Pronunciation of 'g' sound in Japanese

[chryuop]

Originally Posted by Lucas89

If i'm having a hard time finding something to listen to i always go to www.fnn-news.com: and listen to the news on there, just hit the play all button and away you go

There is a bunch of programs around to watch television on your PC for free. You won't have problems to see Chinese channels (the net is full of those), but even Japanese ones are numerous. I find the best one to watch Japanese TV is KeyHoleTV, but even TvuPlayer is very good.
All free programs mind, don't get scammed and go pay for them.

[Nagoyankee]

Originally Posted by sushidushi

I am just beginning to try to learn some Japanese. I have looked at various books, some of which suggest that the 'g' in Japanese is always pronounced like the hard 'g' in the English word 'egg', but others seem to contradict that and say that, in the middle of words (as in, well, tamago) it is more like 'ng' in the English word 'long'.

Is it a regional thing, perhaps? Or does it depend on where in a word the 'g' appears? Or, perhaps, as I suspect, rather more complicated than either of those...?

Throw away the books that tell you that G is always pronounced the same. Keep the good ones that say there are two G sounds in Japanese.

It has little to do regions but it has to do much more with education and upbringing. I remember during the first grade, our lady teacher kept telling us to differenciate one from the other. This was in Nagoya, between Tokyo and Osaka. Currently I live in Tokyo where I still hear two G sounds from most people.

Now, I need to point out the fact that no one should practice the consonant G by itself in Japanese. You will never get to use it alone because it never appears at the end of a syllable or word. Whenever practicing Japanese pronunciation, think everything in terms of syllables. In other words, think in kana, and not in each vowel and consonant. What I'm saying here may not make sense to English-speakers right now, but it's of utmost importance.　

Consider the following sentences/words. Syllables in red = hard G. Syllables in green = soft G

学生がふたり走って行きました。＝　がくせいがふたりはしっていきました。
= Gakusei ga hutari hashitte ikimashita.　

Particle が will ALWAYS be pronounced softly. No exceptions here. Use the hard G and you will irritate many Japanese ears.

学生（がくせい）、学校（がっこう）、外国人（がいこ くじん）、ガンダム、ガス、ごま, etc.
All these words start with がぎぐげご. Use the hard G. Don't just read. Read out loud or you will waste your time.

優雅（ゆうが）、以外（いがい）、天国（てんごく）、 地獄（じごく）、サイゴン、フォルクスワーゲン, etc.
がぎぐげご appears in non-word-starting syllables. Use the soft G.

[MMM]

I'll be honest, I have never heard of this different sounds for が business. I have taught Japanese from 3 different textbooks and have never seen anything saying anything of the sort.

Just to be sure, I spoke to a Japanese friend before posting this, and she said the two が sounds in 学生がふたり走って行きました。would be exactly the same sound. I don't know if it is a regional thing (I lived in Kansai, and she is from Kansai as well) so if that makes a difference, then that explains my confusion.

I would live to see a YouTube video showing an example of the different が sounds.

Now if you are talking when people are in conversation and shorten words or skim over sounds, I can imagine that (like saying "gimme" instead of "give me" in English), but you have me stumped so far.

[Nagoyankee]

Originally Posted by MMM

I'll be honest, I have never heard of this different sounds for が business. I have taught Japanese from 3 different textbooks and have never seen anything saying anything of the sort.

Just to be sure, I spoke to a Japanese friend before posting this, and she said the two が sounds in 学生がふたり走って行きました。would be exactly the same sound. I don't know if it is a regional thing (I lived in Kansai, and she is from Kansai as well) so if that makes a difference, then that explains my confusion.

I would live to see a YouTube video showing an example of the different が sounds.

Now if you are talking when people are in conversation and shorten words or skim over sounds, I can imagine that (like saying "gimme" instead of "give me" in English), but you have me stumped so far.

Weird. This is something I was actually taught in school and taught by my parents. Naturally, I taught my own son the same as well. More importantly, the two different G sounds are something I hear on a daily basis. I mean, as you know we can't say anything without using the particle が.

I'll be looking for a Youtube video, too.

[MMM]

Nagoyankee, I looked over your word list, and I suppose I can hear a slightly softer tone in words like 以外 or サイゴン, but I have never heard anything close to an N or M sound associated with が sounds.

I looked on YouTube, but didn't see anything, but that doesn't mean there isn't something there.

You learn something new every day...

[Nagoyankee]

Originally Posted by MMM

Nagoyankee, I looked over your word list, and I suppose I can hear a slightly softer tone in words like 以外 or サイゴン, but I have never heard anything close to an N or M sound associated with が sounds.

I looked on YouTube, but didn't see anything, but that doesn't mean there isn't something there.

You learn something new every day...

Well, it wasn't me who said it was close to an N or M sound. I used my own vague term "soft G". In Japanese, it's called 鼻濁音（びだくおん）. 　When we explain this sound to small kids, we use a pharse like 「強く’が’と言わないで、鼻から音を抜くような感じ で柔らかく言いなさい。」. So it's like a nasal "nga".

I'm watching the 2 o'clock news on Fuji TV now and I do hear two G sounds very clearly probably because it's a professional announcer reading the news. So maybe it's regional as you said. I'll be listening carefully when I watch some Kansai comedians tonight.

[MMM]

Thanks Nagoyankee! I'll ask about 鼻濁音.

[MMM]

鼻濁音 - Wikipedia

According to Wikipedia this never made it to West Japan, and is mainly a Tokyo and north thing. It isn't taught in typical schools, but is taught to those focused on broadcast (TV and radio announcers) but overall as a language phenomenon it is fading out.

Thanks for the new vocabulary...now to watch some Tokyo news to see if I can catch it!

[Nyororin]

It`s totally normal in Nagoya... ですが uses the softer ng-ish sound in a very pronounced way. Saying it hard would just sound weird. Two sounds definitely exist, and although they might not be "officially" taught I can`t imagine someone using the wrong one.

ETA; Looking at and reading the examples that Nagoyankee posted, they`re all very clear but it is really hard to put down in text. It`s like you go to make a g sound but never let your tongue touch as it would in a hard g.

[Nagoyankee]

Found an interesting YouTube video. It's all in Japanese but it should illustrate the point to the OP and everyone else.
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