Who's Your Hero?

[Quailboy]

Originally Posted by alanX

Another thread that has nothing to do with Japan at all?

Sounds like you need a new forum...

[Salvanas]

Originally Posted by Quailboy

Sounds like you need a new forum...

No he doesn't. This is a forum about Japan.

However, Alan, General Discussion is about everything. Not only Japan.

Introduce yourself and talk about anything you want here, Japanese-related or not.

[iPhantom]

Originally Posted by alanX

Another thread that has nothing to do with Japan at all?

This forum would be so inactive if we removed non-Japanese threads.

[Tenchu]

I think the point here is most of us were drawn to this forum because of an interest in Japan (for me, it's Samurai, martial arts, computer games, Saaya Irie), so we all have something in common. But, us people with something in common, will naturally talk about anything.

[Tenchu]

Originally Posted by Salvanas

Let me find a clipping from Wikipedia.

However, Saladin's relationship with Richard was one of chivalrous mutual respect as well as military rivalry. When Richard became ill with fever, Saladin offered the services of his personal physician. Saladin also sent him fresh fruit with snow, to chill the drink, as treatment. At Arsuf, when Richard lost his horse, Saladin sent him two replacements.

From wiki, about Raynald de Châtillon (another man who pops up in Saladin stories.

In 1187 Saladin invaded the kingdom, defeating the Crusaders at the Battle of Hattin. The battle left Saladin with many prisoners. Most prominent among these prisoners were Raynald and King Guy, both of whom Saladin ordered brought to his tent. The chronicler Imad ad-Din al-Isfahani, who was present at the scene, relates:

“ Saladin invited the king [Guy] to sit beside him, and when Arnat [Raynald] entered in his turn, he seated him next to his king and reminded him of his misdeeds. "How many times have you sworn an oath and violated it? How many times have you signed agreements you have never respected?" Raynald answered through a translator: "Kings have always acted thus. I did nothing more." During this time King Guy was gasping with thirst, his head dangling as though drunk, his face betraying great fright. Saladin spoke reassuring words to him, had cold water brought, and offered it to him. The king drank, then handed what remained to Raynald, who slaked his thirst in turn. The sultan then said to Guy: "You did not ask permission before giving him water. I am therefore not obliged to grant him mercy." After pronouncing these words, the sultan smiled, mounted his horse, and rode off, leaving the captives in terror. He supervised the return of the troops, and then came back to his tent. He ordered Raynald brought there, then advanced before him, sword in hand, and struck him between the neck and the shoulder-blade. When Raynald fell, he cut off his head and dragged the body by its feet to the king, who began to tremble. Seeing him thus upset, Saladin said to him in a reassuring tone: "This man was killed only because of his maleficence and perfidy". ”

King Guy was spared and was taken to Damascus for a time, then allowed to go free.

To a few Christians of his time, Raynald was considered a martyr killed at the hands of the Muslims. However, documentary evidence tends to refute this idealized picture, giving the impression of Reynald as a freebooter and pirate who had little concern for the welfare of the Kingdom of Jerusalem. It could be argued that the successes of the Kingdom were undone in large measure by Raynald's recklessness, which had the effect of provoking needlessly the Muslim states surrounding Outremer.


Saladin's actions ultimately proved to be beneficial to his own interests. By killing Raynald while sparing Guy, the faction struggle in Jerusalem continued. This struggle would later greatly diminish the potency of the Third Crusade.

Raynald of Châtillon - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

[Salvanas]

Originally Posted by Tenchu

From wiki, about Raynald de Châtillon (another man who pops up in Saladin stories.

In 1187 Saladin invaded the kingdom, defeating the Crusaders at the Battle of Hattin. The battle left Saladin with many prisoners. Most prominent among these prisoners were Raynald and King Guy, both of whom Saladin ordered brought to his tent. The chronicler Imad ad-Din al-Isfahani, who was present at the scene, relates:

“ Saladin invited the king [Guy] to sit beside him, and when Arnat [Raynald] entered in his turn, he seated him next to his king and reminded him of his misdeeds. "How many times have you sworn an oath and violated it? How many times have you signed agreements you have never respected?" Raynald answered through a translator: "Kings have always acted thus. I did nothing more." During this time King Guy was gasping with thirst, his head dangling as though drunk, his face betraying great fright. Saladin spoke reassuring words to him, had cold water brought, and offered it to him. The king drank, then handed what remained to Raynald, who slaked his thirst in turn. The sultan then said to Guy: "You did not ask permission before giving him water. I am therefore not obliged to grant him mercy." After pronouncing these words, the sultan smiled, mounted his horse, and rode off, leaving the captives in terror. He supervised the return of the troops, and then came back to his tent. He ordered Raynald brought there, then advanced before him, sword in hand, and struck him between the neck and the shoulder-blade. When Raynald fell, he cut off his head and dragged the body by its feet to the king, who began to tremble. Seeing him thus upset, Saladin said to him in a reassuring tone: "This man was killed only because of his maleficence and perfidy". ”

King Guy was spared and was taken to Damascus for a time, then allowed to go free.

To a few Christians of his time, Raynald was considered a martyr killed at the hands of the Muslims. However, documentary evidence tends to refute this idealized picture, giving the impression of Reynald as a freebooter and pirate who had little concern for the welfare of the Kingdom of Jerusalem. It could be argued that the successes of the Kingdom were undone in large measure by Raynald's recklessness, which had the effect of provoking needlessly the Muslim states surrounding Outremer.


Saladin's actions ultimately proved to be beneficial to his own interests. By killing Raynald while sparing Guy, the faction struggle in Jerusalem continued. This struggle would later greatly diminish the potency of the Third Crusade.

Raynald of Châtillon - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Aye I know of that , and I find what Saladin to be true, and good. Because, if my memory is not mistaken me, Raynald was the one who plundered merchant wagons even WHEN there was a truce between Saladin and the the Crusaders. Thus breaking it.

Not only that, he also sent ships that pillaged Islamic villages along the shoreline.

Raynald had it coming. I can understand war. But when there is a truce, and you break it, you'll have to live with the repercussions.

Also, for another hero, Hitler. What he did was evil in my eyes, (I'm saying mine, because evil and good are simply opinions) however, he was a genius. And if I could go back in time to spend time with ONE person in anytime in history, it'd either be Hitler, or Confucius.

Then again. I'd like to spend time with all heroes in history.

[Sinestra]

Originally Posted by komitsuki

Seriously. You really want to respect bunch of students for starting a huge social destruction, that China still can't handle due to its socio-cultural reasons? As a proud descendant of a minority in "Communist China" (one of fifty-six represented people) who still respect the CCP, this is a huge insult.

So let me get this straight because of whatever hang up you have and your personal views (which seems to over shadow every damn topic ever posted) your insulted by this persons CHOICE in a hero when he has ever right to choose someone as you do to hate them.? His opinion of choice is not wrong because you deem it so. Who are you to say who anyone choses as a hero? obviously this poster felt strongly about what this person did and it touched him and shaped his life accordingly. Out of all the comments you have ever made this one pissed me off so much i had to fuc**** punch something

[Quailboy]

Originally Posted by Tenchu

I think the point here is most of us were drawn to this forum because of an interest in Japan (for me, it's Samurai, martial arts, computer games, Saaya Irie), so we all have something in common. But, us people with something in common, will naturally talk about anything.

You need to get over that one. xD

But yes, you are absolutely correct.

[Tenchu]

Originally Posted by Salvanas

Also, for another hero, Hitler. What he did was evil in my eyes, (I'm saying mine, because evil and good are simply opinions) however, he was a genius. And if I could go back in time to spend time with ONE person in anytime in history, it'd either be Hitler, or Confucius.

Then again. I'd like to spend time with all heroes in history.

Going back in time to spend time with someone. Interesting thought.

I'd like to be taught lessons by Musashi, drink Thai beer with Genghis Khan, discuss virtue with Richard the Lionhearted (he already was one of my idols), and yes, who could resist, have supper with Hitler...

[bELyVIS]

My wife's family has many men who Japan considers heros, but one stands out above the rest, Maeda, Toshiie.

Maeda (means in front of the rice field), Toshiie (前田利家?, January 15, 1539 - April 27, 1599) was one of the leading generals of Oda Nobunaga. The highest rank from the court that he received is the Great Counselor Dainagon (大納言).
Toshiie served Oda Nobunaga from childhood and his loyalty was rewarded by being allowed to be the head of the Maeda clan. He was a friend to Toyotomi Hideyoshi in their childhood.
He was a member of the akahoro-shū (赤母衣衆), the unit under Oda Nobunaga's personal command. He also was a lifelong rival of Tokugawa Ieyasu. He was eventually granted a han (land grant) in Noto and Kaga Provinces. It was a highly productive province which would eventually develop into the wealthiest in Edo period Japan, with a net worth of 1 million koku (百万石).
He was in many battles. One of his most famous victory's was at the Battle of Suemori Castle.
Before dying, Hideyoshi named Toshiie to the council of Five Elders to support Toyotomi Hideyori until he was old enough to take control on his own, but he died a year later of natural causes. He is buried on Mt. Koya near Osaka.
Toshiie and his wife, Matsu had a number of children. Their sons, Toshinaga, Toshimasa, Toshitsune, Toshitaka, and Toshitoyo all became daimyo.

Maeda Toshiie - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia