It's already illegal to hire illegal aliens, and employers already face fines for doing so. Unfortunately, the federal government has done nothing to provide a system to verify information like social security numbers and such, and illegal aliens have no problems getting fake documents. When running a Lexis Nexis check on my brother a few years ago, I was surprised to see that his social security number had been used by 18 other people. I checked myself and found that a person in Chicago had used my social security number to get a job there.

The federal government has failed to provide adequate funding for the imprisonment of tens of thousands of illegal aliens, leaving states to come up with the money to pay for incarceration. Illegal aliens have swamped the emergency rooms of hospitals throughout the country, and since they never pay for their treatment, the taxpayers have to, and the burden of these payments lie with the states, and not the federal government.

Arizona finally said "enough!"

As for making a better life for themselves and their families, wouldn't it make more sense for these people to do something to improve the living conditions in their own countries? If that doesn't happen, the quality of life in these countries will continue to deteriorate, as will the living conditions in America. Illegal immigration has driven down the wages in many fields like carpentry, masonry, and such. Jobs now in 2010 pay less than they did in 1985. Many American citizens no longer do such work because it doesn't pay well enough.

Another problem in the border areas are the schools. In El Paso and other areas, parents often drive their children across the border to attend elementary schools in America. Technically, this is illegal, as the parents and children are not citizens or taxpayers. In El Paso and Hudspeth counties the student populations at the schools are larger than the populations of the towns where the schools are located. Each student costs taxpayers approximately $1100 per month to educate in a public school, yet the parents of these students don't pay a dime. It's funny to go by these schools in the morning and afternoon and see the large numbers of cars lined up out front with Chihuahua license plates. The school administrators turn a bind eye to this problem because they like the extra money the schools get in funding, if non-citizens were barred from attending the public schools, they would lose perhaps 40% of their funding.

Residents in El Paso county had their property taxes increased last year to increase the funding of local hospitals which have been inundated with illegal aliens. Even with this funding, hospitals such as Thomason's are losing millions of dollars per year for unpaid treatments. In Mexico, the president actually hands out fliers to Mexican citizens advising them to cross into America illegally to get treatment for injuries and disease. Fliers are also given to those planning to enter America illegally, showing roads, and places where food and water can be found.

Enough in enough.

Latinos are not "people of color". I used to be a police officer, and Hispanics on our forms were considered "white/Hispanic".

Police can detain anyone, citizen or not, whether they be white, black, brown, or green for not carrying valid identification. If I pull you over two blocks from your home for speeding, and if you aren't carrying any ID, I can charge you for not carrying a valid ID and detain you until your identification is verified. This rarely happens, as it usually takes only a moment to verify someone's ID over the radio or computer.

Of course it is not written into the bill. That would be overtly racist.

There is the problem. Clint. Where is the REASONABLE SUSPICION of a white guy? There is none. If the cops asked a white guy with no accent to show his proof of residency, that would be illegal.

But AS YOU STATED, the majority of illegal immigrants are people of color. Therefore to ask someone of color to show they are legal is really the spirit of the law.

Would President Obama be detained by this law?

Many say he has no proof of citizenship as he doesn't have an original birth certificate. Would an out of state license and copy of a birth certificate be good enough?

I live in a state that does not do background checks like Arizona. If I visit Arizona without a passport or original birth certificate, can I be deported?

New laws will be release in the future, what we need is to comply with it

It might be a hint to employers when they pay people well below minimum wage and house them in sub-human conditions and don't get any complaints from their employees that they MIGHT be illegal.

Get real. Let's not pretend that the employers of millions of undocumented workers in the US are doing their damnedest to only hire legal workers.

Just because the law is not well enforced (hmm...wonder why) doesn't mean it is OK to break it...or does it?

Again, take away the lollipop and the ants disappear. It's a lot easier and cheaper than trying to clear away the ants...especially knowing that get rid of this nest and there is another nest waiting to get to that lollipop. An unlimited supply.

Now the law enforcement agencies of Arizona want the federal gov't to pay for the training of their 15,000 officers. So they want to use my tax dollars to pay for this awful law? I don't think so. And why is Arizona passing laws it can't pay for?

Ask Latinos if they are people of color. Invariably the answer will be "Yes".

I agree police can detain anyone. That's the problem with THIS law, as it isn't about anyone, but anyone with a REASONABLE SUSPICION of being an illegal immigrant. Have an accent? Migrant farm worker? Have brown skin? Ride in the back of a pickup? REASONABLE SUSPICION by LAWFUL CONTACT. Like you said, a cop can pull anyone over.

Here's a question to bring up: What do you think were the good points these people thought of as benefits for this law? Why WOULD this be good, for who? Or what?

EDIT: Hm? Me? Ummm . . .My guess is to prevent drug smuggling . . .

The fundamental intention of the law is to have fewer illegal aliens in Arizona. That's fine.

Unfortunately the vague wording of the law makes LEGAL aliens and LEGAL citizens targets as well.

This is the problem, and I am surprised some of the most conservative and small-government, right-protectors would find anything good about a law that takes rights away and allows state harassment of legal immigrants and natural-born citizens.

I couldn't be happier with this, personally. Arizona should be congratulated. Illegal immigration has been a huge problem in the US, and, particularly in a financial bind like the one it's in now, America can't afford to continue to let non-citizens use its hospitals and schools. I find it amusing that Obama calls Arizona's efforts "misguided." They're doing more to solve the problem than he or any other president has done so far. Not only that, but Obama and many Americans in politics are far too soft with foreigners in general. I'm not against immigration if it's legal, but Obama is actually for the opinion that AMERICANS should learn SPANISH, and that Mexican immigrants, legal or not, should NOT have to learn English. That is the stupidest thing I've ever heard. If you move into a country, you speak its language, plain and simple. I'd love to see what would happen if an American tried to go to Mexico and didn't bother to learn to speak Spanish.

But I'm getting off-topic here. My thoughts: Arizona, you are awesome. I hope the rest of America will follow Arizona's example and stop letting themselves be walked all over. I don't even LIVE in America, yet the way they have been letting illegal immigrants walk all over them has been annoying me constantly. Someone did a rant online about it, responding to all those who argue that illegal immigrants "just want a better life." He basically said that, if middle-class Americans tried to climb over a rich person's fence and swim in his pool, eat his food, etc., they wouldn't get any sympathy. Illegal immigrants in America are basically the same thing; they climb over middle-class Americans' fences and steal their things, and they're not in any life-threatening danger like refugees. It's infuriating. Three cheers for Arizona!

Which is more expensive, non-citizens using hospitals and schools or people being paid a legal wage to pick our vegetables.

There is a reason nondocumented people come here. Who is responsible? The federal government? Or how about the people that hire them?

Since when has America been about creating laws that reduce the rights of legal immigrants and natural born citizens? Because that is EXACTLY what this law does.

Please, applaud this law all you want, but never again complain about big government taking your rights away.

Obama: "I don't speak a foreign language. It's embarrassing!" - From The Road - CBS News

Before he became the president, Mr. Obama said more Americans should learn a foreign language. How can you argue with that? Are you saying Americans SHOULDN'T learn a foreign language? Maybe we should stop learning math and geography, too.

Please quote your sources there.

Really? Go to Mexico. You'll see it all over the place. Go to France, Japan, China, anywhere and you will find Americans who do not know the native tongue. Should this be a UN sanction? "Go to a foreign country and you must speak that language"?

But wait a minute.

You were just complaining that the president said we SHOULD learn a foreign language. Are you saying Americans shouldn't go to foreign countries?

You don't live in America, but you are annoyed by foreigners in America?

That seems odd to me.

Oh, I see. People looking for a better life for themselves and their families are therefore criminals if they leave their hellhole of a home.

Let's see...you live in Mexico with nothing, or go to America where they are hiring hardworking people just like you to work in their fields. Maybe the conditions aren't ideal, but you can make 10 times what you make at home, and even if it is risky, you have parents and family that need to eat. Are they "stealing"? Maybe, but since fruits and vegetables rot on the vines when migrant workers are run out of town, it isn't like there are Americans who are willing to take these jobs. Is that "stealing" jobs?

How about going after the employers that hire illegal employees and shut them down? Wouldn't that be a lot easier and cheaper?

Take away the lollipop and the ants disappear.

So we'll just read between the lines instead and just call the bill racists because a person of any race can asked?


Why would that be illegal? Quote some law, some violation of civil or constitutional rights when you say these things because you are just not making any sense.
What are you talking about? What are you reading? They can't ask a Canadian, Chinese, Middle eastern etc etc etc the same questions? YES THEY CAN.

I guess here you are trying to be sarcastic. The laws here are not racial because they can ask one of any race.


Maybe if he wasn't the president and he was walking along the border and couldn't produce ID and if he was suspicious of being an illegal.

Take your Obama bait back to the Obama Hope and Change thread... I thought you have had enough a thrashing already there. Obama is the one putting people into groups now with his latest speech to put people into groups again by calls for young, black, Latino, women voters.

YouTube - President Obama Announces Vote 2010


Now you are just being foolish. Yeah, maybe if you'll play your cards right they give you free bus/air fair back to Portland.

No, no birth certificate, no passport is required but are acceptable forms of ID, but you do have to produce ID as disclosed in the bill in English by the John Lott article I posted. No different than most places if you are asked by law officials for ID and you fail to produce, then you can be held until you do. They don't have quite the same situation in Portland as they do in Arizona. There is truly a big problem there that is affecting the country as a whole and this jerky attitude that we can't ask people if they are here legally and produce some ID because we might be hurt someone's feelings. This bill doesn't discriminate. They can ask any race they choose.

It is an insult to those who came to this country legally NOT to try to take illegals back to their country. The gangs and the crime coming across the border is killing America literally and economically; yet the Obama has sat on his hands the whole time along with Janet no security Napolitano do not do what the federal government is supposed to do.
70% of the Arizona population are thrilled with the state's movement, as they should be.

Japanese police can ask for my ID to see if I'm legally in the country at anytime too. Are they racists? Are they Nazis too?