Give money to Haiti, not Japan.

[Ryzorian]

Ronin, The US citizens gave Haiti 1.5 billion in private donations with in the first year of the earth quake. Haiti still has no functioning government , no civil service to speak of, no real plan for recovery, a massive cholera epidemic because they haven't fixed the water...Where did all that money go?

The US citizen has given plenty to Haiti but has nothing to show for it.

The US citizen has only given 45 to 60 million in private aid to Japan thus far so your off base a little here.

[MMM]

In four days, US citizens (not government) gave 150 million to Haiti post earthquake.

In four days US citizens (not government) gave 35 million to Japan.

I think this is because people DO see Haiti as a more needy country, and over all it is. That doesn't mean that there isn't a lot of hurt and suffering in Japan, and that our help, whether it be blankets, workers, money to buy food, whatever doesn't help.

[Ronin4hire]

Originally Posted by MMM

In four days, US citizens (not government) gave 150 million to Haiti post earthquake.

In four days US citizens (not government) gave 35 million to Japan.

I think this is because people DO see Haiti as a more needy country, and over all it is. That doesn't mean that there isn't a lot of hurt and suffering in Japan, and that our help, whether it be blankets, workers, money to buy food, whatever doesn't help.

My argument is purely rational.

If that is the case then it might be a possibility that many Americans share that same rationale so I don't think I'm off base (@Ryozorian). In fact it seems you might be if we are going to use stats to give credibility to our rationale (which I don't believe in)

Also Haiti was just an example of a country that NEEDS financial assistance.

But come to think of it that's 35 million dollars that could have gone to a country that actually needed it.

[Ryzorian]

Money doesn't help country's just because they "need it". With out any viable infrastructure alot of that money just goes to gangs and pirates or corrupt officials. It never goes to actually help anyone or rebuild anything.

That's why Japan would be a better place to send it because they can utilize it efficiently without it being lost to who knows where.

[Sangetsu]

The CEO of JP Morgan has just donated $7,000,000 to help Japan, and I am donating 10% of my income for the next year to the Red Cross in Japan. Hopefully more people will do the same.

Ronin, how much money exactly have you personally donated to Haiti? I spent nearly 6 months there immunizing children and helping to set up clean water and sanitation facilities. Of course within months the equipment was stolen, so the effort and expense was meaningless.

Ronin, instead of telling us what we should do, tell us what you in fact have done. If you've nothing (which I strongly suspect), then you should shut up. People who don't follow their own advice have no right to give it. If you have donated money to Haiti, then I'll apologize.

[Ronin4hire]

lol Sangetsu... You want to get into a dick measuring contest over how much we've given?

You win...

I gave to the Red Cross when Haiti hit (can't remember how much).

I'm also a regular donater to UNICEF.

What's your point though?

[Ronin4hire]

Originally Posted by Ryzorian

Money doesn't help country's just because they "need it". With out any viable infrastructure alot of that money just goes to gangs and pirates or corrupt officials. It never goes to actually help anyone or rebuild anything.

That's why Japan would be a better place to send it because they can utilize it efficiently without it being lost to who knows where.

That's a whole other discussion.

[MMM]

Originally Posted by Ronin4hire

My argument is purely rational.

If that is the case then it might be a possibility that many Americans share that same rationale so I don't think I'm off base (@Ryozorian). In fact it seems you might be if we are going to use stats to give credibility to our rationale (which I don't believe in)

Also Haiti was just an example of a country that NEEDS financial assistance.

But come to think of it that's 35 million dollars that could have gone to a country that actually needed it.

You are very good at pushing people away from agreeing with you. I have seen it happen on this thread alone. How many times have you felt the need to say your argument is purely rational.

I understand the rationality of helping Haiti. No one would disagree. However, Haiti doesn't need financial assistance. It needs ORGANIZED and TRUSTWORTHY financial assistance. With the money the world has put into Haiti, they should be living large. They aren't. You have the problem of diminishing returns. Is it better to put money in a safe, or a furnace. Maybe the furnace needs it more, but what is the furnace going to do with it?

Regardless of Haiti's needs, your argument that Japan "doesn't need the money" falls flat, as ANY country that experiences a disaster requires money to get rescue and relief efforts on the move. You still don't seem able to accept that much of that money doesn't go into the pockets of people without homes, but goes into buying food, water, supplies, airplane fuel, etc. to get relief workers from all over the world into the disaster zone. I am repeating arguments that you don't seem to want to respond to, so I am stopping here.

[MMM]

Originally Posted by Ronin4hire

That's a whole other discussion.

Not really. Haiti needs money LESS than Japan because the % of that money being used to help people in need is reduced. Send the money to Japan and the relief workers to Haiti makes more sense. Not the other way around.

[Sangetsu]

Originally Posted by Ronin4hire

My argument is purely rational.

If that is the case then it might be a possibility that many Americans share that same rationale so I don't think I'm off base (@Ryozorian). In fact it seems you might be if we are going to use stats to give credibility to our rationale (which I don't believe in)

Also Haiti was just an example of a country that NEEDS financial assistance.

But come to think of it that's 35 million dollars that could have gone to a country that actually needed it.

Haiti does not need financial assistance. Haiti is a tropical country with a year- round growing season, and it is populated by people who ave the physical ability to grow and build if they set their minds to it. Haiti could be as much a tropical paradise as other Caribean islands, a destination for tourists and nature lovers.

Instead, Haiti's fantastic level of corruption has made the island a wasteland. The people are largely illiterate, there is no industry, nearly no police, no public works worthy of the name, and running a business is next to impossible as gangs or corrupt officials steal most of what you make, and if there is anything left over after they take their cut, you are likely to be murdered in the street for what's left.

Haitian tradition say that the leaders of the rebellion that killed the slave owners and gave Haiti to the slaves made a deal with Satan to insure their victory. And with Satan being what he is, he gave them their victory, but at the cost of Haiti always being a living hell.