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maintenance 04-03-2009 03:52 PM

シュート ザ ムーン
 
I want to translate: シュート ザ ムーン to hiragana/kanji. Is this right?:

月を射て.

command form. i haven't done japanese in yrssss. or am i doing it wrong.

EDIT: New question, on the next page!

Nagoyankee 04-03-2009 04:04 PM

That is correct.

darksyndrem 04-03-2009 05:04 PM

wait what is "ー" in Katakana??

Nagoyankee 04-03-2009 05:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by darksyndrem (Post 692980)
wait what is "ー" in Katakana??

It's the elongation bar, asking you to elongate the preceding syllable.

darksyndrem 04-03-2009 05:22 PM

So what would " シュート ザ ムーン " be in Romaji?

Nagoyankee 04-03-2009 05:25 PM

Why romaji when you can read it in katakana?

darksyndrem 04-03-2009 05:28 PM

Well, I was just trying to figure out what exactly you meant by elongating that symbol? I'm not even going to try to explain how that connected with it being in Romaji (it was pretty farfetched lol)

chryuop 04-03-2009 05:50 PM

I see it this way. Since in Japanese the syllables are supposed to be read all with the same accent, when representing foreigner words it happen the same thing. So since in "shoot" you have an accent in the middle of the word a longer vowel marks that change of accent.

maintenance 04-03-2009 05:54 PM

I always equated the ー with "おう" for example, where the う indicates to lengthen the お sound. Elongation means to lengthen the pronunciation of the preceding sound, like they said.

If you need help understanding elongation, it's the difference between okasan and okaasan. I'm only demonstrating a comparison with just sound, it isn't really marked the same.

I could be way off, I don't remember!

Nagoyankee 04-04-2009 03:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by maintenance (Post 692997)
 

I could be way off, I don't remember!

You remember quite well. Elongations are more important than some of the Japanese learners I've encountered seem to think. They can change the meanings of many words completely if not used properly.

音(おと) = short お + short と = a sound

嘔吐(おうと) = elongated お + short と = vomiting

応答(おうとう) = elongated お + elongated と = a response, a reply
___________

Many English-speaking Japanese-learners mispronounce おう. They use the long vowel in a word like "poke" and "joke". They should learn that elongated Japanese vowels have NOTHING to do with long vowels in English. おう is an elongated お, not a combination of お and う.

jesselt 04-04-2009 09:35 AM

I remember ちず and チーズ as great example for the elongation bar as well.

Nagoyankee 04-04-2009 09:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jesselt (Post 693338)
I remember ちず and チーズ as great example for the elongation bar as well.

That is a good one.

I notice that, among English-speakers, the Japanese vowels that they seem to have the most difficulty in elongating correctly are え and お.

chryuop 04-04-2009 12:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nagoyankee (Post 693339)
That is a good one.

I notice that, among English-speakers, the Japanese vowels that they seem to have the most difficulty in elongating correctly are え and お.

Good example (also coz I used to get it wrong in my written exercises) is ビル and ビール :)

But Nagoyankeeさん, there is one thing I am wondering. I see my little daughter, who is learning from me my native language, that many times she can't hear some accents or letters in the words I say...above all if I am talking to my father and that way the talking speed picks up.
In everyday Japanese, basically when you speak to a friend of yours, how true is a long sound and how much is understood by the context?
I am not that good at English so can't speak about it, but in my language I know that some words when speaking freely and smoothly at a good pace some words might sound different to a non native (I know coz I was told before by my wife).

Nagoyankee 04-04-2009 12:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chryuop (Post 693358)
 
But Nagoyankeeさん, there is one thing I am wondering. I see my little daughter, who is learning from me my native language, that many times she can't hear some accents or letters in the words I say...above all if I am talking to my father and that way the talking speed picks up.
In everyday Japanese, basically when you speak to a friend of yours, how true is a long sound and how much is understood by the context?
I am not that good at English so can't speak about it, but in my language I know that some words when speaking freely and smoothly at a good pace some words might sound different to a non native (I know coz I was told before by my wife).

Interesting question.

I would have to say that nearly 100% of the tme, we don't rely on the context but on the clearly pronounced "regular" and "elongated" syllables to understand each other. Too many groups of words would sound similar if we didn't make that distinction. Vowel sounds count much more in Japanese than in English. As a speaker of a Romance language, I trust that you will be able to appreciate this fact much more than English-speakers.

The only times that I have to depend on the context is when I talk to non-Japanese in Japanese.

maintenance 04-12-2009 03:43 AM

I had a new question! I'd feel bad if I made a new thread. There should be a Q&A thread, imo. I don't have anyone to ask Japanese questions. ):

...でも ひみつです だから(is this how you say "so"?) "anyone" (how do you say anyone? would 'だれも' work?) を 教えるな (is this the negative command form? "don't tell!"; my computer turns oshi to that kanji, so )ください.

Does this make any sense?

I broke it up so it would cause less confusion (for me. :) )

Am I close?

Nagoyankee 04-12-2009 04:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by maintenance (Post 696851)
I had a new question! I feel bad if I make a new thread. There should be a Q&A thread, imo. I don't have anyone to ask Japanese questions. ):

...でも ひみつです だから(is this how you say "so"?) "anyone" (how do you say anyone? would 'だれも' work?) を 教えるな (is this the negative command form? "don't tell!"; my computer turns oshi to that kanji, so )ください.

Does this make any sense?

I broke it up so it would cause less confusion (for me. :) )

Am I close?

There's actually a huge Q&A thread.

I'm not sure what you wanted to say.  By "...でも", did you want to put something infront of the でも? Or did you want to use でも as a connector "but"?

You cannot ever combine the nice です and the strong negative command 教えるな. It sounds very strange at least to the native ear.

Though I'm not clear on the dot part of the 「...でも」, the following sentences are all correct and natural.

ひみつだからだれにも教えないで。

ひみつです。だからだれにも教えないでください。
_______

masculine, colloquial versions:

ひみつだ。だれにも教えるな。

ひみつだからだれにも教えるな。

maintenance 04-12-2009 04:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nagoyankee (Post 696856)
There's actually a huge Q&A thread.

I'm not sure what you wanted to say.  By "...でも", did you want to put something infront of the でも? Or did you want to use でも as a connector "but"?

You cannot ever combine the nice です and the strong negative command 教えるな. It sounds very strange at least to the native ear.

Though I'm not clear on the dot part of the 「...でも」, the following sentences are all correct and natural.

ひみつだからだれにも教えないで。

ひみつです。だからだれにも教えないでください。
_______

masculine, colloquial versions:

ひみつだ。だれにも教えるな。

ひみつだからだれにも教えるな。

LOL. i'm such a tard! i completely overlooked that; i feel terrible for doing so. i'll just ask questions there from now on!

i was going to put "watashi wa [name] desu". and have a elliptical pause with "but" because i wasn't sure how it would work otherwise. I suppose [desu. demo] might? not sure.

thanks, i'll keep that in mind! i forgot how to form complex sentences it's been a few years but i'll probably try to relearn it soon! thanks!


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