I have been to the Mandarake stores in Osaka, and I have seen the women perusing the doujinshi and yaoi shelves, though I will admit I never looked closely enough to see female-on-male rape fantasies.

I did recently read Gakuen Prince that I found a bit disturbing not becuase it is a female on male gang rape manga, and not because it is a female on make gang rape manga comedy, but because it is a female on male gang rape manga comedy that has been released mainstream in the US only because it is female on male, and not the other way around.

A part of me says of women find the fantasy of rape role-reversal empowering I am a little more forgiving, as women tend to be the victims of rape, not men...in the same way black comedians can get away with making fun of the way white people dance, but the opposite isn't true because (at least in the US) whites aren't the direct targets of racism the way blacks are.

But then a larger part of me says, rape is rape. In a game like GTA, you know you are a "bad guy". But in these rape fantasies, the rapist is the "good guy", and for me that's where a line is crossed. Again, I never said ban them, but let's not pretend they are something they are not. They are rape fetish fulfillment programs.
We can say "a true rapist would get no enjoyment out of these" and maybe that is true, but as a gamer and anime fan, I would not get any enjoyment out of "playing a game" where the goal is to rape someone and make her like it.

I like this bit. Good stuff.

Have you played San Andreas? You're actually a pretty good guy. The game teaches some good things, as well. Loyalty, courage, brothership, and a keen sense of justice.

In the game, you're free to do what you want, and you can freely do some pretty screwed up things, but on the mission, you're always dealing out to people who really deserve it.

It was a step up from Vice City, where the wog was just a thug. I liked San Andreas/Carl way better. I found his character inspirational, really.

I am not adding my opinion at all, MMM. I just wanted to make sure that the fact that there are rape games with female players as the intended demographic was "entered into evidence" so to speak. The same with the fact that there are women who enjoy projecting themselves into rape fantasies as the victims, even though they would clearly not enjoy the actual experience. As long as those facts are marked exhibit A and B, I will withdraw back into lurking mode.

Yes, that is a good point.

It really punts the idea that these games socially downtread women when women occasionally take part.

Sure, I acknowledge the fact that there is a percentage of titles that role-reverse and women are raping men. There are also ones where animals are involved, robots, sea life, Nazis, aliens, insects and fairy tail creatures like pixies and fairies.

That doesn't dilute my point, however.

That wasn't my point, since most titles are men raping men, but are for female players in my above examples. The issue here isn't who on who, but the fact that "on" is occurring at all, and the gender/sex of the player demographic.

My point was that there are sizable numbers of women that I have personally witnessed purchase doujinshi and games of said activity. With being in Japan as long as I have been, and with my normal trips to find Utena and KOR stuff, I would now say, that number is likely to be in the low hundreds just within my personal experience. I imagine a fair bit of multiplication would not be unreasonable.

That's all I am saying.

Tsuwabuki would you go so far as to say chances are the vast majority of rape fantasy "players" are men?

What I think is not important. Whether or not the fact that female players exist is relevant or not is up to you to decide. If the number seems small enough to you for you to dismiss it as irrelevant, you are free to do so, as long as you back up why it should be considered so. I just felt it hadn't been considered by either side at all, and to me, that was an egregious oversight.

Freedom isn't free, and so if we want to live in a world that endorses software where the "hero" is a rapist and protect the rights of people to play it, we have to accept the fact that there could be negative consequences. These negative consequences may be isolated incidents, or they could contribute to a culture (or sub-culture) that (consciously or subconsciously) believes that somewhere in their hearts women enjoy being raped.

The rape fantasy may always exist, for whatever reason, but to endorse the fictional fulfillment of that fantasy means we also have to prepare for and accept the consequences that may come with it.

Ah. You bring up one of my favorite quotes, MMM.

"Those that sacrifice liberty for safety deserve neither." - Ben Franklin