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03-31-2010, 05:07 PM

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Originally Posted by pacerier View Post

regarding はず, will it sound weird if we add きっと in front as such: きっとボブは勉強してばかりいる to mean "Both is surely supposed to go" and "I'm very sure Bob will go"?
The latter is correct. But where did you get the verb "go"?
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04-01-2010, 12:12 PM

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It's an exceptional circumstance when contrasting options, I think. The past form + 方がいい is a set phrase that you do not change.

Hou ga ii - Japanese Forum
Japanese Verbs - Lesson 73
just to check, is it true that when the sentence with "方がいい" comes as a question, we will use the present tense (e.g. 行く方がいいの for "is it better to go?"). And when its not a question, we use the past tense (e.g. 行った方がいい for "its better to go.")?

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The latter is correct. But where did you get the verb "go"?
ops, its a "きっとボブは行くはずです" lol


anyways, when the dictionary does not list nouns like 答え as (~する verb), can we “invent” our own e.g. 答えする, or is it allowed only because its a contracted form of 答えをする?



Regarding the ながら conjugation, is it true that the agent of the [v]ながら and the agent of the action in the main clause must strictly be the same person? e.g. is this incorrect: 山田さんは遊びながら、父は働きます.

Also, can the [v]ながら be negative to mean something like “while I am not [v]ing..”, if so how would the conjugation go? (i was thinking 遊びないながら sounds a bit weird)


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04-01-2010, 12:44 PM

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Originally Posted by pacerier View Post
just to check, is it true that when the sentence with "方がいい" comes as a question, we will use the present tense (e.g. 行く方がいいの for "is it better to go?"). And when its not a question, we use the past tense (e.g. 行った方がいい for "its better to go.")?
No. It doesn't matter if it's used in a statement or question. Think of it as the hypothetical past tense. It will make you sound better than when you use the present tense.

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anyways, when the dictionary does not list nouns like 答え as (~する verb), can we “invent” our own e.g. 答えする, or is it allowed only because its a contracted form of 答えをする?
Doesn't your dictionary have 答える? I highly doubt it. You're being too creative here. 答えする just sounds aweful. You can say 回答する as well. = かいとうする

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Regarding the ながら conjugation, is it true that the agent of the [v]ながら and the agent of the action in the main clause must strictly be the same person? e.g. is this incorrect: 山田さんは遊びながら、父は働きます.
It's true (and your sentence is incorrect). You're being way too playful today. This is about one person doing two things simultaneously.

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Also, can the [v]ながら be negative to mean something like “while I am not [v]ing..”, if so how would the conjugation go? (i was thinking 遊びないながら sounds a bit weird)
OMG You're too much for me. You cannot put a negative verb in front of it. But you can, following it.

"Don't do A while doing B."

Translate these for me.
ご飯を食べながら遊ばないでね。
日本語を勉強しながら変なビデオを見ないでください!
ピザを食べながらしゃべるな!
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04-02-2010, 02:17 PM

thanks for the replies, just one more question regarding 方がいい, is it even common to hear (or will we ever be hearing) [V-dictionary form]方がいい ?

Quote:
ご飯を食べながら遊ばないでね。
日本語を勉強しながら変なビデオを見ないでください!
ピザを食べながらしゃべるな!
are these ok:
while eating rice, don't play
while studying japanese, don't watch strange videos
while eating pizza, don't talk

Also, what’s the difference between すでに and もう, does these mean the same thing (and have the same naunce):
(1a) ボブはすでに出かけた
(1b) ボブはもう出かけた
(2a) もう仕事を終えた
(2b) すでに仕事を終えた


and, if 分かっている already means “I already know”, is it true that no one says もう分かっている or is it fine to include もう to emphasis the “already”.


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Last edited by pacerier : 04-02-2010 at 02:27 PM.
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04-02-2010, 02:31 PM

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Originally Posted by pacerier View Post
thanks for the replies, just one more question regarding 方がいい, is it even common to hear (or will we ever be hearing) [V-dictionary form]方がいい ?
Can't say it's common but you will hear it.

Quote:
are these ok:
while eating rice, don't play
while studying japanese, don't watch strange videos
while eating pizza, don't talk
ご飯 in my sentence means "a meal" rather than "rice". The rest is fine.

Quote:
Also, what’s the difference between すでに and もう, does these mean the same thing (and have the same naunce):
(1a) ボブはすでに出かけた
(1b) ボブはもう出かけた
(2a) もう仕事を終えた
(2b) すでに仕事を終えた
Meaning is the same. すでに is just a maturer word choice than もう.
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04-02-2010, 02:33 PM

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Originally Posted by pacerier View Post
and, if 分かっている already means “I already know”, is it true that no one says もう分かっている or is it fine to include もう to emphasis the “already”.
You will often hear us say もう分かっている. You say it when someone has been telling you the same thing over and over.
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04-03-2010, 03:47 PM

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Can't say it's common but you will hear it.
cool, is it ok to assume that every instance of "[v-plain]方がいい" can be replaced with "[v-た]方がいい"?

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ご飯 in my sentence means "a meal" rather than "rice". The rest is fine.
oh, ok i'll keep that in mind.

Is it true that そればかりか can never stand by itself as a sentence, but other than that it is the same as それだけじゃない? e.g. will these be equal:
(1)そればかりか、ボブも優しいですね。
(2)それだけじゃない。ボブも優しいですね。


also, i've noticed that some intransitive verbs cannot be used as a command/request whereas some may, e.g.速く決まってください cannot be a substitute for 速く決めてください, yet we are allowed say 速く走ってください.
Is there some kind of rule to decide when intransitive verbs could not take the command/request form, or is it case by case?


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04-03-2010, 04:29 PM

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Originally Posted by pacerier View Post
cool, is it ok to assume that every instance of "[v-plain]方がいい" can be replaced with "[v-た]方がいい"?
I would say that it is. Can't think of an exception.

Quote:
Is it true that そればかりか can never stand by itself as a sentence, but other than that it is the same as それだけじゃない? e.g. will these be equal:
(1)そればかりか、ボブも優しいですね。
(2)それだけじゃない。ボブも優しいですね。
It's true. But your sentences don't show that you understand the meaning of either of the two phrases in question.

ボブも優しい can only mean that someone else is 優しい and Bob, too, is 優しい. I just can't tell from your sentences that you know this.

To me, you seem to have wanted to say that Bob has another quality besides being 優しい. If that's the case, your sentnecs are both incorrect.

Quote:
also, i've noticed that some intransitive verbs cannot be used as a command/request whereas some may, e.g.速く決まってください cannot be a substitute for 速く決めてください, yet we are allowed say 速く走ってください.
Is there some kind of rule to decide when intransitive verbs could not take the command/request form, or is it case by case?
I may just be too intoxicated but I have no idea what you're talking about.

One may say 早く決まってください, but this isn't directed at a person. You are praying for quick decision-making. You could call it a command/request to God.

Hope you're not reading another mediocre grammar book that tells you that transitive and intransitive verbs each have distinct qualities in Japanese as in another language. Truth is Japanese kids don't even know the words 自動詞 and 他動詞 until they learn about them in English in junior high.
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04-05-2010, 02:56 AM

i came across some text trying to distinguish the difference between "[v-plain]方がいい" and "[v-た]方がいい". well actually i've realised that some of these explanations do not reflect on the actual usage of the words/phrases so i will put it here for you to judge. It says if the event had not happened yet, we will use [v-plain]方がいい and if the event had already occured, we will use [v-た]方がいい. so if i'm at home and i want to go somewhere, i will say バスで行く方がいい but if i had already made my trip there, i will say バスで行った方がいい. does it make sense, or is it better to use バスで行く方がいい for both cases?

Quote:
To me, you seem to have wanted to say that Bob has another quality besides being 優しい.
yep, that was what i was trying to say. how should the sentence be corrected to mean that other than having other qualities, "Bob is also kind too"

Quote:
Truth is Japanese kids don't even know the words 自動詞 and 他動詞 until they learn about them in English in junior high.
lol me too, i wasn't aware of what's a transitive/intransitive verb till i started studying japanese

anyways, I was wondering if this sentence is valid: 先生がこれを学生にくれる。Because from what i know, くれる can only be used when something is given to me or my family member, or are there exceptions to this rule?


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Last edited by pacerier : 04-05-2010 at 03:00 AM.
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04-05-2010, 03:30 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by pacerier View Post
It says if the event had not happened yet, we will use [v-plain]方がいい and if the event had already occured, we will use [v-た]方がいい. so if i'm at home and i want to go somewhere, i will say バスで行く方がいい but if i had already made my trip there, i will say バスで行った方がいい. does it make sense, or is it better to use バスで行く方がいい for both cases?
Makes 0% sense to me. Z-E-R-O. Even a wino like me could write a better grammar/phrase book.

It isn't as if there were a "difference" in meaning between the two. It's just that 行った方がいい sounds better and softer in the native ear. Have I not said "hypothetical past tense", multiple times here?

Quote:
yep, that was what i was trying to say. how should the sentence be corrected to mean that other than having other qualities, "Bob is also kind too"
「ボブは優しさ持ち合わせている。」
「ボブは優しい人である。」

Learn the position of も correctly NOW or you will be making the same mistake over and over. This mistake is very common among Japanese-learners.

ボブ~~ = Bob, as well as Mary and John, is ~~.

ボブは~~ = Bob is tall, handsome, rich, and even ~~, too.

Quote:
anyways, I was wondering if this sentence is valid: 先生がこれを学生にくれる。Because from what i know, くれる can only be used when something is given to me or my family member, or are there exceptions to this rule?
先生がこれを学生にくれる。 is grammatically correct but it sure lacks the due respect for the teacher.
Use 下さる instead of くれる.
IMPORTANT: You can say this only if you're one of his/her students.
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