Well I know I'm not in the American Matrix of Media because I don't take the news stations as the end all be all. If anything they are jumping off points for me to do my own reading about it. I usually just watch the Daily Show if I feel like getting any news usually. John seems to be more level-headed than the other "news" anchors. As long as news stations are more concerned about ratings than actual good reporting(ex. "Could something be killing you in your sleep, find out tomorrow at 11"), I have trouble taking them seriously. I am talking about mine in America(CNN, NBC, FOX, and the other main ones), not necessarily everyone else.

But being very ignorant to Asian geopolitics is so low and unprofessional.

Because the confrontational attitude towards North Korea did nothing good and it is so tiresome.

America just recently made an attempt to establish peace with Iran... why can't America do it to North Korea?

....oil?

(10 char)

Ignorant to Asian geopolitics? Where in the world did that come from?

My question still remains...what you YOU do different in this situation if you were the American president? Both S. Korea and Japan condemned the launch. Do you contradict our allies' stance?

If I remember correctly, the Iranian President said he wanted to wipe Israel off the face of the earth. BBC NEWS | World | Middle East | Iran leader's comments attacked, which would explain why we don't want them to have nukes.

Not when there's killing to be done.

Because America's current strategic focus is in the Middle East and some parts of South Asia after the Cold War... Not East Asia.

I can't think like an American... how would I know?

What would you expect from a small American "colony" in East Asia?

You don't know much about North and South Korea anyways. You don't really have a good picture about this issue.

North Korea has a high number of skilled workers willing to work in an extremely controlled environment... cheaper than Chinese workers and stricter than Chinese labor environment.
North Korea is one of the fewest countries in the world to have a very "unique" medical discipline in a national scale. It is enough to be worthy for an academic discussion.
North Korea has one of the fastest growing computer software industries in the world. (actually true)

North Korea has something... but they are not material resources.

Did anyone ask Nelson Mandela?

Obama would be asked incessantly until he gave an answer. It may not be the president's "job" but it is the job of the press to get that answer.

If you are saying the answer is for the US to invade N. Korea, well that would be a different approach. So Obama's problem is he doesn't want to enter into a third war....got it.

Focusing on cleaning up the mess the last president made and being "ignorant of Asian geopolitics" are two completely different things.

I am not sure what "thinking like an American" has to do with it. Quite the opposite. I just wanted to know what YOU would do different, but I won't ask again. I got your answer.

You don't know me, or what I know, so I am not sure why this is where you want to take this conversation. But this is how these conversations seem to always end.

Uh oh...a Mod double posted.

How is it "unique"?

As for software, when you go from 50-500 you have a 900% growth, when you go from 5000-5200 you have 4% growth. Not hard to be the "fastest growing" when you had next to nothing to start with.

I said "after the Cold War"...

Of course I don't know you. The only thing I know is your position on this specific issue.

You don't have enough information to understand this. Your lack of knowledge is very disturbing.

Besides, the only time when North and South Korea improved something in their relationship is when America is not involved in the bi-national events. Look at the previous South Korean president for instance who tried to improve this.

You don't know South Korea. How would you know North Korea? You have to know both of them.

Since the medicine practiced in North Korea is not predominantly pure western medicine.

North Korean software industry started long time ago though.

So Tenchu says we should bomb N. Korea and you say we should ignore them. Sadly, neither is a realistic option.

My position is Obama has no choice but to condemn the N. Koreans for doing missile tests that violate UN sanctions.

Again, you don't know me or what I know, so I would appreciate you ceasing to tell me what I know or what I don't know. Let's stick to the topic.

I don't know the boss of China right off hand, but has he said anything about the launch? Does China even care?

They are of the belief that N. Korea was launching a satellite. Since they are now in the UN Security Council they were able to block censure of N. Korea in this.

We are still on topic, MMM. What are you talking about?

I'll assume you have nothing to say. Just as I expected from you.

I have nothing to say? It's my fault for trying to squeeze blood from a stone. I give facts and ask legitimate questions and you insult my intelligence. I won't make that mistake again.

I wouldn't call it ignorance. You make it sound like the North Koreans have the upper hand. They don't. America knows that it can ignore North Korea pretty much for the foreseeable future. An attack on the US or Japan or SK by North Korea will spell death for the NK regime.

The confrontational attitude works for the Americans and it's allies in upholding it's interests. The same for peace with Iran. There is nothing more to this.

Obama signed the stimulus package into law. So I do not think where talking about the same thing. Even so, he only signed on to it, mainly being the democrat bill not his. Also on the this whole "director cut" idea of a bill, I don't care for what changes that happen to a bill, they better will see to it that it is in the peoples interest. They are after all our ELECTED officials. Also the package was signed into law on FEB 17, 2009. One more thing it was 1100 pages. Might I add one of the main things Obama said he would show is transparency? Meaning that We the people should of had more then 12 hours to actually look at the bill online.

The house passed an 819 billion, which got toned done to 787 billion in the senate. it's not that no one had time to read it it's the fact that they gave no time to read it, and pretty much no one in congress has read the full thing. That's a serious problem.

LMAO i thought this was funny as hell.

MMM I dont know how you do it man. I am good friends with political science professor even though its been years since iv graduated. I sat him down last night and made him read this entire thread and his face said it alone.

His only comment "I fear for the future if this is what the next generation consist of"

I'm curious as to what he fears, did he say specifically or did he give an general broad term? that said I do hope he doesn't discount others opinions. Same as to conservatism too.

Your only mistakes were having not enough information and that you have a limited perspective for looking in a "American eye view". Americans don't know naturally about South Korea and they don't want to know about South Korea. Well, I'm not surprised from an American.

I'm not the one who is ignoring you. YOU are the one who is ignoring me by having a very limited perspective as your default view on this issue.

And you're underestimating North Korea's capacity to possibly kill 1/3 of South Korean population in a flash.

We just discussed this. Harping again like before? You are not helping yourself debating.

Interest? Not democracy, I say.

Being able to do it doesn't mean they will do it. Ronin4hire was right. If they attack any country, it's the end of North Korea's regime. Kim Jong Il isn't idiot. He knows that North Korea's military power is not enough to resist to any attack from South Korea, Japan or US. It would be the end of his regime.

How do you know Kim Jong-Il knows his military is not powerful enough? There's only varieties of estimate about his military force.

If North Korea will be attacked by some country, it WILL be 1/3 of death in South Korea.

Ronin is definitely wrong.

Look both komitsuki and Ronin are right. I hate playing devils advocate because I think its cheap but its warranted this time around. But the question comes down to does Kim Jong think he can pick a fight and WIN or will the international community show ever greater patience then it has already shown. Kim Jong is not stupid by any means a fact that has kept him in power this long, and in his mind his military maybe powerful enough to accomplish the goals he sets forth. In reality could his army withstand a combined assault from American, Japanese and S Korean forces i highly doubt it. The civilian casualties on both sides would be heartbreaking.

My belief is that a conflict will not happen. It has been discussed and debated over for years with nothing happening. N. Korea loves attention and Kim Jong knows how to get the world to look his way. I believe western forces know a great deal about his military capabilities do i think the west knows them all know. No country knows every little dirty military secret another country has hidden. The negatives far out weigh the positives to N. Korea picking a fight and imo Kim Jong knows this. Which is why he uses different tactics to gain what he wants from the west. N Korea stance is like that of cobra a cobra opens the folds on its sides and rears up to look more intimidating than it really is and more often than not it works.


I told myself i was not going to get involved in this discussion because certain people are involved but i really wanted to get this out.

"solemnclockwork"its nothing you said i have read your post and i find them rational and well thought out. My professor just thought a lot of the post show immaturity,shallow and narrow views of exactly how the world and the political system works. He says he fears for the future because he thinks most youngins don't have what it takes to lead in the world. He has been a professor for 40 years taught in many countries. I trust him more than i trust anyone when it comes political and world events he has seen a lot and been through a lot. When it comes to life experience and wisdom there is no substitute.

I ask myself have we really made any progress in the past 100 years. At the end of an argument such as this it always reverts back to nationality or race because your American because your Korean because your Japanese because youre Venezuelan. As this type of thinking persist i have no hope of the world actually working together or becoming more stable in my life time.

Because even America knows that just hypothetically conducting a war against North Korea will bring America no good for security and stability in that region.

America, at least, will never wage a conflict towards North Korea in this current situation. And people like Ronin4hire don't want to know this.

- People claiming that USA, South Korea, or Japan should make a plan to take over North Korea militarily are really idiots who ignorant about this issue.

- People looking at North Korea while disrespecting South Korea's perspective are disgraceful and should be barred from discussing about North Korea.

As a South Korean, these people should never discuss about North Korea ever again.

I hate North Korea as well and these kind of people are too dangerous.

Everyone's opinion is stupid, annoying, and ignorant except for mine. Anyone who disagrees with me is an idiot and shouldn't post anymore. My country is really close to North Korea so I'm obviously an expert just as American's are experts about Canada.

Though I lived in both South Korea and USA... I too have a very good insight on America.

Two things I have issues with:

1. Having a limited view.
2. Having a warmongering view.

I didn't say I completely disagree with them... just a misleading view that will be very dangerous.

Im assuming you're not grouping all Americans into these 2 categories.

I even group a New Zealander poster there.

By the way, I never said some about disagreement directly.

Why are people so stereotypical about Americans?
Or anyone at that?

The other posters have their own opinions on the matter and they happen
to live in America and New Zealand.

Payne save yourself the headache and dont ask. Were you around when Alphaduck was a member of the forum? Think of him as Alphaduck #2 and you will have all the answers you need.

Who is alphaduck? And who are you refering to #2?

I'm just a new member. So I don't know about it.

Exactly.

(10 char)

Haha alright, thanks guys.
I think I joined just as he was banned...
I believe I joined in...June of 08.

He is JF's legend. You can somewhat be proud of it.