Global Food Crisis.

[Odin]

Let me start by saying, all of this talk of oil is getting a little far from Tenchu's original post about food and population.

Most people on this forum don't really understand how the oil industry thinks and operates. My grandparents are deeply involved with oil and I have a different perspective than what is typically seen in the news.

Very few people realize how much oil and gas may be under their feet, but trust me when I say the oil companies do. Oil supplies in the ground are quite good, even without the drilling of additional fields. In the southern U.S. there are many wells that have been shut down for the last few decades. This is not because there is not oil in the wells, but because it is cheaper to acquire from sources like the middle-east and Africa.

Now that the price of oil has began to rise many of those dormant pumps are being turned on. There has also been a resurgence of drilling operations world wide. This is not because the oil is needed for immediate consumption, but because with the current oil prices the cost of drilling are quickly recovered.

Competition between oil company is one of the big reasons why they want to invest into new oil and gas fields like Alaska and Brazil. This is because once they have a hole in the ground, they will have secured the rights to that revenue source for many years to come.

Now I would like to for us to get back to the original topic of this thread.

[Gackt21]

Originally Posted by Tenchu

The problem for over population is not global warming. That is a pretty uneducated response...

The problem is simply with so much energy (being electricity) we have an increased ability to expand. Everything has expanded and therefor so has our population. But it is unrelated to global warming, even if it is tied into one of the causes.

That is two of the excuse the government gives us. Libs do this a lot. First, they come up with the Global Warming scam then they don't want to drill for the oil because of enviromentalist because they say we will hurt the animals. Then they go after our corn crop for alturnitive energy and cause food prices to go up. Most of our problem comes from the government restricting things they have no business in. I say lets go drill and get the energy and drop the alturnitive energy scam.

Another issue that would help is to lower taxes and prices for things. I would not take government hand outs but work hard for my money and earn it honestly. Big government makes people poorer than limited government set up by the Constitution of the United States.

[Odin]

Originally Posted by Tenchu

And so it should be, I think. Yet will that get overturned by economic failures? Probably. But countries like US will prob be the last to suffer from food shortage.

Oh I agree with you, I don't want to see any expansion into natural habitats.

[Nathan]

Originally Posted by Odin

Hmmm, yes and no. Utilization of current farmland is near 100%, however there are large tracks of former farmland, that have gone feral under government wildlife conservation programs. The farmers are paid $50 per acre not to plant, and allow the land to return to it's natural wild state. However with newer high food prices many farmers are wanting to pull out of these programs. At the current food prices, they can earn over $150 per acre planting wheat or other staple crops.

Kind of ironic that many farmers entered these programs because grain and cattle prices were so low almost every farmer was in the red ten years ago. They federal government had to step in to save almost every farmer in Saskatchewan (part of Canada) from bankruptcy.

Nowadays, you don't become a farmer unless you're going to inherit a very large tract of land. The only people actually making money from farming these days are large companies, and individual farmers that lucked out on having a very rich topsoil.

[Gackt21]

Well I have heard it said that Libs don't care about the people when they talk about the environment being protected. You just want to stop pogress for reason of destroying a country. That is what the Libs and the Dem want you to think. Population rises you get more resourse to help it not stop it. Earth is ajusting to it just fine. You don't make much sense when it comes to the basics of suppy and demand. It is now 50 to 100 American dollars (4 dollars a gallon) to fill up are cars and I have heard it is worse over in Europe (7 dollars a gallon). Don't tell me it is the full fault of the gas companies because they have so many restriction on them they can go get or refine anything. So you the consumer will pay more and more money until you don't have enough to survive in this world then you will be hoping you listened. Big government is most of the cause here and not the oil companies.

[noodle]

The world is fine, and we're not running out of space or food... If it weren't for busines and money, we could easily have double or triple the world's current population. Unfortunately, comforts make us destroy the planet.

Odin, thanks for the correction at the start of the thread... I was gonna mention it, but good explanation.

[fluffy0000]

Farming is big business and does'nt operate without money and business. Unless your describing subsistence farming which unfortunately is what 3rd World countrys have too operate with? According to UN and UN food program fyi UNF has spent over 612 million (USD) dollars on food for hungry people and needs more. For example UNF assists Ethiopia to reach an additional 4.7 million people in response to the government's urgent appeal for food and nutrition assistance to avoid hunger-related deaths in the coming months. According too UNF they are hard pressed too meet the minimum demands due to civil wars and natural disasters like climate change especially in Southeast Asia. The US provides 60% of all the corn -1/3 soybean crop - 1/4 rice that transported across international borders-according to 08' Crop reports for US soybean and corn are 10-20% behind last years crop due too rain. Due too low supply of key commodities in US due too weather ( rain ). Droughts and rising fuel prices too transport key commodities are another factor in continued 'world food crisis' according to UNF 08' sources.

[noodle]

Originally Posted by Tenchu

Double or triple, are you serious?

Why not? Not everywhere in the world is like Hong Kong you know... In fact, the majority of the world is uninhabitted (even if you exclude the harsh parts of the world where it would be impossible for humans to live safely). Another way to look at it, one sixth of the worlds population lives in china and they still have plenty of space. Of course the cities are overcrowded, but they can easily build a couple more dozen cities.

The only thing making this situation dire, is money and business.

[noodle]

why are you showing me the earth at night? That doesn't really concern this topic. You ought to be showing this image instead...

the red is where it is densly populated. I think it's obvious that there is a lot of room left

[Odin]

Originally Posted by noodle

why are you showing me the earth at night? That doesn't really concern this topic. You ought to be showing this image instead...

the red is where it is densly populated. I think it's obvious that there is a lot of room left

Space is not the issue. Resources are the problem!

The problem with that map is that it only show space available, and does not give any indication of available food resources. I know I've seen a map of arable land, although I can't seem to find it at the moment. Until I do, let me offer this map, that gives a indication of how little of the land surface supports vegetation. If you notice, in particular in Europe and Asia, there is a strong correlation between the areas of high human population and areas of high vegetation. (sorry it's a rather large map)

http://www.nasa.gov/images/content/2...1_lrg_full.jpg

According to current estimates by the American CIA, calculates the total amount of arable land to be about 13% of the total land surface. Of that about 4.7% is currently being used for permanent crops. So we are using about 36% of the available land.

So yes there is room for growth, however with the uncertainties of the environment it is dangerous to substantially eat into the reserves this available land. Also, it is not unusual for arable lands to become depleted do to human activity and over farming. Especially in those areas where farming techniques are less sophisticated. So there is no guarantee that current arable land will be available for future use.