Of course, you think democracy isn't budding in China right now? Village elections are a common place as well as a final unleashed media is being trialed in Kunming province. China needs political reform but not BEFORE it sorts out the economic and education deficits and political reform must be gradual (look at Russia, they had a economic and political reform at the SAME TIME and that didn't them a whole lot of good, China does want to be like Russia).

Read my posts again, I'm saying you need to get the basics right first before democracy can actually help further development. Democracy with no litereacy is bs. I never said you can't have propersity with democracy, you are just putting words in my mouth.

noodle, you'll never win the argument arguing these things. Trust me, you have to take it on another angle.

What Ronin wants is free speech. But what Ronin and people like him doesn't understand is free speech without social stability, education, infrastructure and food is a whole lot of hot air.

Yes China is shutting everyone up, but its for the sake of social stability so it could get on with economic reform, education, infrastructure building etc. You know, the path to prosperity.

A large proportion of Tibetans are still illiterate, China is investing in education in Tibet. I mean I'm all for Tibetans having a "voice" and be democratic and what not, but what use is democracy if you can't bloody read.

In the end, it all boils down to the lack of patience from people like Ronin. These people already have all the basis for a democracy so free speech just seems so blindingly obvious. Yet they don't appreciate the situation in China is not nearly as rosy and free speech is not going to help at this stage of the nation's development.

I think the people in China would appreciate a little bit more time on these issues because it cannot be solved with a "vote" or whatever and getting the lama to come back isn't going to do jack. They have to get the basics right first.

I think all this talk of democracy is confusing you. Tibet's right as a nation to self-determination is the issue here. I'm saying that only through democracy can Tibetans have political will AS part of China.

The Tibetan nation is only a part of the Chinese nation if Tibetan's overwhelmingly identify themselves as part of it (or the Tibetan nation becomes destroyed via Chinese attempts at forced assimilation and colonialism). Untill that happens China is an occupying force which invaded in the 1950's.

again sorta not
 

kirakira , your sounding alot like that dude with a mustache who wrote 'Mein Kampf'? Germany during the run up to WW2 promised economic stability,bread
and insitutions for it's citizens san's 'free speech'?

Nah, kirakira sounds more like our friendly neighbor, Obama right now. Left wing, right wing... they all don't matter.

It is not very surprising by the fact that democracy is an utter joke.

Besides, we live in a realpolitik world which obsession about certain ideology is very self-discouraging. People still believe that it is the early or late 20th century? My words.

Why Japanese politicians are so bad
 

I didnt see a point in creating a whole new thread for this since we are bascially discussing political views in here anyway.

Though i find Newsweek biased and iffy on some of their articles this was one was well written even though i dont agree with all its contents. Take a look i would like to hear some views please and lets keep it friendly folks no national boarders here we all mates. :D

I especially want to hear from Ronin4hire and Noodle on this one.

Why Japan's Politicians Are So Bad | Newsweek International Edition | Newsweek.com

I don't know what you want me to say about it...

It's interesting... though I really am not familiar with the personalities of Japanese politics so can't really coment.

The only thing I really know about Japanese foriegn policy is that it's centred around the US and that Japan holds a pacifist constitution imposed upon them by the Americans since WW2.

How does it effect you white boy. :rolleyes:

No, I'm not as crazy as Obama, that guy is screwed, he has not got the faintest idea how to run the US economy.

The USA is in $12T debt, the last 6 years of GDP growth is all phony, fueled by reckless consumer consumption on foreign credit and the stimulus package to fuel more consumption is just going to make things worse. You can't consume your way out of an depression. You have to produce your way out of it.

Oh and the government is running the money printing press 24/7, guess what happens next.

Well I'm just describing the situation so far in China. You like Ronin haven't got a the faintest clue about China and to say the model in China is like Nazi Germany only further highlight just how clueless you really are.

I guess you must also believe in organ harvesting? :rolleyes:

And of course when you are out of ammo, you can attack me instead of my argument by making references for your fav drug viagra. :rolleyes: oh I'm not going to reply any of your posts unless it has substance cuz its just feeding a troll and fueling a pointless flame war.