Are women in Japan as shallow as Americans?
 

As you guys all know I am very interested in going to Japan because I love their culture. I'm also interested in dating women (short term, sadly) while I am there.

I have pretty much given up on the shallowness of women in America where you have to look like Brad Pitt for them to give you the time of day. I am wondering if Japan is any better? I am not fat or anything, I am in good shape, but I'm not model looking. I also know how to talk to women.

Someday I want to eventually move there as I'm tired of living in a superficial country.

Your problem is not women in America but is you. Until you can get a little self confidence and self esteem, you are going to experience the same issues where ever you go. People who run away to Japan or anywhere in an effort to solve their problems usually find that their problems followed them there on their suitcase. (And why would any self respecting woman want to date a tourist short term?)

If you feel this way about America, Japan is not the place you want to go. I'm not insinuating everyone in Japan is shallow or superficial, but Japan is often very much an image-based society, like it or not. ...And as far as Brad Pitt goes, hes popular enough in Japan that they've given him his own nickname there.

Brass, what is your definition of shallow ? If a woman leaves you because you ask that kind of crude questions, no wonder the problem stands by you

In my experience on JF, often no one is as deplorably shallow as taxi-cab American men and their never-ending pant of "Japanese womans better than American womans!".

I don't understand how people can in the same breath put down one set based because of the way they apparently use appearance bias, whilst elevating another set on the basis of a race bias. Some Japanese women have all the serene beauty of icebergs; only with nothing below the surface. Some American women are honestly unconcerned about looks. Don't generalize because all that does is closes doors to yourself or leads you into mistaken assumptions.

Is Japan, as a modern media culture less obsessed with appearance than any other country? No. They are just the same. Maybe in slightly different ways. But no less concerned. In fact in some ways they are worse. Pull the blinkers off. Japan's no heaven and the people there can be just as superficial and just as judgmental as anyone else. Baldness, fatness, ugliness are all just as lampooned in Japan as they are in the west.

Will you, an average looking male, get a girlfriend in Japan? Maybe, but even if she's not after you for your looks, she might still only be shallowly attracted to you as foreign meat to show off to her friends. And even being foreign is not enough nowadays to make up for major short-comings like a personality flaw. 'Cept the psychos and skanks. Seen a few of those doing the rounds.

If all American women required a Brad Pitt in order to date or even marry a man, there would only be one married man in America. That doesn't seem to be the case.

Are all men stupid, egotisitical muscle-heads?
I wouldn't rely too much on generalizations, despite the fact that they may be valid to a point. You are right, there are a lot of shallow women in America, but there a lot of different kinds of people everywhere -- even Japan. It's just a matter of meeting the right people; it is possible you could be suffering from a case of bad luck.

There are Japanese-American women. And not all of them are "contaminated by the West" -- as is the usual attitude for this kind of thread.

Crap, are you serious? It can't possibly be as bad as America right? Every damn TV show here is about how good celebrities look and which celebrities got fat over the holidays.

Maybe it's the celebrity culture I hate here and how much being good looking and popular is valued here.

I really hate being born here in America because I refuse to buy $1000's of dollars on clothes each year and $1000's of dollars on plastic surgery. I was hoping Japan would be better. I guess maybe not.

I am really surprised there are so many people here to jump up and defend America. Are you guys really unconvinced that this is the shallowest place on earth? Hollywood culture is practically worshiped here. Being intelligent, or even acting like you have common sense is ridiculed. This has to be the worst non third-world country on earth.

And yes, of course, there are honest caring women here and there are some superficial shallow men here. I know that. There are jewels and exceptions in every society. I have dated women who were honest and non-shallow. I'm not putting down every single woman in this country.

The issue I have is the culture itself and the sheer amount of superficial women here. I realize Japan is not an oasis but I was looking for something better than here.

Brass,

You talk about how superficial America is.

Who is the guy who was dating a single mother, but wanted to break it off, but didn't know how because she treated you so well?

How superficial is that? You would sacrifice a kid for your own pleasure.

I think you do not know what superficial means, and for a guy in his late 20s know very little about the world around you. It seems if people don't meet your needs, they are then superficial. Maybe going to Japan would be a good eye-opener for you. or maybe you would be convinced Japan is another place where women don't fall to your feet begging for your attention.

If you hate America so much, please go out and see the world. That is the best way for you to learn how good you really have it here.

Do you think people don't look up to the rich, famous and beautiful in Japan? In India? in the UK? in China?

I am not sure where you live in the US, and I can understand complaining about the Hollywood culture if you live in Hollywood, but I live in Oregon, where you can associate yourself with that "shallow" culture as much or as little as you like.

In my experience most people that lump Americans all as "shallow" or "superficial" or words like that have generally seen little of America. They are also generally teenagers or pre-teenagers, and that is what you sound like.

Look at the title of the thread.

May I ask how many countries you have been to? Not to sound condescending.

The grass always seems greener on the other side: A very old cliché. But very true, in most cases.
You'll live in Japan, discover its problems, overcome them... and realize you could have done the same in America. At least, that's my theory; I'm definitely prone to error.

9_9 a good proportion of TV shows in Japan have panels of celebrities there simply to look good and pass commentary on the video. Even things utterly unrelated to why they're famous. You get people in Japan who are famous simply for being good-looking. Magazine idols, etc. Not modals, note, idols. And Japanese women can be ruthless when it come to extra weight, with themselves and with other people.

And shopping is HUGE in Japan. Brand names, designer gear, it's all very much in demand, and by men too, not just women.

As for plastic surgery, yes, it's relatively popular. According to some stats, Japan has about 42K procedures per annum, landing it in 4th after the USA, Mexico and Brazil, but Japan's rate is higher than the USA if you take it by per capita (33.6 over 30.7). Generally non-invasive procedures are favored over major body work.

If you feel that all (or even most) American women are 'shallow' then of course none of them are going to like you.

Oh yeah: And as mentioned, Japan is SUPER focused on looks. Idols are very popular, singers sometimes don't really need to be able to sing as long as they look cute, and a billion other things that everyone has mentioned.

Have you ever heard of Visual Kei?

It's an entire Japanese music style based on appearance. And if you Google it, you will find that it is very, very popular. Girls of all ages fill VK artist's concerts with open eyes and closed ears. They are there because the artists are "OMG HAWT!" (though there are a few good bands out there, don't get me wrong).

Japan is as superficial, if not more, than America, and VK is only the tip of the ice burg of superficiality. Your problem isn't that you're just not "hot" enough, it's more than likely that you have bad social skills.

There are unattractive guys with girlfriends, and there are attractive guys without girlfriends. It isn't about looks, it's about how you come off to someone. Don't go tossing the blame on America when it's yourself you need to work on. As MMM said, it will only follow you, even if you decide to fly to the moon.

Why do these thread constantly pop up sigh

I think you need to step back and take a long look at yourself, did ever consider you yourself might be the problem. Im not sure how old you are but considering the title of this thread i suspect your pretty young. You my friend need to get out and experience the world and once you do i highly doubt this irrational logic of yours will still hold water. You picked the wrong country to admire if you say your fed with women being superficial.

The grass is not always greener just like shorter or a little taller.

I don't think you can rate a country as superficial or not. Certainly there are people that live to follow the fashion and gossip of celebrities any where in Japan, the US or anywhere world. But for every person that follows that stuff obsessively, there are more that couldn't care less.

I just reread this:
What in the world are you talking about. I don't know a single person in the US who spends that kind of money or has any interest in spending that kind of money on clothes or plastic surgery. It is safe to guess you live in Los Angeles, or some other big city in California or maybe Florida? That is not how most of the country, much less the world thinks. Instead of moving to Japan, why not move north a state or two.

MMM why bother? This sounds like personality and confidence problem to me. How many of these kind of post have we seen here and they all bear the same resemblance.

My initial instinct was to erase it, but then I remembered Brass was dating a single mom. I think that kind of hypocrisy was worth having out in the open.

I guess i just dont patience for this crap threads anymore. My trip to Japan is coming up in Aug maybe i should take some pictures for him if he thinks Japan is any less superficial and obsessed with beauty and trends than any other country.

I didnt know about the mom thing wow thats all i can say.

There are shallow people everywhere, men and women. You attract the same type as yourself. Change yourself if you want to meet different types of people.

Sorry, I didn't mean to get your guys panties in a bunch. I thought this forum would be somewhat sympathetic to my feelings on America but I guess I was wrong. I guess I watch too many movies and TV shows about "traditional japan" of that makes any sense and I am brainwashed as to what the reality is.

I still want to visit Japan but I guess moving there isn't really the cure to my ailes from society. Maybe I'm looking for something that doesn't exist outside of a third world country. Ideally I would probably like to live in the Japanese countryside or maybe in a small urban center with a Japanese wife (inb4haters). And no I'm not looking for some traditional submissive Japanese housewife or some kind of japanophile fantasy, just normal wife to start a family with.

And yes I do live in Southern California and yes I am the dude that posted the thread awhile back about dating the single mom. I'm no longer dating her per say, but still see her every now and then (her choice, not mine).

I think people have been a bit too hard on you in this thread, you simply asked some questions. However, your ideas are somewhat misguided. Basically what everybody said so far is true, there are superficial people and non-superficial people in every country, and location makes a HUGE difference. I am from Nebraska (though I live in Japan).. and this superficial attitude you talk about is how many people from Nebraska view people in southern California, Miami etc..

So of course, you are going to be surrounded by lots of superficial people, it is part of the culture in that section of the country, if you move to Tokyo you will probably encounter a lot of the same crap.

However, you need to also consider that maybe you are a bit too picky? Perhaps you are idolizing these "beautiful" people you are surrounded by? Wanting to find that one girl that has it all, but likes you for you and nothing else??

Also this Japanese wife you seem to be hoping for.. well.. you already seem to be laying down too many rules for her. Not to mention how do you know you will even be able to be happy living in the countryside of Japan for the long term? It really does take a certain breed of person, so you should be very prepared to deal with a whole slew of things that might bother you quite a bit.

And even in my small town of 100,000 people I see women of all ages walking around with designer bags etc.. I do not believe it is because they are superficial people though. I think superficiality in Japan and in America have different thresholds and standards.

When you come to Japan the very first thing you need to do is try to learn and understand all things from a Japanese point of view, if you judge Japan solely by your standards and culture, I think you will become dismayed and disappointed. Anyhow that is my two cents for you.

Hey Brass, I can actually sympathize a little. I'm going to answer you as if you are saying superficial girls suck as opposed to the way you worded it that American girls are superficial. Because no matter where you go they are going to be. Although Ive dated more t-shirt and jeans girls in California than I've seen in Japan. Louis Vuitton bags and short skirts are the norm here in Japan. Well at least when I was up in Tokyo that was the case. So my advice to you is take a trip up north not west. Get away from Southern CA. My home town was Sacramento, and I dated plenty of pretty woman that thought i was a sexy piece of meat. They were much less hassle than my Japanese wife, learning a new language acclimating to a new country it's tough. I wouldn't recommend it for somebody who gets lonely and doesn't have a shitload of self confidence to push themselves back up everyday.

Japan has an extremely strong celebrity culture as well. As bad or more than just about any other country I've ever been.
Can you speak Japanese? Because if you can't then any interaction you have with Japanese women will probably be more superficial than anything you've experienced in the US.

@ Brass: You being wrong may very well be a good thing.
I think the common concern here is that you'll prevent a woman from convincing you otherwise by carrying around a negative illusion.

A simple answer to your original post is, "Yes, they are."
That's not to imply that they're all superficial. But they are generally as superficial in comparison to Americans... because they are also human beings.



With the best intentions, man... Good luck.

Uh, that comment was a bit... urghhh.

Hahaha...

You know... I have personally found a greater percentage of the women in Japan to be considerably more shallow than those in the US. A majority? Most certainly not, but still more than in the US.

I think it depends on what you are looking for.
If you look for the women who do their best to be as attractive as possible - then you`re going to find that you`ll be around the same types (if not worse) as in the US. If you only go after women who invest more in their looks and clothes than education/personality/etc - surprise surprise - you`ll probably be just as frustrated in Japan. If the same subset of the population is your target, you`re not going to hit anything different. If you`re of the type where it doesn`t matter what kind of person she is as long as she`s Asian, maybe that will make up for it, but that`s even more shallow and superficial than the stuff you say you hate.

Either way, unless you start looking outside the groups you apparently are looking in, you`ll have the same issues both in the US and Japan. There are too many guys out there who seem to think that being Japanese will magically make all these issues go away.... And then find themselves getting a divorce and losing the kids because the exotic Japanese girl they married because she was Japanese was a shallow gaijin-hunter who cheated with every English teacher who came to town.

There is no better place than "here" (America), period. I've been to more countries than you can name, and despite America's perceived problems, there is none that I love better. I don't live in Japan because I believe it to be a better place than America, I like it here because from time to time I like to enjoy a long change of scenery. And, the more I see of the rest of the world, the more I come to appreciate America.

On the whole, Japanese women are surprisingly shallow. They may work part-time in a fast food restaurant out in the countryside, but they won't be caught dead without a Gucci, Chanel, or Louis Vuitton bag, even if said bag cost more than their income for 2 months.

They typical game-plan of the Japanese female is school, then a part-time job, and then marriage to a man she may or may not love, after which she can quit her part-time job and become a full-time housewife. Sex and romance end shortly after the wedding vows are uttered; she runs the house, the husband works, and the less they see of each other the better.

As has been mentioned in other threads, the Japanese engage in less sex than any other nationality on earth. I hear enough from my Japanese co-workers about their personal lives (or lack thereof) to know how unenviable many (most?) Japanese marriages are.

All you need to do is look at the myriad love hotels which exist everywhere in Japan, from the largest cities to the smaller towns. These hotels are not usually frequented by man and wife, most customers who use these places are engaging in affairs. How's that for shallow?

I have a Japanese girlfriend whom I love a lot, and with whom I have a great relationship. That she was Japanese was not what attracted me to her, I was attracted by her personality, humor, and intelligence. That she is beautiful besides these things is a bonus, but beauty and real love knows no nationality, and can be found anywhere that one cares to look.

Now that the irritation over you insult has cooled, let me clarify something for you.

One attracts what one seeks and is capable of understanding.

In clearer terms that a moron can understand.....

Shallow people attract other shallow people, and are often shunned by the majority of society. So perhaps that is why you are only familiar with the shallower, minority segment of the area you reside in.

I very much agree with you.

I can't believe people expect Japanese to be some sort of magical people that aren't racist or shallow and they're all perfect. Japanese are humans too, therefore suffer the same flaws as the rest of humanity.

Don't listen to them Brass, they don't know what they're talking about.

Just buy a ticket and go to Japan and you too can be Charisma Man!

I agree with you and the person whom you quoted.

Definitely a no especially when I hear one night stands originate from the US(no offense when saying that but again its what I hear)