Learning Japanese!

[JustinRossTso]

How should I learn Japanese? I can't find that many classes around... but there are private teachers that teach for like 20$ and hour, or I could try and see if there are classes for Japanese next year in College/University.

Learning from the computer isn't quite... comprehensive ;/. You can't talk to the computer either.

I want to learn about the culture and customs... and like the idioms and sayings too.

Suggestions anyone?

[KyleGoetz]

Originally Posted by JustinRossTso

How should I learn Japanese? I can't find that many classes around... but there are private teachers that teach for like 20$ and hour, or I could try and see if there are classes for Japanese next year in College/University.

Learning from the computer isn't quite... comprehensive ;/. You can't talk to the computer either.

I want to learn about the culture and customs... and like the idioms and sayings too.

Suggestions anyone?

Learn everything on Tae Kim's website. Once you've done that, come back and ask what's next. You'll be done in a year or two.

[JustinRossTso]

Originally Posted by KyleGoetz

Learn everything on Tae Kim's website. Once you've done that, come back and ask what's next. You'll be done in a year or two.

Oh, okay! Thanks, I didn't check it out yet!

[KyleGoetz]

Originally Posted by JustinRossTso

Oh, okay! Thanks, I didn't check it out yet!

It's the resource I trust most on the Internet to teach Japanese. There are better books.

And Tae Kim's site has some non-native sounding sentences and grammatical errors. But you're nowhere near the point where any mistakes on the site will really hurt you as a learner.

The point is that the site will teach you the structures you need to learn in your first two years as a student. From there you can move on to other resources.

While studying Tae Kim, you should be learning kanji at a rate of at least 10 kanji per week. If you do this, you'll know 2000 kanji in two years and have learned everything on his site.

At that point, just start reading articles and asking questions.

(This post, of course, ignores how you should learn to speak and listen.)

[JustinRossTso]

Originally Posted by KyleGoetz

It's the resource I trust most on the Internet to teach Japanese. There are better books.

And Tae Kim's site has some non-native sounding sentences and grammatical errors. But you're nowhere near the point where any mistakes on the site will really hurt you as a learner.

The point is that the site will teach you the structures you need to learn in your first two years as a student. From there you can move on to other resources.

While studying Tae Kim, you should be learning kanji at a rate of at least 10 kanji per week. If you do this, you'll know 2000 kanji in two years and have learned everything on his site.

At that point, just start reading articles and asking questions.

(This post, of course, ignores how you should learn to speak and listen.)

Thank you. I guess that's a starting point I can take. I actually can't find any Japanese teachers here that are close enough, so I'll have to do with what I have.

[jesselt]

I'm highly skeptical about the claim that someone could know 2000 Kanji after two years of study. Unless this person is a hermit, people probably don't have enough time to learn 10 new Kanji per week while also reviewing all the old ones they've learned.

Maybe our definitions of "know" are just different. I don't know a Kanji unless I can write it from memory and read it in any (or at least most) compounds.

[MuRaSaKiiNkI]

I agree with Jess, Japanese is tough even in a personal classroom with hands-on teaching. It's not something you can learn perfectly in two years, or even a lifetime. For instance, even my Tokyo-born Japanese teacher still has to use her Kanji dictionary, and she speaks fluent Japanese.

If there are no classes around you, you can start online. However, if you are in college now, perhaps you can study abroad in Japan? Or student exchange? Japan is also seeking English teachers. Or, you can post on the language exchange forum on here, and ask someone to Skype with you about learning Japanese.

I personally believe personal face-to-face teaching is the best way to go, if everyone could learn languages on the computer, there would be no need for translators. Ideal situation is to study in Japan for a few months, or a year, or live there, and completely immerse yourself in the language and culture.

Most importantly, treat Japanese with respect, because it's difficult and you will make mistakes. People who don't treat it seriously talk like gaijins and embarrass those who study hard and learn to pronounce things. Other than that, if you can try to go to Japan, or seek out a Japanese-born native speaker, then you should do fine. Ja ne~

[KyleGoetz]

Originally Posted by jesselt

I'm highly skeptical about the claim that someone could know 2000 Kanji after two years of study. Unless this person is a hermit, people probably don't have enough time to learn 10 new Kanji per week while also reviewing all the old ones they've learned.

Maybe our definitions of "know" are just different. I don't know a Kanji unless I can write it from memory and read it in any (or at least most) compounds.

The reason you think it's hard is because you've never encountered anyone disciplined enough to do 10 kanji week in and week out. It's not really that hard. I was doing 20 per week with about an hour of weekly study when in college.

I just didn't have the discipline to stick with it. I still don't, which is why I'm sitting at about 1600 right now instead of 2000. While I can pick up practically anything written for an average person and read it for meaning and pronunciation with about 80%ish understanding (save for some grammar structures I don't understand), I'd still like to hit that 100% joyo kanji mark.

In about a month or so, I'm going to start up again, and just try to do 100 a month or so. I sadly don't have the discipline to keep up with more than that.

To take another tactic, are you seriously suggesting it is impossible for someone to learn approximately one kanji per day? Because 10/week is approximately 1/day. Technically more like 1.4, but still, if you put it that way, it sounds ridiculously easy. Even two per day sounds really easy.

And the more you review a kanji, the less frequently you have to review them. Check up on "spaced learning repetition." After getting a flashcard with a kanji correct about four or so times, you don't have to look at it again for about 6 months or so.

[MuRaSaKiiNkI]

Originally Posted by KyleGoetz

The reason you think it's hard is because you've never encountered anyone disciplined enough to do 10 kanji week in and week out. It's not really that hard. I was doing 20 per week with about an hour of weekly study when in college.

I just didn't have the discipline to stick with it.

I think that's what we're trying to say, is that you have to be serious about the language to succeed. Not many people are disciplined enough to study kanji every day, or, like me, they don't have time. So yeah, it's possible, but not probable. I don't like giving false hope.

[JustinRossTso]

Originally Posted by MuRaSaKiiNkI

I agree with Jess, Japanese is tough even in a personal classroom with hands-on teaching. It's not something you can learn perfectly in two years, or even a lifetime. For instance, even my Tokyo-born Japanese teacher still has to use her Kanji dictionary, and she speaks fluent Japanese.

If there are no classes around you, you can start online. However, if you are in college now, perhaps you can study abroad in Japan? Or student exchange? Japan is also seeking English teachers. Or, you can post on the language exchange forum on here, and ask someone to Skype with you about learning Japanese.

I personally believe personal face-to-face teaching is the best way to go, if everyone could learn languages on the computer, there would be no need for translators. Ideal situation is to study in Japan for a few months, or a year, or live there, and completely immerse yourself in the language and culture.

Most importantly, treat Japanese with respect, because it's difficult and you will make mistakes. People who don't treat it seriously talk like gaijins and embarrass those who study hard and learn to pronounce things. Other than that, if you can try to go to Japan, or seek out a Japanese-born native speaker, then you should do fine. Ja ne~

This actually sounds like a viable option... I'm in College next year, it's going to be a music program though... so I'm not sure how flexible they are for an exchange program. I plan to go to Japan after College though... that's why I'm trying to get a head start in learning it. Should I just wait until I'm done with College then learn it?

Hmm... I wonder how hard it is to study abroad... I don't think I have the correct courses to do so.

I personally favour face-to-face teaching though.

Unfortunately... even though I am Chinese, I have no experience with writing, so I have no advantage in learning Japanese.

I'm not sure how disciplined I am... so I'm not sure if I'm likely to succeed 10 Kanjis a day. I have about 4 and a half years to learn it to a good level.

I might plan to stay in Japan if I like it there (or if I find a band). There is a Japanese proficiency test no? How fluent would you think you'd have to be with Japanese to pass it?