Should the president be able to address school children - Page 22

MMM · (#211 (**permalink**))

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Originally Posted by samurai007

Than you weren't really paying attention.

Gen. Petraeus was called "General Betray us".

Murtha said that US marines at Haditha murdered civilians in cold blood, when in fact they were exonerated of all charges.

Sen. John Kerry told Bob Schieffer on CBS' "Face the Nation" that "there is no reason that young American soldiers need to be going into the homes of Iraqis in the dead of night, terrorizing kids and children, you know, women . . . ." This was a more modest reprise of his post-Vietnam charges that U.S. troops had raped, tortured and pillaged in the tradition of Genghis Khan.

Ted Kennedy said "Saddam's torture chamber has reopened under new management."

Dick Durbin exclaimed that "describing what Americans had done to prisoners under our control, you would most certainly believe this must have been done by the Nazis, Soviets in their gulags or some mad regime — Pol Pot or others — that had no concern for human beings."

Do you really think calling out troops cold-blooded murderers who terrorize women and children in the night, and act like the Nazis, Soviets, or Pol Pot, is supporting our troops or offering constructive criticism on how to win the war? HELL NO! These damaging lies and insinuations were outright attacks on the troops' and the country's morale. And they were done because they wanted Bush to fail, even if it also meant the country failing and troops dying. Remember Columbia professor De Genova calling for "a million Mogadishus" and saying "The only true heroes are those who find ways that help defeat the U.S. military"? The words and actions of a great many Dems, both in Congress and marching in protests, showed they agreed with those sentiments at some level.

"A million Mogadishus" - Salon.com

I didn't say there wasn't criticism, I said no one has come out and said they wanted President Bush to fail and for America to lose the war. General Betray Us was an ad taken out by a political action group.

And I am not going to go charge by charge, but I don't think you can deny some reprehensible acts have taken place under our watch, from Abu Garib prisoner torture to water boarding, to individual cases of rape and murder. Steven Green was just sentenced to life in prison last week for raping a14-year-old and murdering her family.

Naturally single cases don't tell the whole story and are thankfully the extreme minority, but that doesn't mean people shouldn't be able to talk about it in the proper context.

Talking about these things and saying we want the troops to come home is not the same as saying I want to president to fail or I hope America loses the war(s).

clintjm · (#212 (**permalink**))

Quote:

Originally Posted by MMM

This guy talks like this for three or four hours a day, then turn off the mic, light up a cigar and watch Beck and Hannity and all the other cable pundits do it all night.

This is bad? Thats sounds like he is doing his job.

Quote:

Originally Posted by MMM

My point is, there is an industry of people that get paid a lot of good money to tear the president apart for several hours a day. They don't have to fact check or show any responsibility, because they are not "journalists". The problem is there are people that 1) trust them and

Its not just the president, its the government in general.
To not have a check in your government officials only leads to ruin.

"The Problem(s)" as you put can also be said for government and up to the highest office. 1) Blind Trust 2) Hang on every word.

Of course they have to have fact checks... this is how they stay on the air. They have to have responsibility or they will lose face. This is why people listen. They present what they believe to be the facts for the information that can be backed up.

How else did Van Jones get canned? This is why the people stood up to the recent government spending of buying over half a billion on new jets while scolding others for not flying commercial.

Quote:

Originally Posted by MMM

2) hang on their every word. Rush Limbaugh cannot possibly believe all the lies that come out of his mouth, but the problem is there are people that do.

Its a fact that presidents and governments have lied before.
Corruption will always exist.

With this line of thinking you might as shut down the internet of any type public communication.

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Originally Posted by MMM

What it does is slowly create a culture where elected and respected officials will yell things at the president while he is speaking.

That has to be one of the most ridiculous views I've seen in a while.
Do you really think that a talk show host made Joe Wilson yell "you lie" at an inappropriate time?

Do you really believe the majority of people are being brained washed by talk show hosts and can't decide for themselves based on what they believe to be true? You don't believe anyone does a fact check on what they hear or read in such a forum?

Quote:

Originally Posted by MMM

One person I was talking to recently said she has lost respect for the office of the president, she hated Obama so much. It's one thing to not like the man, but to go so far as to no longer respect the office of president is a fantastic leap in common sense. I think another example is the topic of this thread.

Did you bother to ask the person you were talking to why she hated Obama so much? Its seems odd that you think because one can lose the respect for the office of the president is lack of common sense. There are many reasons why one could with any of the most recent presidents. Because of the promises and track record of the current president one could lose respect. To think this is a lack of common sense is nonsense.

Thanks to the freedoms allowed in America, we can. I think these shows make us think for ourselves and get the real facts.

If people blindly listen to these hosts or government without their own fact checks or thinking for themselves, then they are fools.

(Rush doesn't smoke anymore and that the golden EIB mic).
Okay now I'm just pushing buttons.. He does come off as a vain guy, but thats his gig. No one should believe what

Sinestra · (#213 (**permalink**))

Quote:

Originally Posted by samurai007

Since 98% of black voters voted for Obama, it's not a stretch to say "Oh, you're black, you must be an Obama supporter." It was racist of many black voters that looked only at skin color and voted on that basis alone, IMO. If 98% of whites voted for McCain, you'd DEFINITELY hear about how racist that is, how whites obviously voted based on skin color alone, and that it was shameful. And rightfully so. So why are we supposed to pretend otherwise when 98% of black voters voted against the white guy?

Samurai i have black friends who did not vote for Obama yes they preferred MacCain. I still wouldn't walk up to some and judge them by their skin color on something that happen. I know how it feels to be stereotyped because of skin color i would never do it to another. There are blacks who voted for him because of his skin color and did not care about what he had to say, yes some black people thought yes it finally our turn and voted but not every black person was like that. I am not above voting across party lines if i like the other guy. I dont want to be stereotyped and i gave the guy an example later of how it feels to be stereotyped an lets just say he wouldnt look me in the eye for the rest of the day.

Hes proud of his long lineage which happens to have strong roots in the south and the midwest i remember because he talked about how big his family was and we got to talking family history one day. I told him his ancestors must have been slave owners and probably shot at native Americans after all your white and your family hails from the south. He got a sense of what it felt like after i said that. I do see your point but i dont like being stereotyped because of my race.

Ryzorian · (#214 (**permalink**))

Yea, Just cause I'm a white guy, doesn't mean I want to take over somebody's country all the time. It's useually between Monday and Wensday on alternate weeks.

tksensei · (#215 (**permalink**))

Quote:

Originally Posted by MMM

None of the Americans I know were upset by it. Conservative outcry.

Is that a scientific method? And, are you talking about Albanian conservatives then? Obama's been losing independents on this and other issues at an alarming rate.

MMM · (#216 (**permalink**))

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