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-   -   Will China rule the world? (https://www.japanforum.com/forum/general-discussion/39639-will-china-rule-world.html)

sutekidane 09-22-2011 07:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SCIFFIX (Post 880431)
US government tried to make an agreement with similar characteristics you said here, it's called FTAA and you probably have heard about it. What happens in South America is, anything that puts USA in a leadership position have great disapproval because of USA imperialistic politics, USA sponsored many South American dictatorships in 60's and 70's(Argentina, Brazil and Chile). While those dictatorships where being weakened, USA imperialistic influence decreased in South America. FTAA just looks like a desperate attempt to retrieve a little piece of that influence, it's completly impossible to USA be a leader of some group or agreement in South America. The only way to FTAA become true is USA accept South American countries proposals and make it a bilateral agreement instead of a unilateral and imperialistic agreement (disagreement?) to transform South America in their backyard again. Anyway, they will do a summit meeting in 2012 to decide about FTAA, but it don't looks go much far.

True the US has done much harm, but that is not unique to US, all global super powers do this and they do not like meddling from other powers in their back yard, hence we have ideas like Monroe Doctrine. It is more of a general rule for all great powers, rather than the exception.

So yes, US leadership will be perceived negatively, I agree. But not if the US can show that it has changed its mind and its global strategy, that it no longer wants to play divide and rule, but rather wants to create strong and united regional groups/unions as allies, like EU, who will be on its side, in the coming cold war with China. China and India are both just getting ready for their turn in the divide and rule imperial game.

FTAA:

Free Trade Area of the Americas - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

This particular one I believe has no future. I was thinking more in terms of UNASUR, with Mexico joining in it to form a Latin American Union to cover all nations of the American hemisphere minus US and Canada:

Union of South American Nations - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Free Trade without the potential of a future political union is only for fattening the capitalist class and the poorer country, on the other hand free trade among the states of a Union that eventually want to integrate politically is beneficial for the masses as all eventually benefit from the bigger group, just as it is in cooperatives or Unions, there is strength in numbers and in unity.

The idea is to eventually integrate the Union of nations politically like United States of Latin America, United States of Europe, United States of Africa, United States of East Asia etc. UNASUR has come a long way from its beginning as smaller sub-regional FTA's. Now Mexico also wants to join. It has a common heritage with its Mestizo majority and also a common language which is Iberian (Spanish or Portuguese). It was also the dream for people like Trotsky and Che Guevara who wanted to unite Latin America so it would be easier to stand up to meddling of the Gringo from El Norte. I think uniting Latin America is as worthy a goal today as it was then, although their method and ideology has proven to be faulty. Today democracy and people power can achieve the same result, even without US leadership, but if US sides with Latin America and help it unite, on the face of the Chinese threat, then it will wash away some of its past sins, I believe.

DaisukeKigurou 10-01-2011 09:06 PM

I doubt china will, I have been watching videos about what's being going on there and it looks grim. Not to mention the fact of communism, their law about having only one child per family, and how they have pretty much killed off most of the women in china.

There is actually a video on this, China is having a population problem it seems. There is too many men being created in china, which means less women. It has gotten so bad that men have resorted to paying other men to steal women for them to rape...


China is running out of Vagina - YouTube

China running out of women

China Running Out Of Women - CBS News

This is pretty old about a few years old, but by judging from this the population of china will soon end up in the shitter. There will be too many men in the country, and less women which means that there will be no way to procreate.

That also means that there will be less workers. Which, will then lead to the demise of the chinese economy and possibly the government..


Also Japan is working with Germany right now to get their economy back on track. More over, Japan is using other intelligent ideas to fix it, it is expected that the Japanese economy will be back to more of a pre-2009 and tsunami type economy. They are also saying that Japan will then be back to number 2 and such...

sutekidane 10-01-2011 11:34 PM

Asia: United States: Beijing: justifiable war against Vietnam and the Philippines, for South China Sea | Spero News
Pacific Currents: The Responses of U.S. Allies and Security Partners in East Asia to China's Rise | RAND
China and India, 2025: A Comparative Assessment | RAND

Japan needs a team to face China.

Ryzorian 10-03-2011 01:21 AM

I'm sure they are working behind the scenes..I know the pentagon has "contigincies" about possible conflict with China

sutekidane 10-04-2011 05:08 AM

Actually my dream is to get these folks at Rand's Santa Monica campus get all riled up, if only I could make them understand and believe in my theories and create a Democratic version of Leo Strauss and his Neo-con movement.

Or may be the OccupyWallStreet crowd will listen:
Occupy Wall Street | NYC Protest for American Revolution

Ryzorian 10-05-2011 12:57 AM

I'm not a "neo con". Neo brings back the idea of Neo Nazis, and those guys were leftest, not conservitive. Hell, "Nazi" was just a short hand form of Nationalist Socialist German Workers Party. Kinda the German form of "Soviet".

Any group who wants government to wield abslute power is a leftest group, they just have different covers to the same book. True conservitives want as little governmental intrusion as possible. IE; Leave me alone...


"Government is not reason. It is not eloquence. It is force, like fire; a dangerous servant and a terrible master" George Washington.

tokusatsufan 10-05-2011 07:46 PM

Then again,what are you if you want absolute power to do good things? I know Hitler thought he was doing good things but I mean things that are commonly accepted as good.

JohnBraden 10-05-2011 08:15 PM

The only way I see this happening is in fiction:Chung Kuo (novel series) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Ryzorian 10-06-2011 01:26 AM

Doesn't matter if you want absolute power to do "good things". Your dictateing to others what you think is good or bad, wich in itself is bad. I am an adult, I don't need big mommy telling me how to live, where to sleep, what kind of friking lightbulb I can use, nor what type of car I have to drive.

That's opression, and I will fight anyone who tries to force meagainst my will. Isn't that a basic Human right? To fight those who would force you?

DeunanKnutesButt 10-22-2011 08:17 AM

Their military isn't powerful enough and they lack natural resources.

Sangetsu 10-22-2011 01:55 PM

China will not rule the world.

First, China does not have the ideal geographic location to directly exert force or influence.

Second, though rich in resources, China is not self-sufficient. China has a huge population, and this populatpn consumes a great part of China's resources. Though a large exporter of finished goods, China must import a large amount of raw materials.

Third, China does not have a "modern" military. China's military is huge, but not so well equipped, and it is not mobile. America can deploy soldiers to any corner of the world in hours, and America's naval forces deployed around the world can stop any and all international shipping, giving America the ability to strangle countries which are a threat.

Fourth, other countries (if they are smart) will never allow China to rule the world. America's dominance has of course been very profitable to America and America's friends. They will not give up their position willingly.

The wars in Iraq and Afghanistan were not "war" in the literal sense, as neither of these places directly threatened America. These "wars" were mainly exercises in influence, and poorly executed US "policies". The last time America was directly threatened was on December 7th, 1941, and we all know how that turned out.

Atredies 10-22-2011 05:03 PM

i do not understand some americans who say that anything between america and china must be military-related. there are many americans in beijing who are saying the opposite and saying that it has more to do with trade.

there is a weird joke i heard from my chinese professor a week ago.

"the only way for china to rule the whole world is to control of the capitol hill, so that the capitol hill orders the american army to work for china."

of course it is a joke.

Ryzorian 10-22-2011 11:38 PM

I get the joke, too bad the American army allready works for the military industrial machine...

DeunanKnutesButt 10-23-2011 12:42 AM

In addition the communist party must devote a great deal of effort to staying in power, which means allocating money and manpower to surveillance on the civilian population. A communist government in the next 5 to 10 years is not a given.

Ostria 11-08-2011 12:18 AM

Chances are someone is going to get so pissed off at the US in the next 10-20 years and probably nuke us....thus allowing some country in Asia to rule the world...and I hope i've moved out of the country before that happens :/

Ryzorian 11-08-2011 11:36 PM

Nuke smuke. Our antibalsistic system is so advanced thier misles wouldn't get half way to thier targets before they were destroyed. Yes, it's really that advanced. My brother is Air Force Intel and he assures me they have weapons you could only dream of, that we haven't felt a need to deploy.

It's why we get so upset at North Korea launching two stage rockets all the time. Sooner or later it will force us to reveal just how advanced our antimissle system really is. Right now it's just a "well they might have" but after that it would be "they deffinately have".

RogerStarkey 11-09-2011 01:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sutekidane (Post 879238)
My question is do Japanese policy establishment and people believe that it is possible to have such a future, which I am sure they do and in that case what is the plan for security, if the US can no longer protect them?

Japan will have SVTOL F-35s that can be deployed from helicopter carriers, giving it a de facto blue water navy with OTH steath first-strike capacity...even up to carrying nukes (which are not 100% banned under Article 9...read carefully.)

Ryzorian 11-09-2011 04:12 AM

F-35's are way over budget and cost 100 million a piece

koreastick 11-09-2011 12:55 PM

good
good
good
good

MahamEman20 11-09-2011 03:12 PM

because chine is not pakistan and no zardari in china.

Ryzorian 11-10-2011 01:59 AM

Not sure what that last bit was about. What does pakistan have to do with it?


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