the complaints and find out for themselves there was a problem.

Yeah, and Toyota is sucking big time right now.


Just want some of the hyperbole media you speak of or the "conspiracy" articles you got on your soap box about.

#1. The e-how article is not mass media. That isn't even media. They are user submitted articles on how to fix things.
#2. That only one article.
#3. ehow shouldn't even show up in google news.
#4. I'm sorry if you don't appreciate how the headlines on this were worded.
I just don't think they can fit all the recalled models and years of affected vehicles in one headline sentence. Frankly the people looking for information on how to properly stop their affected Toyota is going to be looking for Toyota in the headline.

Come on, I really want to see the media hyberbole about how "americans are being killed by Toyotas" and its a conspiracy" plaster all over the net. And how the media is so unfair on how Toyota handled the situation... etc.

There isn't a media hyperbole. Its mass media at its finest and Toyota at its worst.
You exhagurated and I'm calling you on this.

Yet you have to have a reply. No. Nothing like yourself. Back at you.


I give what is due when a company fails at this level and attempts to sweep it under the rug at first and does a piss poor attempt at solving the problem and call it quits until the media goes back again to bring up the issue.

You enrage me that you either defend this behaviour or blame the media for calling them on it.


did those stats come from Toyota? With millions of these cars on the road with this problem, this IS a SERIOUS issue and problem and will be on the road for many years to come. Statistically with 300 some millions people in the states and a portion of them on the road and driving the affected Toyotas, AND having an accident and ruining a family is a small number in comparison to the population, but still, even a handful cripled or dead BECAUSE of refusal of acknowledgment, negligence, greed, or just out right laziness is unforgivable.



Tell those statistics to the ruined families.
You are utterly heartless on the matter.

Luckily the mass media is involved more here now in the states so that we are all starting to hear about it. How many accidents related to bad brakes does there have to be before Toyota decides they will fix last year's model?

Are they fear mongering by reporting on this?

Bully? C'mon, don't suddenly get thin skin.

It is statements like this that make me feel like you are relishing in it. Obviously this is the internet, but it is the sense I get:

Those are your words. Here are some more:

You say directly you want to see them BBQed in the media. I call that relishing.

I am just curious about all the deaths and lives ruined in this recall, as the KYODO news I am about to quote from today's Japan times says there have been 14 complaints in Japan, including one accident that led to two people slightly injured, and of the 100 complaints received by the NHTSA for the Prius, included two accidents that led to injuries. In the articles I am looking at right now, I am not seeing a death count, and it seems like that would be included if they are going to talk about injuries.

*EDIT*
Clint, I think you need to get a little less personal in your arguments here. We are all adults talking about a car recall. I am not sure why you are so emotioanlly attached to the issue, and I don't particularly care, but just because Nyororin is looking at this in a different way than you does not mean she is "utterly heartless". Statements like this only take away attempts at a continuing a civil dialog, assuming that is what you want to do.

This is really not going much of anywhere. I answered specifically about the conspiracy comment, and never even said that was a common theme to begin with - just a gem that had come from US media. I also have explained twice the cruise control thing, and you simply do not get it. The car never does anything you don`t tell it to - it will stop and slow down if you tell it to. If the software didn`t do anything you weren`t specifically controlling at that moment, it would kind of defeat the purpose of cruise control, don`t you think?
The car doesn`t take off out of the blue. It`s just easier to set the speed higher, which is quite a bit different than being a "runaway".

If you want to pull a pity card and say I am heartless, feel free to do so. I try to think rationally about things and do research into actual statistics instead of making blind leaps based on my emotions.
You are saying Toyota was negligent, and I am saying we do not know this for certain - this is how corporations work, this is how investigations go, even though people want an instant solution - it isn`t that simple, etc. You say you want them to be BBQed in the media, and I just want the media to present facts without spin or sound clips from parents terrified of letting their kids play in the driveway in front of a parked Toyota... All the while flashing images of the 2010 Prius in the background (which wasn`t even involved in this recall). It leads people to believe there is far more danger than there really is.

To blow something out of proportion, there has to be something there to begin with. I have never said Toyota had no issues. I just take issue with the media going on and on and on and selling fear - not just with Toyota, but with all the stuff they do so with. Both in Japan and in the US.

You seem to be looking for a fight about the morality of not wanting Toyota to go belly up because of this, and... well... I`m not. I hope they get everything straightened out and bounce back. You do not seem to feel that way.

ETA;
The recall and the Prius issue are totally different things. The acceleration problem isn`t happening in Japan.
With the Prius, it only happens at low speeds (under 20 something kph, if I recall correctly) and one tire slips. The switch to ABS isn`t smooth, (and the ABS acts kind of weird when you are on non-slippy ground) so there is a split second where the brakes sort of lose strength and you have to push down harder. The car does move forward more than normal brakes because that`s how ABS works. There have been no deaths related to this, and due to the low speeds and the fact that you can stop if you press harder, it is doubtful there will be any. It is scary, and is a flaw that needs to be fixed - just not quite brakes failing.

media
 

*If it bleeds, it leads*. An Old Rule of reporters.

OMG I LOVE THIS MOVIE!

The woman with 3 boobs is epic!

You're wrong I get no pleasure from this mess. Nor did I ever say I wanted them to fail. I do want them to be humble and admit. That is not relishing. That is not wanting them to fail. I do want them to come clean with all their vehicle faults and do proper tests to determine them. They need to be more open with the public... they have been stonewalling up to the point of the recall which waisted vaulable time.

Not enough dead or runined lives for you yet? You are heartless too then.
Take a look at the 3 ABC links I posted, you're answers are there.

You are the one who started saying I relish in the Toyota recall and wanted to see them fail and not fix things. I didn't. You are calling names.

Nyororin can take care of herself, somewhat, in her verbal dialog. I'm just pointing out that she sees the media as overracting and naming names by using the "Toyota" in the headlines as a media Hyperbole. My point is, without the media in this case, the problems would have never been known for even longer while Toyota either drug their feet or tried to hide the problem. She made it personal when she calls this a media over-reaction to a serious issue. She also said the Media was plastering conspiracy documents that "Conspiracy to have Americans killed by foreign / Toyota vehicles", which then retracted to only one document which she can't produce. Then posts *one* Ehow document on the examples of this is a media hyperbole.

My point is, take what the media is printing seriously on this matter, and for people to stand up and not take this crap anymore. There is no defense to this level of failure at Toyota.

I told you I'd be back.
Get your ass to mars.

Toyota may be withholding information on found software bug
 

Toyota may be withholding information on new found software bug:
Toyota Recall: Toyota Prius Software Problem - ABC News

Coverup or ignorance; American People and Government wants answers:
Waxman: Toyota Told Us Gas Pedals Were Not the Problem - ABC News

The actual letter:
http://a.abcnews.go.com/images/Blott...ntz_100202.pdf


Toyota known about it since 2007 and has stone walled:
Government 'Lackadaisical' in Toyota's Troubles - ABC News

More cases roll in, more sadness and grief.
Toyota Faces Cost of Repairs, Lawsuits - CBS Evening News - CBS News

Clint, please. Read what I wrote. I asked you how many were killed and now many lives were ruined, because in the article I read in the front page of yesterday's paper only quoted a couple injuries. I am wondering if things are being blown out of proportion a little. For that you call me heartless.

Clint I am not going to accept that kind of interaction from you or anyone. You say I called you names. I did not. I am not the one calling names, and that kind of debate just leads to cable news style screaming matches that make for nice YouTube clips, but not really for healthy debate.

Why do we need this thread? It's just a Debbie Downer example of our world falling apart . . .

And I said read my links, or for goodness sake go to a search engine.
You are trying to minimize the situation.
Because you read a newspaper that said there were some recent injuries associated with a Toyota recall make the facts of the lives lost because of this. You say "only quoted a couple of injuries" ... Why did you write this? Do you believe that there are no deaths or lives ruined because of this? Do you only have a proxy to japanforum.com or only able to read the local tabloid? Believe what you want man, you are impossible. I provided the links, and you just stick you head in the sand.

Whooah hooo ...not going to accept it huh?
People can go back and read your first post to me on the subject saying I'm relishing and hoping for failure of Toyota so they can't fix the problem.

I'm done with you on this.

Toyota Recall spreads to Japan
 

"Japan's top business daily Nihon Keizai, however, reported Friday that Toyota will recall 270,000 of the 2010 model Prius in the United States and Japan. The country’s Japan’s Nikkei News Service also reported that. But an official at Japan's transport ministry said the government has yet to receive a recall notice from the carmaker."

This is regarding brake failures.
Its coming for Japan too.
It would be refreshing that Toyota is in full recall mode and not delaying further.

Toyota: ‘Too soon’ to decide about Prius recall - Autos- msnbc.com

"TV Asahi said Toyota will recall the Lexus HS2500h and the Sai, along with the new Prius model."
Toyota to Reportedly Recall Prius Hybrid in U.S., Japan - Auto - FOXNews.com

I asked the question BEFORE you posted the links. If the opposite were true, then you would have a right to complain. You have no right to call me names for asking a legitimate question.

Since when does asking for details mean I am trying to minimize the situation?

I have never heard The Japan Times called a "local tabloid" but since what I read there and what you said conflicted I asked you for clarification. Apparantly that is a crucifiable offense. Again...you provided the links AFTER I asked the question.

I said it seemed to me like you were relishing in Toyota's problems because you wanted to seem them BBQ'ed in the media. I don't think that is something I need to back down on, as it still seems true.

But I am going to happily try and exit this "discussion" as it isn't really my style.

again sorta not
 

the NTSB 'National Transportation Saftey Board' in the United States has done over 6 investigations concerning Toyota- specifically regarding Toyota and it's 'problematic' accelerator pedal- litigation concerning 'failure' of Toyota's accelerator pedal date back as far as 2003' -2004'.
For the record concerning reported accidents for this 'gas pedal failure' -265 reported accidents
and 18 deaths.

This only applies to US customers and only the 'accelerator pedal' problem.
Two other recalls involving Toyota apply to floor mat and failure in brake over-ride system.
sources NTSB,NYT,Bloomberg,Auto World

May they rest in peace and I hope this is an eye opener to Toyota.

As expected:
 

Interesting story and possibly more to come:

Will 'Toyota Defense' Free Jailed Man? - Nightline's Daily Line

The video of the story:

Toyota Flaws Could Free Convict - ABC News


Also criminal charges ahead for Toyota as President and CEO Testify :

Toyota Misled Public Over Recalls Say Politicians As Firm Is Ordered To Reveal Defect Record | Business | Sky News


Testify:
washingtonpost.com - nation, world, technology and Washington area news and headlines

(Interesting to see the Bridgestone / Firestone File photo back from 2000 with this piece).

My mom owns a Toyota and like a friend of mine said years ago after buying a Toyota, "you never see a Toyota broken down on the side of the road".