Originally Posted by robhol (Post 811233)

「こと」

This seems to be a ridiculously common "word" (if you can, strictly speaking, call it that, but whatever) and it also looks like it's used in quite a few different contexts and meanings.

Can anybody please explain me what this word actually means and how you use it in different sentences?

I think there's another topic about this, but unfortunately it's in heavily kanji-ized Japanese and so I can't read it... If you kept the kanji amount down a bit, that'd be great.

Thanks in advance!

Originally Posted by robhol (Post 811255)

Thanks, but.. kanji flood, and I didn't get all that much from it. Some of those answers sounded a bit vague and unsure, which doesn't really make me confident in them.

And I have to say, I trust people here a lot more than random people on a random website.

Originally Posted by robhol (Post 811319)

I don't really speak Linguist (or whatever I'm supposed to call it) but that makes a lot more sense. Thank you. :)

Originally Posted by robhol (Post 811319)

I've also (I think) seen it after names, though. Does that make it more like "in X's case" or something?

Originally Posted by KyleGoetz (Post 811297)

こと is one of the ways to turn a verb into a noun. English doesn't do it exactly parallel to the way Japanese does, but it's like turning "to eat" into "eating."

Other "nominalizers" are の and もの and わけ and ところ.

Originally Posted by Caerula (Post 811366)

Oh, so could I generally say: whenever there is a の behind a verb, it´s a nominalizer? In the past I had some difficulties in translating for example .. いきるの... - could this have likewise the meaning "living"?

Originally Posted by Caerula (Post 811374)

And if I´ve understood it right, I can use the の at the end of the sentence for interrogation in the casual way, but か in the formal way, right?

Greetings to Tokyo!

Originally Posted by Caerula (Post 811374)

Oh yes, this sounds very replicable. I get more and more enthusiastic about the japanese language. You can envisage a lot of questions in the future :D
And if I´ve understood it right, I can use the の at the end of the sentence for interrogation in the casual way, but か in the formal way, right?

Greetings to Tokyo!

Originally Posted by KyleGoetz's awesome notes

Nominalization in Japanese
There are myriad nominalizing particles in Japanese
1. の
2. こと—thing, affair, matter, incident, fact
3. もの
4. ところ
5. よう
6. もよう
7. わけ
Prefatory notes
1. cleft sentence—
2. equational sentence—
3. complement clause—
の vs こと
1. cleft/equational sentences—S koto/no wa . . . S2 koto da [cannot use no]
2. complement clause
3. use no or koto
4. predicate is perception (miru,mieru,kiku, kanjiru), use no
5. verb is kiku in hearsay sense, use koto
6. generally, no is more concrete and koto is more abstract
7. はなこがピアノを引くのを聞いた。I heard Hanako play the piano.
8. はなこがピアノを引くことを聞いた。I heard Hanako plays the piano.
Special set phrases regarding koto
1. idiomatic expressions (~koto desu for advice)—kenkō ni naritakattara undou suru koto da—if you want to be healthy, you should exercise
2. ~koto ga dekiru
3. [past] koto ga aru (I have ~)
4. [nonpast] koto ga aru (possibility)
5. [nonpast] koto wa nai (no need)
6. ~ koto (impersonal orders)—koko de tabako wo suwanai koto—don’t smoke here
7. ~ to no koto da (hearsay)—kare wa kyou koko e konai to no koto desu—I heard he would not come today
8. ~koto [ni] wa (emphasis)—odoroita koto ni wa minna sono koto wo sitteita—to our surprise, everyone knew it
9. ~koto, donna ni/nante ~ koto ka (strong emotion)—wazuka 16sai de Wimbledon de yuushou suru nante, nante subarasii koto—still of the age of 16, she won a championship at wimbledon. How marvelous! // ま〜、かわいいあかちゃんだこと！My, what a cute baby!
Special phrases regarding no
1. emphasis—sakki kita no wa kare no otouto da—it was his brother who came recently
2. object clause of perception verb such as kiku, miru, kanjiru, etc.—tori ga naiteiru no ga kikoeru—I can hear the birds singing
3. object of verb such as to help, wait
4. purpose of use—kono kaban wa gaikoku ryokou ni iku no ni benri da—this backpack is convenient for foreign travel

Originally Posted by Tsuwabuki (Post 811386)

So far, I think the primary use of こと one should focus on is the first one really mentioned, which is called 動名詞 in Japanese. I often hear sentences like あなたの主事を読むことができません, or "I cannot read your calligraphy." In English, as was mentioned, we usually add ing to make a verb into a noun, but as you see above, the translation may not always work out that way. A sentence that shows this pattern might be スケトをすることを楽しみます, or "I enjoy skating." In that case the こと really is serving the exact same function as the ing.

Originally Posted by Tsuwabuki (Post 811386)

So far, I think the primary use of こと one should focus on is the first one really mentioned, which is called 動名詞 in Japanese. I often hear sentences like あなたの主事を読むことができません, or "I cannot read your calligraphy." In English, as was mentioned, we usually add ing to make a verb into a noun, but as you see above, the translation may not always work out that way. A sentence that shows this pattern might be スケトをすることを楽しみます, or "I enjoy skating." In that case the こと really is serving the exact same function as the ing.

Originally Posted by Tsuwabuki (Post 811386)

So far, I think the primary use of こと one should focus on is the first one really mentioned, which is called 動名詞 in Japanese. I often hear sentences like あなたの主事を読むことができません, or "I cannot read your calligraphy." In English, as was mentioned, we usually add ing to make a verb into a noun, but as you see above, the translation may not always work out that way. A sentence that shows this pattern might be スケトをすることを楽しみます, or "I enjoy skating." In that case the こと really is serving the exact same function as the ing.

Originally Posted by Sashimister (Post 811430)

We would just say スケートが好きです or　大好きです.　

Originally Posted by KyleGoetz (Post 811509)

Is it true that you would not really ever add する to a するverb and then nominalize it with a particle?

Like you wouldn't really ever say something like 野球をすることができます。 Rather, you'd just say 野球ができます。

Right?

Originally Posted by Sashimister (Post 811514)

To say "I know how to play baseball.", native speakers would almost never say 野球をすることができます.

野球をすることができます, when correctly used, has two meanings:
1. Playing baseball is permitted in a certain place.
2. A baseball player has recovered from a serious injury and says "I can play baseball again."

野球ができます has one additional meaning, which is "I know how to play basebal."

Originally Posted by chryuop (Post 811521)

Why not 野球をできる?

Originally Posted by chryuop (Post 811521)

Why not 野球をできる? I mean, できる is already the potential form of する. Wouldn't be like saying "I can do, do laundry" (stupid example, but couldn't come up with one better to try to explain what I wanted to say sorry).