JapanForum.com

JapanForum.com (https://www.japanforum.com/forum/)
-   Japanese Language Help (https://www.japanforum.com/forum/japanese-language-help/)
-   -   ジョンは入り口でチケツトを二枚出ました。 (https://www.japanforum.com/forum/japanese-language-help/32167-%E3%82%B8%E3%83%A7%E3%83%B3%E3%81%AF%E5%85%A5%E3%82%8A%E5%8F%A3%E3%81%A7%E3%83%81%E3%82%B1%E3%83%84%E3%83%88%E3%82%92%E4%BA%8C%E6%9E%9A%E5%87%BA%E3%81%BE%E3%81%97%E3%81%9F%E3%80%82.html)

Sitron 06-01-2010 11:47 AM

ジョンは入り口でチケツトを二枚出ました。
 
Setting: John and his friend are going on a date at a Kabuki-theater.

ジョンは入り口でチケツトを二出ました。

I'm wondering especially about the meaning of 枚 (mai) in this setting.

chryuop 06-01-2010 12:35 PM

Counter. In Japanese you can't use directly numbers, but you need to use them with a counter particle.

Sitron 06-01-2010 12:38 PM

So 枚 means counter? I'm not sure if I understood.

chryuop 06-01-2010 12:47 PM

Every object, person or animal in Japanese have to have a counter in order to express a quantity. 枚 is used to count flat objects. So if you want to count the tickets, you can't simply say ニチケット, but you need to place a counter. For tickets the counter is 枚, so becomes 二枚のチケット. There are different counters, so for example if you want to say 2 dogs it will be ニ匹の犬 since the counter used for small pets is 匹 (ひき).

sakaeyellow 06-01-2010 01:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sitron (Post 813946)
Setting: John and his friend are going on a date at a Kabuki-theater.

ジョンは入り口でチケツトを二出ました。

I'm wondering especially about the meaning of 枚 (mai) in this setting.

It should be 出しました(だしました, transitive verb), not 出ました(でました, intransitive).

枚 means "piece" as in "three pieces of paper" in English. In English, only uncountable nouns have counters. But in Japanese and Chinese, almost all nouns have counters, which is one of the most difficult parts for foreign learners.

KyleGoetz 06-01-2010 02:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sitron (Post 813946)
Setting: John and his friend are going on a date at a Kabuki-theater.

ジョンは入り口でチケツトを二出ました。

I'm wondering especially about the meaning of 枚 (mai) in this setting.

I answered it in another thread.
Japanese counter word - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

KyleGoetz 06-01-2010 02:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sakaeyellow (Post 813952)
It should be 出しました(だしました, transitive verb), not 出ました(でました, intransitive).

That's a very good catch!

Also, it should be ジョンさん, not ジョン.

Sitron 06-01-2010 05:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chryuop (Post 813950)
Every object, person or animal in Japanese have to have a counter in order to express a quantity. 枚 is used to count flat objects. So if you want to count the tickets, you can't simply say ニチケット, but you need to place a counter. For tickets the counter is 枚, so becomes 二枚のチケット. There are different counters, so for example if you want to say 2 dogs it will be ニ匹の犬 since the counter used for small pets is 匹 (ひき).

Wow! I didn't know that. This should make things easier for me understand in the future. Thank you!

diego187 06-01-2010 06:39 PM

yes there is a counter for everything, but correct me if I'm wrong, you can count (almost) everything with "つ".

一つ
二つ
三つ 
etc.

KyleGoetz 06-01-2010 09:29 PM

I think Sashimister posted once before here that using the 〜つ counter so much will make you sound unnatural and uneducated.

steven 06-02-2010 12:29 AM

Haha, I don't know about the unnatural part, but uneducated part probably.

I've heard Japanese people make that mistake a lot of times, too. I've heard my girlfriend called things "hitori, futari" etc before, too. They are definately important, though, as most japanese people don't make those kinds of mistakes.

Besides, by just saying hitotsu (or whichever one you need), hopefully they will say something like, "ya, ichi mai". It's a good way to learn "on the go" as they say (and much like the relationship a mother has with her child when the child is first learning how to speak).

Sashimister 06-02-2010 01:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KyleGoetz (Post 813993)
I think Sashimister posted once before here that using the 〜つ counter so much will make you sound unnatural and uneducated.

I did, and it makes you sound very childish as well.

Besides, つ only works for numbers 1 through 9.

nobora 06-04-2010 05:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sashimister (Post 814007)
I did, and it makes you sound very childish as well.

Besides, つ only works for numbers 1 through 9.

Why does it make you sound uneducated?

KyleGoetz 06-04-2010 06:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nobora (Post 814411)
Why does it make you sound uneducated?

For the same reason that saying "stuff" and "things" in a job interview in English typically does. Because.


All times are GMT. The time now is 06:57 PM.

Search Engine Friendly URLs by vBSEO 3.0.0 RC6