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08-13-2010, 06:26 AM

I would be honered to accompany you in this quest for the Japanese tutoring. I know a couple of Japanese friends that would be glad to help you learn the language for English lessons ^^. PM me if you're interested!
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08-15-2010, 04:49 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by YuriTokoro View Post
覚さん、こんばんは。
ゆりさん、こんばんは。

Quote:
Indeed! So it’s very hard to me to say things in English, because I always need to think what I should say. In Japanese, you would have some formal set phrases most always.

If I can read English very quickly, I would read magazines or news papers to know how you play such roles. I can’t now, but one day, I will!


I don’t know!!! Please, let me know!
The word insane is quite extreme and serious, especially compared to words like crazy or mad. This gives your expression something called a deadpan delivery. We have a nice quotation for this in the OED:

"For what is known as 'dead pan' humour no one can challenge Miss Jean Mann, whose facial expression gives no warning of the thrust to come."
Sunday Times, 1957, 3 March.

Deadpan describes just the delivery of a joke — that is things like the tone of voice, facial expression, register and wording.

Essentially, deadpan delivery heightens the comic effect by taking the audience by surprise. There can be other effects depending on context or the particular mix of register and content, but that's more complicated.

Quote:
Yes, when the things can be passed.

Could you pass me the pepper, please? = 胡椒(こしょう)をとっていただけませんか?
Could you pass me the remote control? = リモコンをとっていただけませんか?
ありがとうございました。
They are now in the book!
So this a variation of いただく? So is it literally something like:
"Can't I get the pepper, please?"

Quote:
Could you pass me a roll of toilet paper? = トイレットペーパーをとっていただけませんか?(This situation must be a kind of urgent. I wish you would not say this. If you say this, you must be in an individual cabin… )


Erm...
Perhaps the less said the better?!

Quote:
Sorry, I don’t understand.
You mean the term is not that new?
That's what I meant, but I'm just going by what it says on Wikipedia:

[quote]"The term most commonly used contemporaneously to refer to the policy was kaikin (海禁, Sea restriction)...Trade in fact prospered during this period, and though relations and trade were restricted to certain ports, the country was far from closed. In fact, as the shogunate expelled the Portuguese, they simultaneously engaged in discussions with Dutch and Korean representatives to ensure that the overall volume of trade did not suffer. Thus, it has become increasingly common in scholarship in recent decades to refer to the foreign relations policy of the period not as sakoku, implying a totally secluded, isolated, and "closed" country, but by the term kaikin (海禁, "maritime restrictions") used in documents at the time, and derived from the similar Chinese concept hai jin."[\QUOTE]

They cite Ronald Toby in the Journal of Japanese Studies — I'll look it up for next time.

Quote:
I didn’t know saying いただきます is called Grace.
I probably wouldn't strictly say that いただきます is called Grace, but certainly Grace is the closest analogy. Perhaps it might be appropriate to call いただきます a particular type of Grace.

Quote:
rub-a-dub-dub… What’s that?
It's imitative of the sound of a drum being beaten. Sometimes when people say "rub-a-dub-dub, thanks for the grub!" they make a gesture to imitate mildly drumming on their stomach. I suppose this must be to emphasise that they are so full that their stomach has become like a large drum!

Here are a couple of quotations we use in the OED:

"The drum advanced, beating no measured martial tune, but a kind of rub-a-dub-dub"
Scott's Waverly (1814), Vol.II, p185

"I am always hearing..the ear-piercing fife and the rub-a-dub-dub of the drum."
Melbourne Argus (1887, December 24th), p4.

"The wheels began to beat time. A rub-a-dubdub, a rub-a-dubdub, the wheels went."
By the Shores of Silver Lake, L. I. Wilder (1939)

Quote:
Why don’t you begin to say 「いただきます」and 「ごちそうさまでした」 today?
I will! I will have to explain the meanings to people the first time though!

Quote:
Don’t you say 「ごちそうさまでした」to your mother or your wife?
Well, I'm not married, and my mother doesn't speak Japanese, so no. However, I do always thank my host and the cook and compliment the food.

Quote:
I don’t agree with you. I’m positive, I’m sure you are talented!
When you catch glimpses of the meanings of what I say, you would be able to communicate.
ありがとうございました。
I am honoured that you think so!

Quote:
“Your chosen path” sounds right.
Don’t you say “your way”?
I don’t see the difference between “your chosen path” and “your way”.
We do say "your way". In fact there is a well-known song popularised by Frank Sinatra called "My Way" .



Quote:
And now the end is near,
And so I face the final curtain;
My friend I'll say it clear,
I'll state my case of which I'm certain:

I've lived a life that's full,
I traveled each and every highway,
And more, much more than this:
I did it my way.

Regrets, I've had a few,
But then again too few to mention;
I did what I had to do
And saw it through without exemption.

I planned each charted course,
Each careful step along the byway,
And more, much more than this:
I did it my way.

Yes there were times, I'm sure you knew,
When I bit off more than I could chew,
But through it all, when there was doubt,
I ate it up and spit it out, I faced it all
And I stood tall and did it my way.

I've loved, I've laughed and cried,
I've had my fill, my share of losing;
And now, as tears subside,
I find it all so amusing.

To think, I did all that,
And may I say not in a shy way;
Oh no, oh no, not me,
I did it my way.

For what is a man? What has he got?
If not himself, then he has not
To say the things he truly feels,
And not the words of one who kneels;
The record shows I took the blows
And did it my way.

Yes it was my way!
However, in the case of "My Way", the meaning is clear from context. In our translation "your chosen path" sounds better to me; perhaps it's because we're talking about keeping your foot firmly etc. I think if we wanted to say "your way" it would have to be something like:
"Keep going steadily; do it your way and do not waver."

Quote:
何もしないで 生きるより 何かを求めて 生きようよ
Maybe this will make sense.
Ok, I think it's like this...

なんにも = nothing
しないで = doesn't ~become
いきる = living
より = from

Which gives us...

<It is not the case that> <from> <living> <comes> <nothing>

Which can be paraphrased as...

From Living, something great can come.

Is that any good?

Quote:
It’s not when, but while. I believe when you say when, you mean a short time. On the other hand, when you say while, you mean longer than when. Is this right?
I know what you mean. However, when and while are a bit more flexible than that.

"While..." can be used to mean "during the time that..." or "for as long as..."

As for "when", that does indeed usually mean a shorter time or "at the instant that...", as in:

"When the cock crows..."

or

"When the clock strikes midnight..."

However, it can also mean "during the time that..." in particular contexts such as using the present tense to talk about the general case:

"When the weather is nice, I'm happy."

"Sing when you're winning!"

"When you're away, I'm lonely and sad."

If we took these sentences out of the "general-case" sense and particularised them thus:

"I was happy while the weather was nice, but now I'm sad."

"He sang while he was winning."

"While you're away I will be lonely and sad."

Then "while" is more appropriate. Have I explained that well?

So, when you are talking about the general case, say "when"!

Thus, since we are talking about a general case here, I think we can say "when":

When you have lost something dear and feel like giving up,

Quote:
覚さん、it’s not 生きます, but行きます.
You will be able to understand the meaning of this sentence by yourself.

You have translated this:
泣くのが嫌なら さあ歩け  (なくのがいやなら さ ああるけ)- If it is unpleasant to weep, come now and walk.

後から来たのに 追い越され 泣くのが嫌なら さあ歩 け
If you don’t want to be overtook by someone who came after you and don’t want to weep, come now and walk.
Ok, so it's:

あと <after>
から <from>
きた <came>
のに <nevertheless>
おいこされ <be surpassed>
なくのが <to weep>
いや <unpleasant>
なら <if>

さあ <come now>
あるけ <walk!>

So...

If it is unpleasant to be surpassed by your successors, if it is unpleasant to weep, come now and walk!


ニックネームは「覚醒(sarvodaya)」からとって「覚(か く)」です。

Kaku is the nickname given to me by ゆりさん, derived from the word sarvodaya (सर्वोदय). This, in turn, is a word that was used by Mohandas Gandhi in his 1908 translation of John Ruskin's "Unto This Last" (1860s).
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08-15-2010, 05:06 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by YuriTokoro View Post
I see. The Japanese language’s order comes like the second sentence, and in Japanese, the more important focus often comes at the end the end of the sentence.
I will remember I should put the focus at the top in English.
Still, “upon which ….was based” is too difficult to say!!!
Hmm.. Yes, but it's not always the word order that determines the focus in English. I'm not quite sure how to explain it, but I think it's the copula that takes precedence. Thus we had:

1. This was the premise upon which their discussion was based.

As opposed to:

2. Their discussion was based upon this premise.

In 2, there are no unnecessary verbs -- the sentence is as simple as could be. On the other hand, 1 has seemingly unnecessary structure, which makes the reader think "Why is this unusual structure being used?" To which the answer is clearly that there is some extra meaning being conveyed by the more complex structure.

"was based" is simply a passive, past-tense verb, but "this was" is an unnecessary use of the copula in the past to describe "this" (which was the statement that multiculturalism is beneficial) as the premise. So the reader's attention is focused on this unnecessary addition, making it clear that this is the intended focus.

To illustrate that it is not the word order that determines the focus, let me provide some examples:

"Their discussion had this as a premise."

"They based their discussion upon this as a premise."

"The way their discussion progressed indicated that this was a premise."

Is that clear?

Quote:
That’s it! I didn’t know this word, and I just looked it up in a dictionary.
I’m sorry, I say you are overbearing, but we also consider that we are kind of chicken-hearted.
Don't worry! I consider many Americans to be extremely overbearing, and I know that the attitude of some British towards foreigners has been quite overbearing, especially in the nineteenth century.

Chicken-hearted!? I am surprised to hear you say that.
We define chicken-hearted as "Timorous and cowardly as a chicken, faint-hearted". This is not what I think of when I think of Japan. Perhaps I am outdated!

When I think of Japan I think of codes of honour, humility, diligence and dedication. This seems to me the opposite of chicken-heartedness. One who is willing to die for a cause is not chicken-hearted.

Here are a couple of our quotations from the OED:

"Where 'tis agreed by Bullies, chicken-hearted, To fright the Ladies first, and then be parted."
The Spanish Fryar, Dryden (1681)

"Small thanks to you big, hulking, chicken-hearted men."
Treasure Island, R. L. Stevenson (1883)

And here's another quotation:

"But before his letter reached the White House, Aziz had declared on CNN that Baghdad had decided to let UN inspectors back into Iraq. By then US B-52 bombers, which had taken off from the bases in the southern state of Louisiana, were within an hour of unleashing their Cruise missiles. Informed of Aziz's statement on CNN by Sandy Berger, Clinton immediately aborted the mission. His decision was criticized at home by hawkish politicians and commentators, who called him "chicken-hearted." But if he had not aborted the mission, he would have been accused of killing hundreds of Iraqis just as Baghdad had run up a white flag."
Neighbors, Not Friends: Iraq and Iran after the Gulf Wars; Dilip Hiro (2001), p158.

Quote:
I see. Thanks.
I had had some stereotype which you (foreign people) might expect about Japan. This stereotype was the premise upon which my remark was based!!!!!!
Oh, ho ho! Very good ゆりさん, and very droll!

Quote:
The Japanese don’t mind when we repeat the same word, so this is a little hard to get use to for me.


OK, thanks.
the Japanese are  日本人というものは
the Japanese people is 日本国民は
Japanese people are  日本人は
all Japanese people are 日本人、一人残らず
Ah.
ゆりさん、ありがとうございました。
They have gone in the book.

Quote:
I’m sorry, I seem to have lost.
Is this from what I said about Japan?
Japan is not perfect. Instead, I’m sure you regard the Japanese might be kind of foolish because the national debt is too huge, and the prime ministers change too many times. Still, I love Japan. I believe you would say you love your country.
I only meant that no nation could be so perfect that all of its members have no hatreds that are based on religion or skin colour — I'm sure that every nation has at least a few members that hate on the basis of religion or skin colour.

I didn't have that impression. I read this article as a result of what you said:

Japan's Road to Deep Deficit Is Paved With Public Works - NYTimes.com

I see that, as a percentage of GDP, your national debt is almost three times as much as ours. So fair enough! On the other hand, we need a strong public works programme — our roads are a patchwork of potholes and odd-jobs, we destroyed our own rail network in the '60s and have never recovered, not to mention any number of other parts of our crumbling infrastructure. Meanwhile, unemployment is a major issue for us — the solution is simply to employ those people rebuilding our country! This would not only improve the infrastructure, but also restore national pride — something we are sorely lacking.

Don't talk to me about Prime Ministers! Yes Japan has had quite a few changes in recent times, but we have not fared so well with ours either. Tony Blair led with a presidential style entirely inappropriate to his office. At times we benefited from this, but mostly the country was damaged by it. He was not a strong leader, and so to maintain his presidential style he kept his most realistic challenger, Gordon Brown, in check with a leadership deal and assassinated (not literally, thank goodness!) any competition in the cabinet that he couldn't handle. In my view Gordon Brown had the qualities of a good Prime Minister, but by the time he took over the Labour Party was so severely weakened by Blair's premiership that he could hardly get anything done and we were left with an incompetent government. Now we have Cameron, who is turning out to be more poncey and bumbling by the day. I've always been a supporter of the Liberal Democrats, and so I'm glad that they're getting a look in, but I don't hold out much hope of them being able to make a tremendous difference in this coalition.

Ok, rant over. Sorry!

Despite all that, yes, I love my country; and yet I find myself mourning for its past — not for imperialist reasons, but because I believe we used to care, we used to live and die for something, we used to take pride in our country and our community in a way that we don't seem to any more. Nowadays we hardly stand for anything, but I think we used to. In some ways we are still recovering from the '60s, but we are so apathetic that we cannot make any headway in doing so. I hope things change from the way they are now, and in that regard, yes, I am a true patriot. Having said that, if things don't change in the next ten years or so, I'm emigrating to Canada!

Quote:
About “ね”.

“ね”which is added at the end of a sentence is 終助詞(しゅうじょし).
You say ね when you ;

1.Get agreement or confirmation. (同意)
「これはいいですね」 This is good, right?
「今日は寒いね」It’s cold, isn’t it?
「疲れたね」(When all of you are tired.)
「ああ、そうだね」Yes, that’s right.

2.Comformation.
「これはあなたのカサですね↑」This is your umbrella, isn’t this? 「はい、そうです」Yes, that’s right.
「あなたも行きますね↑」You will go (like other people), won’t you?「はい、行きます」Yes, I will.

3. Making a point
After another person says something to you, you reply trying not to be overbearing.
それは違いますね。That’s not correct.
私は、そうは思いませんね。I don’t think so.

If you simply say それは違います, sometimes you sound a little bullheaded or gruff.
NB: pig-headed is more common.

Quote:
4. Request and invitation
きっと来てくださいね。 Be sure to come, right?

5. Question (This is elderly men’s way. If you say this, you would sound odd. However, when you read novels, you would see this way to say things.)
君は行くかね? Will you go?

If you don’t understand, ask me.
Wow, that's really helpful ゆりさん. There are some very illustrative examples there. Quite a few kanji, but it's ok to practise!
I think I understood it all, and I have put it in my book. It will take a while to assimilate!

Quote:
Originally Posted by YuriTokoro View Post
@ 覚さんへ。

Can I say “They talked about how to determine what morally correct behavior is.”?
When you speak, would you say something like the sentence you wrote?
Hmmm. You can say that, but it is better to say "They talked about how to determine what is morally correct behaviour" as Koir rightly says.

To expand on this, you can say things like:

"What exactly is morally correct behaviour?"

"What is it that morally correct behaviour entails?"

"They talked about what it means to behave in a morally correct way."

"They talked about morally correct behaviour, and how it is defined."

"They talked about morally correct behaviour, and in particular, what exactly it is that defines it."

As far as the placement of "is", putting it at the end in this case does make it sound a bit like an incomplete thought. It would be acceptable, however, in the following instances:

"Do you know what the time is?"

"Do you know what time it is?"

"I want to know what morally correct behaviour is."

These are perhaps a bit more colloquial, and still give the impression of an incomplete thought, but here it is deliberate — we want the listener to complete the thought for us.

Quote:
Thank you.
どういたしまして。

The next hiatus will be shorter!



PS: ゆりさん, please publish your response to my comment on your blog!


ニックネームは「覚醒(sarvodaya)」からとって「覚(か く)」です。

Kaku is the nickname given to me by ゆりさん, derived from the word sarvodaya (सर्वोदय). This, in turn, is a word that was used by Mohandas Gandhi in his 1908 translation of John Ruskin's "Unto This Last" (1860s).

Last edited by sarvodaya : 08-15-2010 at 08:39 PM. Reason: PS
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Wink 08-15-2010, 08:38 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by yumyumtimtam View Post
こんばんは、覚さん
こんばんは、ヤムさん!

Quote:

おひさしぶりです。
o-hi-sa-shi-bu-ri de-su.
It's been a long time.

Quote:
(Is it already easy for you to read these?)
I can read these, but I still need all the practice I can get!

Quote:

なるほど。

na-ru-ho-do
I see.
Quote:
そうなんですね。
so-u-na-n-de-su-ne
That's the way it is, is it?
Quote:
わかりました。
wa-ka-ri-ma-shi-ta
I have understood.
Quote:
ありがとうございます。
a-ri-ga-to-go-za-i-ma-su
Thank you.
Quote:
How about these ?
Please try to read them all without looking at anything, ok? No peeking
Done it! I had to look up the meanings of the words though!

Quote:
ありがとうございます。
どういたしまして。

Quote:

では らいしゅう かってきます!
de-wa ra-i-shi-(yu)-u ka-(tsu)-te-ki-ma-su
de-wa ra-i-shu-u ka-tte-ki-ma-su
Well then, next week I will buy it and get back to you!
Quote:
たくさんの じしょの しょうかいを 
ta-ku-sa-n-no ji-shi-(yo)-no shi-(yo)-u-ka-i-(w)o
ta-ku-sa-n-no ji-sho-no sho-u-ka-i-o
Very many dictionary referrals.
Quote:
ありがとうございます。
どういたしまして。
Quote:
I just wonder if there is any special reason why they don't make one for Japanese learners of English?
I really don't know, it is strange...

Quote:
Oh, I remember, 覚さん、I have some questions.
おしえてください
o-shi-e-te-ku-da-sa-i
Please teach (me).
Quote:
Japanese English teachers = people from Japan who teach English
Yes.
Quote:
English Japanese teachers = people from England who teach Japanese
Yes.
Quote:
American Japanese teachers=people from USA who teach Japanese
Yes.
Quote:
ただしいですか?

Japanese teachers = teachers who teach Japanese and also could be teachers who are from Japan whatever the subjects they teach?
Yes. When speaking, you can hear the difference in emphasis, but this is not a hard-and-fast rule.
When the emphasis is on Japanese, this means teachers of the Japanese language.
When the emphasis is on teachers, this means teachers who are Japanese.
Quote:
Japanese students = students who study Japanese and also the students from Japan right?
Yes. Again, you can tell the difference when you hear the sentence.
When the emphasis is on Japanese, this means students of the Japanese language.
When the emphasis is on students, this means students who are Japanese.
Quote:
These ones sometimes make me .
Usually the meaning is clear from the context, but even natives are sometimes confused by this, so don't be afraid to ask!

Quote:
And 覚さん, can you tell me what the best way to address "foreigners" when I want to talk about them?
I don't feel comfortable with this word "foreigners",I'm afraid if it may sound impolite. So I use "people from overseas" or "people from other countries".
Or I don't have to worry about using the word "foreigners"?
Yes, you have picked up on a genuine trend. This is called "politically correct" speech, or PC. Some people feel that sensitivity to political correctness has gone too far. There is a middle road somewhere, but each person has their own tolerance.

With respect to PC, it is not too bad to say foreigners, but it would be better to find another word. Depending on the context you may want to say one of the following:

"people from overseas" as you say

"people from abroad"

"immigrants"

"adventitious individuals" —but this is going a bit far...!

Quote:
And I have another one... おしえてくださいますか?

I like this way
" This is my friend Luciana from Brazile."
than
" This is my Brazilian friend, Luciana."
Am I right to feel that the 2nd one might sound that the country where she's from is more important than herself?

Or am I just paranoid?
There is a difference. The 2nd version does give higher importance to the nationality. The 2nd version would be more common in the following context:

"This is my Spanish friend, Gaston; this is my French friend, Colette; and this is my Brazilian friend, Luciana."

Quote:
Yes, I love that feeling too.
そうですね。

Quote:
This afternoon my students(4-7 y-o) made lots of foods with play-dough and we learnt what they were called, such as cherries,grapes and caramel,etc.
Actually they did a good job! And they were SO proud.
When their mothers came to pick them up,they went like
"Mummy, look! I made this... and this... and this...".
They were saying it with a big pride
and it made me smile
Aww!

Quote:
Yes I did, and they wanted to say あいに きてください to you

そうなんですね。
わかりました☆
ありがとうございました。

<続く>(つづく)
Quote:
Originally Posted by yumyumtimtam View Post
I "youtubed" him and saw some, and now I got really interested!
He's one of my favourite comedians.

Quote:
I couldn't find the part when he said "Ennit marvellous" but will keep watching those shows he's in!Like The Series and HIGNY !
They don't make enough HIgNfY, I wish they made one every week!

Quote:
Oh now I remember that I used to watch "Mind Your Language" and "Babes in the woods".
I think I like British comedy
Thank you; I'm glad!

There is a site that aims to publish all British tv for download:

TheBox :: Signup

I'm a member and find it very useful for catching up on things I've missed etc. They have plenty of good British comedy, such as:

Harry Hill
One Foot in the Grave
French and Saunders
The IT Crowd
Fawlty Towers
Bill Bailey
Eddie Izzard
Peter Kay
Morcambe & Wise
Armstrong & Miller Show
Dave Gorman
Michael McIntyre
Live at the Apollo
A Bit of Fry & Laurie
Blackadder

Quote:
I know a girl from England says fabulous (or fab) all the time!
That's another one: Absolutely Fabulous, darling!

Quote:
And I remember one of my Aussie friends in Melbourne, he used to say "fantastic" and other friend said "unreal" all the time!
I used to say "cool" too often.
Ha ha! This is very common amongst young people.

Quote:
I don't think people in Japan use that many varieties of adjectives.
I mean I believe there ARE hundreds of adjectives in Japanese to express how nice the things are but I don't hear them in my everyday life.

And I used to amazed how the kids make up words with "head" in English.
Once I was asked to translate "air-head" into Japanese,
so I told them that we didn't have the same word for that
but the kids wanted to say it in Japanese to my friend, an English Japanese teacher.
I didn't want them to be rude like that even they said it's just a joke.
Anyway, they asked me again what's the word for the air and for head.
So I said くうき and  あたま they are.
And the kids, the 2 boys started calling くうきあたま!each other.
Which doesn't make much sense in Japanese.
Ha ha!

Quote:
Here are some quiz for you.

は た ら く
There are 4 characters here,but one of them is different from other 3 for a reason.
Which one and why?
く, because it is the only one containing the vowel sound -u-, the others all contain -a-.

Quote:
ま た あ し た
Here is another one, for the same reason
Can you pick up one which is different from others?
Hmmm, well あ is the only vowel, but it's the same reason, so the answer is し because it is the only one that doesn't contain the vowel sound -a-.

Quote:
Hope my questions&all don't sound too childish or boring to you.
Not at all; I need all the practice I can get!

Quote:
(I'm so stupid to ask you this question, ain't I?You wouldn't say "Yes,they are totally boring!" cause you are polite and all!
You suddenly sound like you're from the southern USA!

Quote:
But if you have any request for me to change or stop or add,please let me know!
I will try not to drink too much and think carefully)
Thank you very much for the quiz — I appreciate it!

では、おそいです、行ってきます!
お休みなさい。


ニックネームは「覚醒(sarvodaya)」からとって「覚(か く)」です。

Kaku is the nickname given to me by ゆりさん, derived from the word sarvodaya (सर्वोदय). This, in turn, is a word that was used by Mohandas Gandhi in his 1908 translation of John Ruskin's "Unto This Last" (1860s).
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Is this the correct translation of the song? - 08-15-2010, 08:45 PM

In life there is comfort; there is hardship too.
After tears a rainbow appears.
Carry on steadily,
Keeping your foot firmly upon your chosen path.

In life courage is essential,
When you have lost something dear and feel like giving up,
If it is unpleasant to be surpassed by your successors,
If it is unpleasant to weep, come now and walk!

In life there are both tears and smiles.
Life is not so bad
From living, great things can come,
Set a goal and live!



ニックネームは「覚醒(sarvodaya)」からとって「覚(か く)」です。

Kaku is the nickname given to me by ゆりさん, derived from the word sarvodaya (सर्वोदय). This, in turn, is a word that was used by Mohandas Gandhi in his 1908 translation of John Ruskin's "Unto This Last" (1860s).
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08-15-2010, 10:53 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Akihiko View Post
I would be honoured to accompany you in this quest for the Japanese tutoring. I know a couple of Japanese friends that would be glad to help you learn the language for English lessons ^^. PM me if you're interested!
こんにちは、明彦さん。

Feel free to join us and invite your friends. We will continue to conduct the exchange here in this thread.



ニックネームは「覚醒(sarvodaya)」からとって「覚(か く)」です。

Kaku is the nickname given to me by ゆりさん, derived from the word sarvodaya (सर्वोदय). This, in turn, is a word that was used by Mohandas Gandhi in his 1908 translation of John Ruskin's "Unto This Last" (1860s).
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08-16-2010, 04:54 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by sarvodaya View Post
こんばんは、ヤムさん!
おはようございます!
(I wrote this before 10:00!)

I woke up at 7 this morning and did some washing...and arond 10am, I started writing this... but I went here and there and did this and that... and now it's 13:30!
Can you give me an adjective for me?
I could be moody sometimes then hard to concentrate on one thing and always doing a few things at the same time..and can't finish any of them.
How can I describe that kind of person or being like that?
Please don't give me a word "crazy" !
I'm like that today!

Quote:
o-hi-sa-shi-bu-ri de-su.
It's been a long time.
Yes, you are right.

but now I realized and wondered that if it's good for you to write in romanji...
cos to learn how to read ひらがな it's better not to think with alphabet...
mmm what do you think?

When I was a real beginner, I used ひらがなandカタカナ to remember
how to read ... like this..

tunnel タぁのぅ
but actual Japanese word isトンネル for tunnel.

How do you learn the pronunciation ?
with some CDs?
I bet you have a great one because you are one of The Oxford University Press people! which is absolutely fabulous darling

I believe the best way to practise pronunciation is to listen and copy
to a native speaker speaking especially the one's voice is very similar to yours!

Quote:
na-ru-ho-do I see.
so-u-na-n-de-su-ne That's the way it is, is it?
wa-ka-ri-ma-shi-ta I have understood.
a-ri-ga-to-go-za-i-ma-su Thank you.

Done it! I had to look up the meanings of the words though!
よくできました  This is a typical way of the teacher would say "good job" to the pupils.

Quote:
de-wa ra-i-shi-(yu)-u ka-(tsu)-te-ki-ma-su
de-wa ra-i-shu-u ka-tte-ki-ma-su
Well then, next week I will buy it and get back to you!
Yes, you are right.

How about these?
I'm alone here right now, but I might talk to myself (I dont usually)like...
あとで アイスクリーム かってこよう!
If I'm with someone who is totally in love with me and willing to do anything for me (joking
あとで チョコレート と ドーナツ かってきて!

Quote:
ta-ku-sa-n-no ji-shi-(yo)-no shi-(yo)-u-ka-i-(w)o
ta-ku-sa-n-no ji-sho-no sho-u-ka-i-o
Very many dictionary referrals.
o-shi-e-te-ku-da-sa-i
Please teach (me).
たいへん よくできました This is another typical one.
Quote:
Yes. When speaking, you can hear the difference in emphasis, but this is not a hard-and-fast rule.
When the emphasis is on Japanese, this means teachers of the Japanese language.
When the emphasis is on teachers, this means teachers who are Japanese.
なるほど・・・しりませんでした。ありがとうございま す。
Quote:
Yes. Again, you can tell the difference when you hear the sentence.
When the emphasis is on Japanese, this means students of the Japanese language.
When the emphasis is on students, this means students who are Japanese.
わかりました。れんしゅうしてみます。
Quote:
Usually the meaning is clear from the context, but even natives are sometimes confused by this, so don't be afraid to ask!
Thank you!
You are right, it's usually clear from the context,
I used to be saying like......
"Japanese students are... ah you know I mean people are learning Japanese, not "Japanese" students and ah ah... you know what I mean...?"
Something like that always!
but now you taught me the difference so I will practise to enphasise it properly!Thank you!
Quote:
With respect to PC, it is not too bad to say foreigners, but it would be better to find another word. Depending on the context you may want to say one of the following:
"people from overseas" as you say
"people from abroad"
"immigrants"
"adventitious individuals" —but this is going a bit far...!
Thank you, I will try to find one depending on the context.

You know what I missread and thought
"I'd love to be called "adventurous" indivisual when I'm in a foreign country"
but it's "adventitious" a new word for me!Thank you
Quote:
There is a difference. The 2nd version does give higher importance to the nationality. The 2nd version would be more common in the following context:
"This is my Spanish friend, Gaston; this is my French friend, Colette; and this is my Brazilian friend, Luciana."
I see... I did the opposit didn't I?

I don't know but for some reason, I liked to be introduced like...
Hey Marcus, This is YYTT and she's from Japan.
...and YYTT, this is Marcus and he is one of my workmates.
than
Hey Rebecca, This is my Japanese friend YYTT.
...YYTT, this is Rebecca.We go to the same gym.

I wanted to be called "a friend", not "a Japanese friend" (or mate in Australia)... but maybe it's not so important than I thought.

Quote:
He's one of my favourite comedians.
I thought he's cute.
Please tell him that a Japanese girl (well I'm not a girl anymore though) said he was cute
People say I have a weird sense though.
Quote:
They don't make enough HIgNfY, I wish they made one every week!
まいしゅうではないのですか?
so how often then?
Quote:
There is a site that aims to publish all British tv for download:
TheBox :: Signup
I'm a member and find it very useful for catching up on things I've missed etc. They have plenty of good British comedy, such as:
Harry Hill
One Foot in the Grave
French and Saunders
The IT Crowd
Fawlty Towers
Bill Bailey
Eddie Izzard
Peter Kay
Morcambe & Wise
Armstrong & Miller Show
Dave Gorman
Michael McIntyre
Live at the Apollo
A Bit of Fry & Laurie
Blackadder
wow....thanks, I will go and have a look, ...well a lot of look actually!
Quote:
That's another one: Absolutely Fabulous, darling!
You know what? I got so interested already!
YouTube - ABSOLUTELY FABULOUS series1 episode1 [part one]
the mother is wearing Japanese traditional nighty and she even mentioned about budda and Japanese!
I loved when she said "Darrrrrling" (how should I spell it?).
Oh and she said "bloody" a lot!!!
When I visited England, I never heard of anyone said it. (it was only 10 days stay in London,Hastings and Dover).

This song is stuck in my head now!

"Wheels on fire.... rolling down the road
there/with no where park my next ???
Best notify my next of kin
This will shine next floor???
This wheel shall explode
Can you give me the answer pleeeeez!?
I've got the answer and so shocked how little I could get it right.
Quote:
Ha ha! This is very common amongst young people.
I learnt a lot from them and I enjoyed it
but that's one of my problems with English.

Quote:
く, because it is the only one containing the vowel sound -u-, the others all contain -a-.
Hmmm, well あ is the only vowel, but it's the same reason, so the answer is し because it is the only one that doesn't contain the vowel sound -a-.
Wasn't it too easy for you?!
please read this in aloud (Is this right English?)
あかさたなはまやらわ 
がざだまやらわ 
あかさたなまやらわ

Quote:
Not at all; I need all the practice I can get!
よかったです。
Quote:
You suddenly sound like you're from the southern USA!
How did you know?! I used live in a...... nah.... joking
how would you say "ain't" in a proper English? "amn't" is OK?
Quote:
Thank you very much for the quiz — I appreciate it!
I promise you to prepare better quiz when I come back from my summer holidays! I will probablly make some with my students!
Quote:
では おそいです
well/then, it's late.
Quote:
行ってきます!
いまから どこかに いきますか?
Quote:
お休みなさい。
よくねむれましたか?

さて、わたしは いまから アイスを かいに スーパ ーにいきます。
では
いってきます

Last edited by yumyumtimtam : 08-17-2010 at 02:07 AM.
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08-18-2010, 01:01 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by sarvodaya View Post
ゆりさん、こんばんは。
覚さん、こんばんは。

Quote:
The word insane is quite extreme and serious, especially compared to words like crazy or mad. This gives your expression something called a deadpan delivery. We have a nice quotation for this in the OED:


Essentially, deadpan delivery heightens the comic effect by taking the audience by surprise. There can be other effects depending on context or the particular mix of register and content, but that's more complicated.
I think I’ve got that.
When you say “Or you would go mad”, you just have said some advice. On the other hand, when you say “Or you would go insane” with bland or serious expressions, you say the advice joking. Is this right?

Quote:
ありがとうございました。
They are now in the book!
So this a variation of いただく? So is it literally something like:
"Can't I get the pepper, please?"
Yes, いただけませんかis ”いただく+negative form +question.”
When you say 「胡椒をとっていただきたい」(I want you to pass me the pepper.), you sound arrogant. So you add the negative form ません and the question form か.

However, literally, it is not "Can't I get the pepper, please?"
It may be “Can I get you pass me the pepper?” (I’m not sure if my English is correct. It means like “I’m sorry to bother you, but may I make you pass me the pepper?”) I mean it’s not just “get the pepper”, but “get you …..”. My English is too poor to explain!


This is also good and polite expression. 「胡椒をとっていただきたいのですが」

Useful examples:
「(僕と)お付き合いしていただけませんか/(ぼくと)おつきあいしていただけませんか」「僕とお 付き合いしてくださいませんか」Be my sweetheart. (I’m sorry; I don’t know the polite version of this expression. The Japanese sentence is very polite. )
「(僕と)結婚していただけませんか」「僕と結婚して くださいませんか」Will you marry me?(I’m sorry; I don’t know, again. The Japanese sentence is polite.)

You can also say :「僕と付き合ってください(casual)」「彼女になってく さい(young people)」
彼女 usually means “she”, but sometimes means “ female lover”.

「(僕と)結婚してください(polite)」「(僕と)結婚して れ」「俺の女房になれ(Be my wife!)」


There are another いただく as you have written "Can't I get the pepper, please?".
You know, you say いただきます before you eat, remember? I think it means “I receive this boon.
“いただく” can mean “receive” and “get”, and its casual version is “もらう”.
助さんに、本を一冊いただくI receive a book from Sukesan.(However, I know that you would say “Sukesan gives me a book.” That would be 助さんが、本を一冊くださる)

Casual; 「助さんに、本を一冊もらう」「助さんが、本を一冊く れる」

Note!
There is a very important difference between English and Japanese.
We usually say「助さんに本をいただく」「助さんに本をもらう」「 助さんが本をくださる」「助さんが本をくれる」.
We don’t mention about the number except when the number is important.
So, 「助さんが本をくれる」should be “Sukesan gives me a book/books.”
If you don’t like “/”, I don’t know how to write.
Basically, most Japanese sentences can’t be translated into English to be exact.

Let’s imagine. You just arrived at Tokyo airport. You have spent many hours on the airplane. You meet me at the lobby, and say about your flight.
“I read a book in the plane.”
That’s「飛行機の中で本を読んでいました」.
If you say「飛行機の中で、私は一冊の本を読みました」, I would misunderstand that you have finished the book and that the flight must have been too long.

Quote:
That's what I meant, but I'm just going by what it says on Wikipedia:
Thank you. I will write something about Sakoku(Kaikin), maybe next time.


Quote:
It's imitative of the sound of a drum being beaten. Sometimes when people say "rub-a-dub-dub, thanks for the grub!" they make a gesture to imitate mildly drumming on their stomach. I suppose this must be to emphasise that they are so full that their stomach has become like a large drum!
I see! We say “My stomach is ‘パンパン’”. But it’s not drumming, but means the condition is full. When you put too many things in your bag, it’s also ‘panpan’.
The sort of expression is “オノマトペ(from onomatopoeia)”.



Quote:
We do say "your way". In fact there is a well-known song popularised by Frank Sinatra called "My Way" .
Many elderly Japanese people really love this song. They wish to sing it in English, but most of them can’t, because singing in English is difficult to them.
After you finish 「ああ人生に涙あり」, I believe this song is very good to you. What do you think?


Quote:
However, in the case of "My Way", the meaning is clear from context. In our translation "your chosen path" sounds better to me; perhaps it's because we're talking about keeping your foot firmly etc. I think if we wanted to say "your way" it would have to be something like:
"Keep going steadily; do it your way and do not waver."
I see.
Japanese people tend to prefer to say “my way”, not “your chosen path”, because the song is too popular. I will remember “your chosen path”.

Quote:
Ok, I think it's like this...

なんにも = nothing
しないで = doesn't ~become
いきる = living
より = from
なんにもしないdo not lift a finger
なんにもしないでwithout doing anything
よりthan

Quote:
Which gives us...

<It is not the case that> <from> <living> <comes> <nothing>
Let’s live seeking for something rather than to live without doing anything.
Is this grammatically correct?


Hello, I may not understand English very well and I may lack words but I will try to understand you.

If you have questions about my post or Japanese customs, don't hesitate to ask.

I YamaP
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08-18-2010, 01:03 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by sarvodaya View Post
I know what you mean. However, when and while are a bit more flexible than that.

"While..." can be used to mean "during the time that..." or "for as long as..."

As for "when", that does indeed usually mean a shorter time or "at the instant that...", as in:

"When the cock crows..."
Thank you!
I understand that “when” means two things happen in parallel, and “while” means the term is a bit longer. Is this right?



Quote:
Ok, so it's:

あと <after>
から <from>
きた <came>
のに <nevertheless>
のに is not <nevertheless>.
“の”means 人in this context.
That meansあとから 来た人に 追い越されて

Quote:
おいこされ <be surpassed>
なくのが <to weep>
いや <unpleasant>
なら <if>

さあ <come now>
あるけ <walk!>

So...

If it is unpleasant to be surpassed by your successors, if it is unpleasant to weep, come now and walk!
This is excellent!


Now, about “の”.
When you are pointing your pen, you say “This is mine.” That’s これは私のです。
You can say これは私のものです, and これは私のですmeans the same.
When you are holding one of your books, you can say これは私のです.

When you are in a parking lot, and being asked which your car is, you would say pointing a car, “That red car is mine.” =「あの赤い車がわたしのです」=「あの赤いのが私の です」

Usually, の doesn’t indicate person or people, but when you speak casually, it can indicate 人.
“The person who is coming from behind is Sukesan.” = 後から来ているのが助さんです。

When you want to say it politely, and Sukesan is not one of your relatives; 後から来ている方(かた)が助さんです。
When Sukesan is one of your relaties; 後から来ているのが助です。

I have written some complicated things. You don’t need to remember the sentences as of now. I just want you to know that “の” can indicates material objects (and sometimes, a person or people), and there is Honorific speech in Japanese which is very complicated.
Honorific speech in Japanese - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


Quote:
Hmm.. Yes, but it's not always the word order that determines the focus in English. I'm not quite sure how to explain it, but I think it's the copula that takes precedence. Thus we had:

1. This was the premise upon which their discussion was based.

As opposed to:

2. Their discussion was based upon this premise.

・・・To which the answer is clearly that there is some extra meaning being conveyed by the more complex structure.
・・・So the reader's attention is focused on this unnecessary addition, making it clear that this is the intended focus.

Is that clear?
Yes, that’s clear now. Thank you.


Quote:
Don't worry! I consider many Americans to be extremely overbearing, and I know that the attitude of some British towards foreigners has been quite overbearing, especially in the nineteenth century.
I think you understand my meaning. I don’t accuse the colors of the Americans or the English people. Your attitude must be natural in their country. The problem must be there are great differences between us.

Quote:
Chicken-hearted!? I am surprised to hear you say that.
We define chicken-hearted as "Timorous and cowardly as a chicken, faint-hearted". This is not what I think of when I think of Japan. Perhaps I am outdated!
The word “Chicken-hearted” may be not good to describe Japan. I don’t know any right words.
Many Japanese people regard that the Japanese can’t say any “No” to foreign people, and almost always stub our tow over the international negotiations.

My dictionary says that “cowardice” means 憶病 and卑怯, but憶病 and卑怯 are completely different.
Sometimes we call ourselves 憶病 to foreign people , but we actually might be “not overbearing”.
“Timorous” sounds to be similar to憶病. I think I should have said “timorous” or “not overbearing”.

Quote:
When I think of Japan I think of codes of honour, humility, diligence and dedication. This seems to me the opposite of chicken-heartedness. One who is willing to die for a cause is not chicken-hearted.
Oh,yes! “Humility” must be the word! Thank you! I didn’t know it.

Quote:
Here are a couple of our quotations from the OED:
I don’t seem to have seen the sense of the word “chicken –hearted.” Thank you.

Quote:
I only meant that no nation could be so perfect that all of its members have no hatreds that are based on religion or skin colour — I'm sure that every nation has at least a few members that hate on the basis of religion or skin colour.
I don’t mean to say Japan is idealistic. Some Japanese people dislike some foreign people’s spirit who are from a few certain countries, because the people in the countries often do what we call 卑怯. For example; they make imitations of Japanese products illegally.

Our religion is polytheism and nobody knows the exact number of our Gods. I think we are relatively generous about other religions. We don’t deny other religions, or say our Gods are only approximately eight million real Gods.

Our skin is colored. I think we don’t have any color-based prejudice.

Quote:
I didn't have that impression. I read this article as a result of what you said:

Japan's Road to Deep Deficit Is Paved With Public Works - NYTimes.com
Now you see what I mean. Thank you.
We need to get out of this pitiful situation.

Quote:
I see that, as a percentage of GDP, your national debt is almost three times as much as ours. So fair enough!
Thank you for understanding.

Quote:
Don't talk to me about Prime Ministers! Yes Japan has had quite a few changes in recent times, but we have not fared so well with ours either. Tony Blair led with a presidential style entirely inappropriate to his office. At times we benefited from this, but mostly the country was damaged by it. He was not a strong leader, and so to maintain his presidential style he kept his most realistic challenger, Gordon Brown, in check with a leadership deal and assassinated (not literally, thank goodness!) any competition in the cabinet that he couldn't handle. In my view Gordon Brown had the qualities of a good Prime Minister, but by the time he took over the Labour Party was so severely weakened by Blair's premiership that he could hardly get anything done and we were left with an incompetent government. Now we have Cameron, who is turning out to be more poncey and bumbling by the day. I've always been a supporter of the Liberal Democrats, and so I'm glad that they're getting a look in, but I don't hold out much hope of them being able to make a tremendous difference in this coalition.
I have thought that Tony Blair is a strong leader. Now I know why your country was flourishingly while the Thatcher Administration, and after that, the economy has turned downward.


Hello, I may not understand English very well and I may lack words but I will try to understand you.

If you have questions about my post or Japanese customs, don't hesitate to ask.

I YamaP
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08-18-2010, 01:05 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by sarvodaya View Post
Despite all that, yes, I love my country; and yet I find myself mourning for its past — not for imperialist reasons, but because I believe we used to care, we used to live and die for something, we used to take pride in our country and our community in a way that we don't seem to any more. Nowadays we hardly stand for anything, but I think we used to. In some ways we are still recovering from the '60s, but we are so apathetic that we cannot make any headway in doing so. I hope things change from the way they are now, and in that regard, yes, I am a true patriot. Having said that, if things don't change in the next ten years or so, I'm emigrating to Canada!
Really!?
I know that Vancouver is the best place to live.
Yes! They have delicious Japanese rice in their stores. Try it if you move to Canada. However, I hope you won’t need to emigrate there.

Quote:
NB: pig-headed is more common.
Thank you. I will remember that.


Quote:
Wow, that's really helpful ゆりさん. There are some very illustrative examples there. Quite a few kanji, but it's ok to practise!
I think I understood it all, and I have put it in my book. It will take a while to assimilate!
I know. Learning foreign language takes you time.
I make same mistakes many times.

Quote:
Hmmm. You can say that, but it is better to say "They talked about how to determine what is morally correct behaviour" as Koir rightly says.
I see. Thank you.

Quote:
"Do you know what the time is?"

"Do you know what time it is?"

"I want to know what morally correct behaviour is."

These are perhaps a bit more colloquial, and still give the impression of an incomplete thought, but here it is deliberate — we want the listener to complete the thought for us.
You mean these three above give the impression of an incomplete?
What are the complete sentences?

Quote:
PS: ゆりさん, please publish your response to my comment on your blog!
Yes. I have published.



I start a short story here!

1
イギリス人の覚は、日本に引っ越してきました。隣の家 に住む刺氏さん(Sashmister)に挨拶に行きました。
「はじめまして。隣に引っ越してきました覚です。どう ぞよろしく」
「はじめまして。刺氏です。助(すけ)と呼んでください こちらこそ、よろしく」

To be continued.
(刺氏is not a common Japanese family name. I just translated Sashimister into Japanese.)

The sentences above may be a bit difficult at first.
These sentences below are written in easier way and in only present tense, on purpose.

《普通体》in present tense
★覚はイギリス人だ。日本に引っ越す《にほん に ひ っこす》。
Kaku is English. He is going to move/is moving in Japan.

隣の家に《となりのいえに》刺氏さんが(住んで)いる。
There is Mr.SashiMister in the next door.

[c.f. 刺氏さんは 隣の家に 住んでいる。
Mr,Sashimister lives in the next door.]

覚は挨拶《あいさつ》に行く。
Kaku is going to go/is going to say hello to him.


These three sentences above are odd with the conversations. I wrote them in 普通体《ふつうたい》in present /future tense on purpose.



丁寧体《ていねいたい》in present tense:
★覚はイギリス人です。日本に引っ越してきます。
隣の家に刺氏さんが(住んで)います。
覚は挨拶に行きます。

In past tense.
★覚はイギリス人で、日本に引っ越してきました。
(Kaku is an English man who has moved in Japan.)
隣の家に刺氏という人が住んでいました。
(There was Mr.SashiMister in the next door.)
覚は挨拶に行きました。
(Kaku went to say hello to him.)

If you write; 覚はイギリス人でした。日本に引っ越してきました,
you mean like Kaku isn’t English any more in this context.


Note!
Japanese don’t go like this; 覚はイギリス人だった人で、日本に引っ越してきました or 隣の家に住んだ刺氏に挨拶に行きました。 This is odd.
The sequence of tenses is different from English’s.


Today, I just want you to know that the English tense sense and the Japanese’s are very different. The sequence of tenses is completely different.
You don’t need to memorize all the sentences above as for now.


My explanation must be complicated.
If you have questions, don’t hesitate to ask, please!

I’m sorry, I have written too long.


Hello, I may not understand English very well and I may lack words but I will try to understand you.

If you have questions about my post or Japanese customs, don't hesitate to ask.

I YamaP

Last edited by YuriTokoro : 08-19-2010 at 02:16 PM.
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