what's bad in japan?

[Gloobey]

No, it ain`t just me they have a problem with, mate. I have western friends who have experienced exactly the same thing on public transport, in restaurants etc. Count yourself lucky, pal.

And no, I’m not saying how I choose to do things is better, I’m saying that how EVERYONE outside of Japan chooses to do things is better. It’s just a Japanese thing. There is an ignorance bordering on arrogance that permeates Japanese society, and if you are unable to see that then you have obviously bee blinded by your Japfascination.

As for me being racist...don’t be stupid, now. I’m, not even gonna dignify that with a reply....
Look, I’m not saying everything is bad. Of course it isn’t. I just take exception to this whole Japanophile nonsense. For the record, I am not a raging patriot or anything - the UK has many issues that concern me. It’s just that the Japanese have become past masters at burying their heads in the sand or just looking the other way. They don’t deal with things the way normal people do or at least should. This runs right from the very top and trickles down throughout Japanese society.

Lastly, paying tax to the Japanese government the way I do, I feel I have a perfect right to criticize what I see as wrong. Do you see this differently? I so, I `d be interested to hear your views.

[Nyororin]

Everyone outside Japan does things better?

I think you`ve just proven what I said about racism in one short sentence.

I`ve lived in Japan for the past 9 years now. I`ve actually gone through school in Japan. I`ve worked here, I`m married, have a child with "special needs", and I own a home here. I pay taxes just like you.
Before you start insinuating that I`m somehow a Japanophile blinded by my amazing love of Japan... Actually look into who I am.

I don`t believe Japan in a perfect paradise on earth. I live here, I would have to be a complete idiot not to see reality. However, my problem is that the reality *I* see is somehow immensely different from the reality you seem to be taking so personally. If you find Japan such an awful place to live, then why do you choose to live here? I don`t mean that in an inflammatory way, but if you really dislike the way society is run, wouldn`t it be better for your family - particularly your child - not to be raised with those values?

In my case, I`d rather be shot than raise my son in, say, the US. I`ve lived there, and know that whatever strange problems Japan has, it`s nothing compared to the sheer number and scale of problems in the US. Seriously - I`d much rather hear about the guy who cut his sister up and stored her in the closet on the NATIONAL news for weeks on end, than have the LOCAL nightly news go through a list of 10 some murders that happened just that day, in one single city.

And I am being completely honest in saying that I`ve never been treated with anything other than *normalcy* by other people here. If that *normalcy* is what offends you, then get a grip. A society doesn`t have to change just to suit you. If anything, I`m happy that Japan is still clinging to the "Japanese way", rather than leaping head over heels onto the "Throw our culture away for western values!" bandwagon.

Take it or leave it - We obviously have different personal feelings on this topic, and they do not seem to overlap. I have no qualms about raising a family here, and living out the rest of my life in Japan. You clearly do.

Edit: After reading the first message again, I just thought I`d add. I actually sort of prefer the way women are "treated" in Japan...

[Tsukikage]

wow, thats quite an interesting read! Still, it hasnt swayed me from trying to move across to live in Japan!
I went for a month (almost) last year traveling, and I personally think that its so much better than the uk (ok, so Iv never worked in Japan yet, or pay tax etc but thats not my point at the moment)

[Gloobey]

Yes, when I say that everyone outside Japan does things better I genuinely believe that to be the case. The point I’m making here is it would appear there are two ways of doing things in the world - the way the rest of the word does it and the Japanese way! The Japanese remain largely closed minded to how things are done in the rest of the world, and that makes doing business with them very hard at times.

This is not a racist slur and you are being stupid saying it is. Because that is the case, I won’t dwell on that point and will move on. I would just say that this is the last occasion on which I will forgive being called a racist.

As for the way women are treated here in Japan, have you ever wondered why it is so common - again, almost acceptable - for men to have affairs and why their wives accept this so readily? It is because men are not legally bound to pay anything towards the raising or welfare of their children following divorce, meaning that wives are often left almost destitute following such a development. When I was told this by a divorcee friend of mine, I simply wouldn’t believe it was the case. Further investigation has proven this to be true. The government does not see this as any of their business and it is left up to the man to make restitution, which in many cases he doesn’t do. Because of this, women tend to keep their mouths shut and let hubby get on with what he wants to do.

I also dislike the way women are treated in the media and the whole pink thing, which nauseates me.

OK, got that off my chest. Why am I here? Beats me....I will be returning to the UK in a few years time so that my son can be educated in a style more befitting my personal ideology. At least in the UK he will taught - as I was - about the British concentration camps during the Boer war and England’s part in the 1839 potatoe famine in Ireland. If he is educated here, he won’t ever be taught about the Nanking massacres...which of course never happened anyway.

I am proud of his half Japanese heritage and I shall urge him to return to Japan as often as is possible and, if later in life, he chooses to live here I will be only too happy for him. Whatever makes him happy. For me, the wholly superficial nature of Japan is simply unsatisfying. I shall look back on my time here as a worthwhile experience but, I fear, very little fondness.

[Gloobey]

Actually, it was a mistake coming here. So I`m off......

[jasonbvr]

I'll agree with you Gloobey on the treatment of women in Japan. The porn, touch clubs or whatever you call them and restrictions in what sort of jobs they can hold is sad. I will also agree with you that Japan could be a lot more welcoming to the foreigners that they invite in to the country to work in their schools and companies. And you are right, a lot of times they look at us as a hassle. As for the police, I've never actually seen them do anything other than direct traffic.

All I was trying to do with my previous post was offer a bit of balance and help people understand where misunderstandings arise from. Obviously I haven't been working here as long as you have, but I am quite far from being a J-fanboy. I simply actively ignore a lot of the shittier sides to living here (like 600 yen Guinness) because it makes things easier just like I did in the US.

There is a lot of validity to some of the negatives presented in this thread, and its important for JF readers to hear these things because so many do seem to have an overly rosy portrait of Japan.

[curious_jane]

I think Glooby has forgotten how long its take womens rights to take effect in the rest of the world. If it wasn't for Wyoming voting for women to vote, I would be stuck washing clothes or in a brothel.
Japan is still young in the sence that they haven't been exposed as long to western culture. There expiriences have been limited to the US blowing them up. Which, I'm sure, scared them into submission. A hundred + years isn't a long time to "change" a culture that has been run by an iron fist.

[Pachipro]

I have read this thread throughly and enjoyed the contrast between Nyororin, jasonbvr, and Gloobey and would like to add my two yen. Having a 33 year relationship with Japan, with 16 of those years living there consecutively, I have worked for Japanese companies and owned my own business there, paid taxes and I think I am well qualified to offer my opinion.

I have seen the likes of Gloobey before, many times, both in Japan and on forums dealing with Japan. His type are a dime a dozen in Japan. They live in a country they have come to despise, refuse to learn the language and culture, and are only living there because they are stuck in a contract or own a business and cannot leave even though they want to. Some cannot afford to leave or are afraid of starting over again in their own country so they stay in a place they hate and bitch about it to anyone who will listen. They usually find much company. Any language they do know is severely limited and this further adds insult to injury as they cannot make themselves understood in a country where most foreigners like this demand that the Japanese see things THEIR way rather than trying to see things the Japanese way and understand where they are coming from and why they do things the way they do.

Therefore, to vent their frustrations, they bash Japan and the Japanese and their culture and way of life any chance they get because it makes them feel better and superior about themselves and their own culture as he has proved in his own words thinking that his own cultures' way is superior to the Japanese way. His type never trys to look at the good in Japan, only the bad. Even in his own words, when asked why he is there, he replies, "Beats me..." Therefore, everywhere they look they are suspicious of the Japanese "racist" nature and feel persecuted for anything they, or the Japanese do. I have not ever met one foreigner who speaks, reads, and writes Japanese fluently who feels as he does, but I have met many who don't that do. In a way it's kind of sad.

They also despise and call anyone else who even remotely enjoys Japan and the culture or disagrees with their negative views as Japaholics, Japanophiles, or "Jfan boys". Now Gloobey may well understand Japanese and speak and write it fluently, but my guess is he doesn't because if he did, he would understand the Japanese mentality concerning the way they do business and the reason why they do the things they do in their own culture. Jeeze man they are Japanese NOT Europeans! And why would anyone want them to act any differently? If they acted like Europeans or Americans they wouldn't be Japanese now would they? I, for one, hope they never change.

In my business dealings with Japan and the Japanese, I never had any problem. Maybe it was because I took the time to learn about them, their culture, and their language and not to force my own thinking and way of doing things on them? If I did force it, I doubt I would have as much business as I did or be as successful as I was. It was not always easy, but it was a success nonetheless. Whereas I succeeded, many a foreigner failed miserably.

I could've easily seen things the "Gloobey way" and I probably would be thinking as he is in thinking that the Japanese are all racist, stone-headed, and refuse to see things other than their own way. Or, I could have studied them to understand them better and find out that such was not the case although it is easy to view them that way when you don't understand the culture.

I could've easily thought the "Gloobey way" in that the Japanese do not want to sit next to me on the train because they are racists. Or, I could have studied their culture and learned that they are shy by nature, have difficulty learning foreign languages and, therefore, do want to sit next to foreigners on the train out of fear that I might speak English to them and they cannot answer. On the other hand, 98% of Japanese had no fear of sitting next to me on the train.

I could've easily thought the "Gloobey way" in thinking that the Japanese are all racist towards foreigners because I was turned down for an apartment a few times or refused entry to certain establishments in Tokyo (but not in the suburbs where I lived mind you. Never) even though that is prohibited in my own country. Or, I could've done a little studying and understood that the reason for this is based on past experience in that many a foreigner trash their apartments, are loud in palces with paper thin walls, Do not take off their shoes, and disturb the "Wa" (harmony) of their neighbors; they start fights in bars, do not pay their tabs, etc. Why should a Japanese rent me their apartment or house, or let me in their establishment based on bad experience? It is their land and their property and it should be their right whom they lease to or let in or not. Who am I to demand this because it is prohibited in my country? Hell, even the Japanese refuse to lease to other Japanese or let them in establishments based on looks, tatoos, etc. It all comes down to their own personal experience and I agree with it.

Believe me, there is both good and bad in Japan, just as there is in any country and I have seen both sides and Japan is not all "peaches and cream". In my own case, the good in Japan far, far outweighs the bad and I will list the bad in another post.

Suffice it to say, for those who have never been to Japan and desire to go and maybe live there someday, do not take Goobley's word as gospel and do not be afraid to go. You may well have a whole different experience or you may well have the same experience. It's all up to you. His views are are not rare among those foreigners who do not take the time to understand the Japanese language, culture, and way of thinking and who prefer to impose their own views on a country and culture not their own.

Just because England, Europe, and America are slowly succumbing to the views of foreigners and immigrants and relenting to the globalists (gloobalists"?) and "One World Culture" doesn't mean Japan has to. I hope Japan never succumbs, but I am a little worried.

I only left Japan, a place I truly loved, because of the rampant land speculation of the late 80's when housing prices tripled in a few short years; sold my business and moved to the US. I didn't stay and bitch about it later on although I easily could have and may well sound like Gloobly today. I moved on and he should too. Just do it and quite whining about it! However, I will return and retire there with my Japanese wife in a few short years. After all it is my "home".

[Van]

Thank you all for the deep insight.
Never thought about that. But still wanna visit Japan
and learn the culture by myself :P

[Vesperd]

Thank you for sharing your point with us Pachipro, good read.. reading this thread it hasnt swayed me from moving to Japan at all, infact i want to go there more, every country has its ups and down, Japan is unique and i like it the way it is,im going to live there with with friends and family in a few years.